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  1. 13 Aug '09 19:52 / 1 edit
    I have just resigned Game 6521084 against a very strong player (relative to me).

    I clearly made a blunder with move 21. ..Kh8 which resulted in 22. Qf6+ and winning the rook.

    If I moved 21. ..Kf8, could I have had good chances of a draw?



    Any other analysis earlier in the game would be appreciated.

    EDIT: Oh yes, black is playing up the board in this diagram, which I am sure you would have figured.
  2. 13 Aug '09 22:59
    I don't have much experience with the sicilian, but are you sure the bishop belonged on g7 in that line?

    it looks like you might have tried to castle queenside or try to keep your king in the middle and go for a kingside attack with Rg8 or something. see the kramnik-anand games in the last world championship match.

    I think that 14...Bxc3 was a BIG mistake. first of all, your only plus in the position that could maybe neutralize your kingside mess was that you had the bishop pair. it only made your kingside weaker with the queens on. if the queens were off the board, 14...Bxf3 and 15...Bxc3 could make black even better in the position. but in the real game, as you've witnessed, it just made it very easy for white to take advantage of your kingside weakness.

    and about 14...Bxf3. why develop your opponent's pieces? it just gave white time to bring the queen closer to your kingside.

    by the way, after move 21, you did have drawing chances with 21...Kf8, but that's because white blundered and played 20.Rxe8?.

    20.Qg4+ Kf8 21.Qd4 would win the rook (by threatening mate in one).

    hope this helps
  3. Standard member SwissGambit
    Caninus Interruptus
    13 Aug '09 23:42
    Originally posted by lausey
    If I moved 21. ..Kf8, could I have had good chances of a draw?
    Hmm, good question. What do you play against 22.Qd2 and 23.Re1?
  4. 14 Aug '09 00:37
    If 21.....Kf8, 22. Qf6 threatening Qxc3 and Qh8+ is very strong. For example, 22.....Rc5 23. Qa8+ Ke7 24. Re1+ Re5 25. Rxe5+ dxe5 26. Qxe5+ and white is a pawn up and can exchange queens to go into a winning endgame.
  5. 14 Aug '09 03:07 / 3 edits
    Originally posted by geo86012
    If 21.....Kf8, 22. Qf6 threatening Qxc3 and Qh8+ is very strong. For example, 22.....Rc5 23. Qa8+ Ke7 24. Re1+ Re5 25. Rxe5+ dxe5 26. Qxe5+ and white is a pawn up and can exchange queens to go into a winning endgame.
    why not 1.Qh6+ Ke7 2.Re1+? and if ... Kg8 then 3.Qxd6 Rxc2 4.Rd1. because 1.Qf6 fails to ...Qe5
  6. 14 Aug '09 03:14
    I would never play Ke7 in that position, Kg8 with hope perpetual checks would be my thing.
  7. 14 Aug '09 03:33
    Originally posted by AudreyxSophie
    I would never play Ke7 in that position, Kg8 with hope perpetual checks would be my thing.
    sorry my phone is acting up so i didn't get the whole line in.
  8. 14 Aug '09 05:11 / 2 edits
    I think you should have played on your 6th move a6. The if your going to play on your 7th move e6 I would then follow that with 8...Be7.

    Playing Be7 achieves four (!) things; 1) develops a piece 2) breaks the pin 3) prepares kingside castling 4) protects the knight and prevents the g-pawn from having to recapture. Which ultimately was your weakness.
  9. 14 Aug '09 12:32 / 1 edit
    Hi Lausey.

    Smashing post - very instructive things here.

    White to play.



    He played 19.g3 a very handy waiting move using the c3 pawn as bait.

    So you had this position in front of you before pressed 'Send Move'.



    Most non mating combinations involve an unprotected piece.

    Here you have the advantage of seeing what the position will be before
    you play the move.

    I've been advising a 'pre send ritual' where before you send your move
    you scan the board looking for unprotected pieces to see if there is any
    way either side can profit from this.

    The Black Rook on c3 is flashing like a beacon 'Look at me - look at me"

    And then, as Philidor correctly noted: White screwed it up

    Instead of 20.Rxe8+ he should have played 20.Qg4+ Kf8 21.Qd4



    Hits the unprotected c3 Rook and mate on h8. No defence.

    So to answer your question - yes after White messed it up 21...Kf8 would draw .

    If you had done a pre-send ritual you would have spotted this.



    You were looking at this very position when you pressed send.
    You admit you made the blunder - good. Learn from this lose.

    The game itself was a bit sloppy by Black - the other lads are
    offering some good advice here

    But you must wipe out the tactical flaws first.
    It's a jungle out there Lousey, they will eat you alive if cannot spot
    and handle the two move trick or a basic Queen fork.

    White may have thought it did not matter about the move order
    so played his combination 'ass about face' thinking he had 22.Qf6 in this postion.



    Which is the same idea but not correct - Black holds with 22...Qe5.

    So today's lesson:

    Look out for those unprotected pieces.

    Always check your move order when playing a combo - it matters.

    Thanks again for the post Lausey.

    Here is how the game should gone after Black grabs the c3 pawn.
  10. 16 Aug '09 10:04
    Thanks very much, some excellent advice here which I will need to take on board in the future. I agree that 21. ..Kh8 was unforgivable and need to learn to resist the send button till I have done a full analysis as you have just advised.

    On a plus note, at least I know I came close to drawing against a 1900+ player, which I know I couldn't have dreamed of doing when joining this site. Next time someone that strong wouldn't be so lucky after blundering themselves.
  11. 16 Aug '09 11:15 / 1 edit
    Hi

    Always glad to help out when I'm in the mood and have time.
    I'm sure that is the same wirth the other lads as well.

    It is a two way thing.
    I always copy the game and drop it into Winboard, you can copy and paste
    diagrams, games very quickly and the large board and ease of use
    is also a bonus.

    I don't use an engine (as some people have gleefully, though quite
    rightly pointed out when I miss a trick) so I get as much benefit
    as hopfully you do from the wee lessons.

    I think there is much to be learned from looking at games played
    by ALL players.

    To get a grade of 1900 you have to beat, on a regular basis
    1600-1700-1800 players.

    So if a 1600 players wants to improve is studying and playing over GM
    games doing him any good?

    He is not playing GM's he is playing 1600 players. So he perhaps should
    at least look at games of his peers to see where the common mistake occur.

    As he improves he will of course be able to put some the GM ideas into
    action but at the lower levels he often does not get chance as he is
    always dodging two moves tricks, unsound/premature attacks, etc.
    The type of play that is never seen or even pointed out in GM games.

    So Lausey it is not you who should thanking us. We thank you.