29 Jan 09
i think my biggest flaw is that i cant see ahead enough like i can't or don't calculate more then 3 moves ahead. sometimes ill make crazy sacrifices but most of the time i dont know if it will actually work out 5 plus moves later. i just use my intuition. is their a way to improve how many moves you can see ahead, or is that skill herititery?
29 Jan 09
Originally posted by Arrakthere is a way, and that is analyzing positions and checking your variations out with annotations or a computer. you may feel helpless in the beginning, but there's no easy way. try chesstempo.com standard.
i think my biggest flaw is that i cant see ahead enough like i can't or don't calculate more then 3 moves ahead. sometimes ill make crazy sacrifices but most of the time i dont know if it will actually work out 5 plus moves later. i just use my intuition. is their a way to improve how many moves you can see ahead, or is that skill herititery?
29 Jan 09
2 edits
Originally posted by ArrakThis summer I played occasionally OTB with a friend of mine. We would move the pieces on the board before every forth move. Helps with visualisation and calculation.
i think my biggest flaw is that i cant see ahead enough like i can't or don't calculate more then 3 moves ahead. sometimes ill make crazy sacrifices but most of the time i dont know if it will actually work out 5 plus moves later. i just use my intuition. is their a way to improve how many moves you can see ahead, or is that skill herititery?
For example -
Me : e4
Him : c5
Me : Nf3
Him : d6
Me : d4
Him : cxd4
Only then we move our pieces in that order and after that we continue for the next three moves etc. till the end of the game. If I had more nerves to keep that exercise going, it would be terrific.
Other way, puzzles. But on tactics servers check all the main variations (naming them in algebraic notation in your head) and then try to visualize the outcome.
Learn the board !! Which color is f6 made of ? Can you picture it in your head ?? - http://www.chessvideos.tv/chess-visualization-trainer.php, fantastic three exercises.
29 Jan 09
Originally posted by Arrakdoing slow tactics is the way to practice calculation.
i think my biggest flaw is that i cant see ahead enough like i can't or don't calculate more then 3 moves ahead. sometimes ill make crazy sacrifices but most of the time i dont know if it will actually work out 5 plus moves later. i just use my intuition. is their a way to improve how many moves you can see ahead, or is that skill herititery?
but usually seeing deep isn't necessary. I hardly ever look deeper than 2 moves. but naturally when the situation calls for it, you need to go as deep as it takes. even in endgames you often only look at a 'target position' far ahead, ignoring the moves in between.
the vast majority of my errors are still 1-movers. you just evaluate the position wrong, or are simply blind to some blatantly obvious move no matter how long you look. it happens, even to kramnik.
29 Jan 09
G. Kasparov indicated that he looked no more than 3 to moves ahead [in his previously unseen chess game positions ]except in the known continuation lines most of which he knew well enough already from memory of study information.His ability to see those moves from opponents which were clearly correct or clearly incorrect,is shared by all good players based upon experience of many diffrent positions,and although some players are able to visualize many longer strings of continuation possibllities,this is a bonus feature,and not necessary in order to reply correctly to opponents moves,be they correct or not!😴
29 Jan 09
3 edits
Originally posted by RECUVICI was inclined to believe that kind of stuff (that GMs look not deeper but only "better", i.e concise and relevant lines), but that point of view of mine was completely shattered after watching series of post-game press conferences of several super-strong tournaments, and especially the world championships in bonn. I was simply amazed while watching kramnik and anand explain the variations they had calculated in many positions.
G. Kasparov indicated that he looked no more than 3 to moves ahead [in his previously unseen chess game positions ]except in the known continuation lines most of which he knew well enough already from memory of study information.His ability to see those moves from opponents which were clearly correct or clearly incorrect,is shared by all good players based u ...[text shortened]... ature,and not necessary in order to reply correctly to opponents moves,be they correct or not!😴
These guys look deep. very, very deep. I think the more accurate information is that they don't analyze all the variations deeply but only very few, they "chunk" well but analyze those lines very deeply.
as an interesting side note, kramnik had stated that he was on the verge of falling into a mate in the WC match (during the middlegame). He had noticed that there was a one mover mate in the mainline he has been analyzing for 3 minutes, then he got shaky, stopped analyzing complicated variations and chose to play a safe and solid move instead.
