Bxf7, Rxf7. Nxf7, Kxf7?

So, this is mainly a question of strategy. The moves above, after black has castled, effectively mean that White is surrendering two minor pieces for a Rook and a Pawn. In simple numbering, it is a fair swap (3+3 = 5+1) and has the advantage of dismantling the defence around the black King. My question is, does this actually give someone an advantage, or are there times when it is better (if white still has both Rooks for example), and some instances when it is not a good idea at all?
Ta muchly 🙂

Originally posted by morgski
So, this is mainly a question of strategy. The moves above, after black has castled, effectively mean that White is surrendering two minor pieces for a Rook and a Pawn. In simple numbering, it is a fair swap (3+3 = 5+1) and has the advantage of dismantling the defence around the black King. My question is, does this actually give someone an advantage, or ...[text shortened]... has both Rooks for example), and some instances when it is not a good idea at all?
Ta muchly 🙂

This subject pops up from time to time.

Thread 85301 & Thread 136505

In the first thread there is a good example by WittyMcVitie
(or what ever his name is) 😉

In the latter I posted this. It got two recs so someone found it handy.

Stats appear to favour the holder of the two minor pieces.

On the 1400 DB. (with over 1½ millon games a good base
for reference as it made up with games played by the lads
who read these Forums and some think this exchange is OK for the Rook).

Searched for games Where one side has just a Rook,
other has Bishop and Knight. (and of course Kings & pawns).

White has the Rook. 2342 games

White Wins 796
draws 371
Black Wins 1175

Black has the Rook 2205 games

Black Wins 733
Draws 390
White Wins 1082

Of course the pawns matter and the
Bishop and Knight must work well together.

But overall it does indicate a + for the Bishop & Knight.

Wins for the Rook in R v B+N at the lower level usually happen when one of
the minor pieces gets picked up by the Rook pulling off a tactical trick.

The minor pieces have to be careful about settling
on unprotected squares and always be on the alert for
Forks, Pins, Skewers and Harpoons.


1.Rc3 is a standard Rook Fork.


1.Rb8 winning the pinned Bishop.


1.Rb8+ Skewers the Bishop.


1.Rc3 is what I call a Harpoon.
It is neither a Pin (weaker piece pinned to stronger piece).
Or a Skewer (The stronger piece moves exposing the weaker piece).
A Harpoon fits the bill.

A basic: attack, check and Rook Fork.


1.Rc3 N any 2.Rc8+ then 3.Rc7+ and 4.RxB

Also the minor pieces have to be wary about getting
too close to the enemy King.


1.Ke6 is a King fork

Then there are Rook sac tricks winning the two minor pieces.



1.Rc8+ and 2.Rxc3 or 1.Ra6+ and 2.Rxf6.

All these tricks cropped up in games I looked at on here.[/b]

Obviously it depends on the position but in general this is one time where one should disregard the 5+1 = 3+3 point evaluation. Usually, as mentioned in one of the other threads, one needs to gain rook plus two pawns for the two minor pieces - all else being equal - which rarely happens.

Originally posted by kbear1k
Obviously it depends on the position but in general this is one time where one should disregard the 5+1 = 3+3 point evaluation. Usually, as mentioned in one of the other threads, one needs to gain rook plus two pawns for the two minor pieces - all else being equal - which rarely happens.

Originally posted by morgski
So, this is mainly a question of strategy. The moves above, after black has castled, effectively mean that White is surrendering two minor pieces for a Rook and a Pawn. In simple numbering, it is a fair swap (3+3 = 5+1) and has the advantage of dismantling the defence around the black King. My question is, does this actually give someone an advantage, or ...[text shortened]... has both Rooks for example), and some instances when it is not a good idea at all?
Ta muchly 🙂

B+N is certainly better than R; R+P is less clear, but I think I'd generally rather have the minor pieces, especially in a more crowded middle-game. R+PP probably trumps B+N most of the time. It always depends on the placement of the pieces and pawns.

Usually the trade is bad and having two minor pieces is superior to a rook and a pawn. There are exceptions, such as the dilworth variation of the open spanish, which is very exciting and sometimes leads to very interesting endgames (Yusupov played nice games with this variation). Here it is: