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  1. Standard member vivify
    rain
    11 Oct '12 02:42 / 6 edits
    Thanks to reading GP's blogs (like his "Queen Rosaline" one), I think I now have a been understand of position. I feel like I've evolved during this one game.


  2. Standard member RJHinds
    The Near Genius
    11 Oct '12 05:19 / 2 edits
    Originally posted by vivify
    Thanks to reading GP's blogs (like his "Queen Rosaline" one), I think I now have a been understand of position. I feel like I've evolved during this one game.


    [pgn]

    [Event "Open invite"]
    [Site "http://www.redhotpawn.com"]
    [Date "2012.10.06"]
    [EndDate "2012.10.10"]
    [Round "?"]
    [White "vivify"]
    [Black "kingsideattack"]
    [WhiteRating "1445"]
    [Bla want to give GP a great big hug.} 1-0
    [/pgn]
    In the position after 13...Nd2+, you could have won a piece.



    Np need to thank GP. Thank me!
  3. 11 Oct '12 06:09 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by vivify
    Thanks to reading GP's blogs (like his "Queen Rosaline" one), I think I now have a been understand of position. I feel like I've evolved during this one game.


    [pgn]

    [Event "Open invite"]
    [Site "http://www.redhotpawn.com"]
    [Date "2012.10.06"]
    [EndDate "2012.10.10"]
    [Round "?"]
    [White "vivify"]
    [Black "kingsideattack"]
    [WhiteRating "1445"]
    [Bla want to give GP a great big hug.} 1-0
    [/pgn]
    I think you should've taken the rook.

    greenpawn's advice not to take the a8/a1 rook usually applies to positions in which the queens are still on the board and the rooks are hard to develop. In your game, the queens were off and you could easily make use of your extra rook with your two open files.

    EDIT: Never mind; I just noticed that you had to recapture the c4 knight after he captured your bishop. If you go for the rook and lose the e5 knight, like you suggested, you're giving up two pieces for the rook. That's a huge material disadvantage in that position.

    There would have been no harm in capturing the c7 pawn with check before playing Nxc4, though.
  4. Standard member RJHinds
    The Near Genius
    11 Oct '12 06:25
    Originally posted by vivify
    Thanks to reading GP's blogs (like his "Queen Rosaline" one), I think I now have a been understand of position. I feel like I've evolved during this one game.


    [pgn]

    [Event "Open invite"]
    [Site "http://www.redhotpawn.com"]
    [Date "2012.10.06"]
    [EndDate "2012.10.10"]
    [Round "?"]
    [White "vivify"]
    [Black "kingsideattack"]
    [WhiteRating "1445"]
    [Bla ...[text shortened]... want to give GP a great big hug.} 1-0
    [/pgn]
    It was Black's 22...Be6?? blunder that gave you the win. It had nothing to do with GP.
  5. Standard member vivify
    rain
    11 Oct '12 13:16
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    In the position after 13...Nd2+, you could have won a piece.

    [pgn]
    [FEN "r1b1k2r/ppp2ppp/8/1N2N1b1/2B5/8/PPPn1PPP/1K1R3R w - - "]
    1. Rxd2 Bxd2 2. Nxc7+ Ke7 3. Nxa8 [/pgn]

    Np need to thank GP. Thank me!
    Yes, but I'd be sacrificing for the sake of an undeveloped rook, which is the point of the thread. GP's blogs showed me that it's not always worth getting. My rook was developed, however, and was more useful.

    But you're right, I would've been up in material (which ultimately, is a much safer way to play).
  6. 11 Oct '12 13:18
    Hi V.

    "I'm better player in just one game?"
    Yes. You are on the right path.

    You thought differently about the position infront of you.
    You were open to what was for you a new idea, you experiemented.

    You are at that awkward 'Rule of Thumb' stage.
    Rook =5 Knights' =3, Bishops are better than Knights....
    Now you are looking to break these rules because you know they are
    only guidelines.

    The knowing when to obey them and when to igonore bit is hard.
    It comes with experience (the experience of this one game will matter in the future).

    You thought about activity over material - that's a massive step forward.

    As you get better and start to think about all your alternatives
    the more games you will lose!

