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Bishops OVERATED

Bishops OVERATED

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m
Look, it's a title!

Run, it's offensive!

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A lot of ppl say bishops are better then knights, but in many games, I trade both my knights for two bishops and lose in the late mid game, due to annoying knight tactics. I say gaining the bishop pair is very overated, if my Yahoo games are any indication.

p
High Priest

The Volcano

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Brother, you have got to stop playing yahoo.

G

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Learn to use knights better then maybe you wouldnt fall into their tactics ? :-)

T

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In blitz games knights are definitely better than bishops:-)

m
Look, it's a title!

Run, it's offensive!

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My problems with knights is this, they advance into my territory, I attack them, they find a hole and advance further, I attack, etc. . . What I'm I supposed to do when a knight enters my territory, leave it there? This always happens on Yahoo, moving the same knight around, sheeesh.

T

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Restrict them, take out their outposts and carefully check any fork tactics on the way. Look at my patetic knight and black's bishop:
Game 277566

S
Shut Gorohoviy!

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'In blitz,the knight is stronger than the bishop'
Vlastimil Hort.

"Deux fous gagnent toujours, mais trois fous, non!"
Alexander Alekhine.

k

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After a few years of mulling it over, I do prefer the bishop pair over the knights because of their range and speed. However, honestly, I have to say that there has been many a time when a seemingly innocuous knight suddenly springs to life, and "magically" just seems to find the EXACT spot to sit on where it can execute fork after fork, or even worse, the b****in family fork. It can be enough to make one tear their hair out, and that's saying alot, because i don't have any. (Or at least not much to speak of!)

Ahh yes! the dreaded cursed knight syndrome! Or how about a fork that at the same time protects a vital enemy piece fro capture, while simultaneously atacking your king or other vital piece. Yup. Knights can be a b**ch! But, what can you do? Just learn to live with it, or even better, prevent it. MUCH easier said than done!!

Here is a casual game in which I was just looking for some excitement and perhaps a new line or wrinkle in the (Dare I say it?) The King's Gambit. I was experimenting to find some new territory where I hadn't trod before, and was feeling rather adventurous. Unfortunately, so was the knight Watch how he jumps to life and ruins my chances. (yeah, I l know I could have possibly had a draw, but I just felt like sticking it out for a while): 1E2-E4 E7-E5 2 F2- F4 D7- D5 3 E4x D5 D8 x D5 4 B1- C3 D5- D4 5 G1-E2 D4- D6 6D2-D4 F8-E7 7F4xE5 D6- G6 8C3-D5 E7-D8 8 D1- D3 G8-E7 9 E2- F4 G6xD3 10 F1xD3 E8-G8 11 E1-G1 E7-F5 12C2-C3 B8-A6 13 D3xA6 B7xA6 14 C1-D2 C8-B7 15 A1-E1 A8- B8 16 D2- C1 C7-C6 17D5-E3 F5xE3 18C1xE3 D8- G5 19G1-H1 B7-C8 20 F4 D3 G5xE3 21 E1x E3 A6-A5 22H1-G1 A5-A4 23 G1- F2 A7-A5 24 F1- E1 C8-A6 25 E1-E2 H7-H5 26 F2-F3 F7-F5 27 E5-E6 G7-G5 28 E6-E7 F8-E8 29 H2-H3 G8-F7 30 D3- e5+ F7x E7 31 E5xC6+ E7-D7 32 C6xB8+ D7-D8 33 E3xe8+ D8-C7 34 B8xA6+ C7-B6 35 B2-B4 B6xA6 36 B4xA5 A6xA5 37 C3-C4 A5-B4 38 E2-D2 B4xC4 39 D4-D5 A4- A3 40 D5-D6 (resign)

Oh well, you just reset the pieces and chess life goes on.

c

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An important point is being overlooked here and that is the position on the board.

In an open position, where there are not many pawns blocking lines for example, then the bishop pair is generally better because they have a greater range.

In a closed position where lines are blocked then knights come into their own, however even in these cases if the position can be opened up then the advantage may well swing back to the bishops.

Ceter paribus (other things being equal) as Lasker used to say.

Simple game, isn't it?


😉

Acolyte
Now With Added BA

Loughborough

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Originally posted by colleman
An important point is being overlooked here and that is the position on the board.

In an open position, where there are not many pawns blocking lines for example, then the bishop pair is generally better because they have a greater range.

In a closed position where lines are blocked then knights come into their own, however even in these cases if the ...[text shortened]... er paribus (other things being equal) as Lasker used to say.

Simple game, isn't it?


😉
Another weakness of bishops, of course, is colour. In the endgame, a lone bishop is often marginalised by the opponent simply avoiding its colour.

p
High Priest

The Volcano

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Originally posted by mateulose
My problems with knights is this, they advance into my territory, I attack them, they find a hole and advance further, I attack, etc. . . What I'm I supposed to do when a knight enters my territory, leave it there? This always happens on Yahoo, moving the same knight around, sheeesh.
stop creating so many holes?

m
Look, it's a title!

Run, it's offensive!

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Originally posted by paultopia
stop creating so many holes?
The problem is, if you "waste" a move covering up a hole for a possible knight advance, my experience is, you lose anyways by doing that, usually to kingside attack, especially when you are black.

Often times, especially as black, you are left with a choice beteewn stoping his pawn storm or knight tricksies, I usually dicide to stop the first, the pawn storm, as it seems more dangerous. In fact, most games were white kingside attacks with knights, I often huddle for minutes in front of the chess board trying to find a sound defense, which I cannot find, and another possibility, is them sacking knights for tactics, which many times is unstopable, even if you see the threat. It's a helpless feeling, me, being a good defensive player, sees it coming, but cannot stop it.

It's amazing what a lone knight can do, I've seen it sneak through entire armies of well positioned peices, or make a sound pawn structure turned into rubble.

c

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Take a look at game 2 ( just started ) in the World Championship it may be instructive.

Leko has conceded the bishop pair and with 15. f4 Kramnik is already attacking the dark squares and trying to open up the position.

g

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Originally posted by paultopia
Brother, you have got to stop playing yahoo.
What is wrong with playing chess in Yahoo?

AThousandYoung
1st Dan TKD Kukkiwon

tinyurl.com/2te6yzdu

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I agree with the original statement that the Bishop pair is overrated.

The Bishops on average may be better than knights, slightly. However what is overrated is the rule that says Bishops are better than Knights. The position makes a lot of difference. I generally hold them equal. I won't go out of my way to trade my Knight for your Bishop, or to avoid letting you trade your Knight for my Bishop. I'd rather just let you make the effort to "win" that exchange and force you to make concessions to do so, since it's not much of a win anyway - if any.

If Bobby Fischer can win with the Exchange variation of the Ruy Lopez (1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bb5 a6 4. Bxc6) then clearly the Bishop isn't significantly better.

There are some small advantages to Bishops, like their ability to control both sides of the board at once, and the fact that two Bishops can mate while two Knights cannot...but they aren't all THAT amazing.

I like Yahoo by the way. I am only annoyed that there is no auto switch command to switch sides when you replay the same person. I have heard that ICC is better though.

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