29 Jan 09
Originally posted by diskamylGood link, there´s two nice features relative to CTS, you can do untimed tactical problems and still get a rating (as far as I could tell) and you don´t get punished for finding second best, but still good, moves.
there is a way, and that is analyzing positions and checking your variations out with annotations or a computer. you may feel helpless in the beginning, but there's no easy way. try chesstempo.com standard.
29 Jan 09
1 edit
I would say that it is difficult to see more than five moves ahead for any chess player accurately. Don't ever use the analyze board feature it will only weaken your chess play. Capablanca said I only look one move ahead, but I always make the right move! I would say that 3 moves ahead is enough for most positions.
29 Jan 09
As with so many things in chess, the answer is 'it depends on the position'. The following game sees one of my best ever pieces of calculation OTB at move 27.
Of course, what I was really seeing was the pattern - the actual calculation to mate was more like 2 critical moves (36 & 39) rather than 14. This is where all the tactical training pays off - spotting the pattern - not really calaculating every move because that is usually impossible.
(By the way, if anyone knows how to put the diagram at move 27 rather than show the whole game I'd love to know it too!)
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29 Jan 09
1 edit
Originally posted by kmac27I think for Mr. average club player even the more intermediate players 3 moves ahead is probably good enough. But this part of the game is really where the very top players excel. iF there is a tactic buried 8,10 or 12 moves deep they will find it.
I would say that it is difficult to see more than five moves ahead for any chess player accurately. Don't ever use the analyze board feature it will only weaken your chess play. Capablanca said I only look one move ahead, but I always make the right move! I would say that 3 moves ahead is enough for most positions.
i'm still amused by a quote from Paul Morphy during one of his blindfold exhibitions. He announced a mate in 6 from whatever position and after finishing the game off he was approached by the victim who confronted Morphy with a what if type question just before he announced mate in 6. Morphy still with is back to the boards replied " MATE IN EIGHT"
Alekhine also had tremendous powers of calculation. In his games collection he speaks of carefully calculating 10 moves ahead to win a pawn in a blindfold match.
It's just not easy!
30 Jan 09
Originally posted by kmac27yeah but if you dont see ahead more then 5 moves then how do you know if your sacrifice will work out? ive lost so many games becuase i cant calculate over 5 moves ahead and ill just intuitively sacrifice, but it only will work out 50% of the time. how come GM's are so good at caluclating sacrifices if they can only see 5 moves ahead?
I would say that it is difficult to see more than five moves ahead for any chess player accurately. Don't ever use the analyze board feature it will only weaken your chess play. Capablanca said I only look one move ahead, but I always make the right move! I would say that 3 moves ahead is enough for most positions.
30 Jan 09
Originally posted by ArrakAre you speaking of over the board or Correspondence Chess? You can improve your ability to see ahead in OTB by starting a balanced program of study and compitition. Study tactics, engames, and openings you use most often. have a strong player (2000+) anaylize your completed games with you. In Correspondence Chess you can do the same, but being able to move the pieces prior to making a decision, and the ability to consult books, databases should speed up your progress. 😏
i think my biggest flaw is that i cant see ahead enough like i can't or don't calculate more then 3 moves ahead. sometimes ill make crazy sacrifices but most of the time i dont know if it will actually work out 5 plus moves later. i just use my intuition. is their a way to improve how many moves you can see ahead, or is that skill herititery?
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30 Jan 09
Originally posted by kmac27Forcing moves are prevelant in most chess positions and it's quite amazing to see how the very best players can list reams of variations form even the most bland looking positions.
This is from mostly forced moves. Forced moves are easy to calculate. Variations in a sicilian position are not!
I've recently been playing through Kasparov's The Test Of Time and this is one of the points i've noted from studying his notes.
30 Jan 09
2 edits
Originally posted by Arraksorry, but you don't get to complain when your sacrifice doesn't work if you don't do any calculation beforehands.
how come GM's are so good at caluclating sacrifices if they can only see 5 moves ahead?
of course they see more than 5 moves ahead, especially if forced variations exist. but 5 moves is pretty much too. bear in mind that 1.e4 e5 isn't two moves, it's just one move, two plies. so 5 moves, meaning 10 plies could be very difficult if there are too many possibilites. but that's nothing for the likes of Kramnik, Anand, Alhekine etc. I believe they regularly calculate 5 moves ahead in open positions, but in critical positions much more than that.
GMs have been practicing these things 6 hours a day since their childhood. 1 hour of practice would still make you a lot better though.