    Only the gifted ones shoot straight up.
    Us we go up a bit, slide back a bit, go up a bit higher, slide back a bit.
    We never slide back to what were, but we never reach what ever heights it
    is you want reach in Chess without the rocky ride.
    It takes time for the new ideas to gel and it's durng this phase you are
    at your most vulnerbale.

    You will fall for things you never fell for before because you are a better player.
    That may sound cock-eyed but it means you will see ideas you never thought of
    before. You have not yet got the judgement to see how good they are so you go
    for it and perhaps lose. (that is the sliding back bit).

    Experience (and study) will tell you when you can put your better understanding
    of the game into action and win. (that is the sliding up bit.)

    A previous poster was correct.
    Misplacing pieces to win material does come down to wether or not the
    Queens are still on the board.

    There will come a time when you have to balance the position in your mind.
    Will the active piece get me more (....say a checkmate.)
    or is now the time to cash in my good position for material.
    Queens on or off (and the position of both Kings) will influence this decision.

    But rule of thumb. (which has to weighed at ever position.)
    Queens on go for the King, Queens off take the material.

    So here.....


    Now was the time to cash in the good position and play Rxd2 and Nxc7+ and Nxa8.

    Black would then have to make all kinds of odd moves to try and keep the a8
    Knight bottled up. You use the time to cook up other traps. (see game fragment.)

    Any good player would have played Rxd2 here without a moments thought.
    If you had a Bishop on c3 you would have played Bxd2 without hesitation.

    You have not given up the exchange. Forget the term the exchange. (it's a rule of thumb.)
    Think that Rooks, Knights and Bishops are all equal.
    You are now ready to exchange any for any if you are happy with the outcome.

    At the Master level exchanging a Rook for a Knight or Bishop when the position
    demnads it is no longer considered giving up the exchange.
    It has become as mundane as a bog standard Bxh7+ check check and mate sacrifce.

    The irony is you refused to give up the exchange to refuse to win the exchange
    a few moves later.
    (see what I mean about it taking time for new ideas to gel.)

    Ignore RJ - any thread that. is not about him then he gets the hump.
    What did he say?

    "It was Black's 22...Be6?? blunder that gave you the win. It had nothing to do with GP."



    No explanation as to why Black played 22...Be6?.
    (if only computers could talk...)

    Your opponent must have wondered what was going on.
    You refused to win the so called exchange just to keep the pressure on.
    He was so worried about swapping the h1 Rook for an active Knight
    He blundered with Be6.
    (this guy is non-blog reader....no climbing up higher and sliding down a bit for him.)

    The 14.Rxd2 line. Two possible continuations.



  7. Standard member vivify
    rain
    11 Oct '12 13:22 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by danilop


    There would have been no harm in capturing the c7 pawn with check before playing Nxc4, though.
    Yeah, I really beat myself up for that (are you guys able to see the annotations?). This is a "live and learn" moment for the next time.
  8. 11 Oct '12 13:32 / 1 edit
    I'm a big fan of the Old Indian (1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 d6 3.Nc3 e5 4.dxe5 dxe5 5.Qxd8 Kxd8) and I have to say I quite like Black's position out of the opening. His mistake was that he didn't play 6. ... c6 to give his king somewhere to hide.

    For example:


    It's not quite as good as the Old Indian, because White's c-pawn is stuck on c4 in the OI where it gets in the way of his white-squared bishop and gives Black a target to attack, but I'd still fancy my chances with Black from that position.
  9. Standard member vivify
    rain
    11 Oct '12 13:48
    Originally posted by greenpawn34
    [b]A previous poster was correct.
    Misplacing pieces to win material does come down to wether or not the
    Queens are still on the board.
    I didn't know this. I'll remember that for next time.

    As far as why Black 22.Be6, I'm guessing it's because his king would be unable to move left or right, should my pawn capture the F7 pawn. Why not just take the F7 pawn, then? I think it's because he didn't want an exposed king. He'd already spent the entire game on the defensive, and the thought of being protected by the bishop may have been very appealing at that point.

    Man...the " rocky slide" that you speak of will be really miserable, won't it? Thanks for the warning, at least now I'm better prepared to deal with it when it comes.
  10. 11 Oct '12 14:24 / 3 edits
    Warned you about the rocky slide bit so you won't get down too hearted.

    Hi Fat Lady.
    Was going to advise White must not over estiamte his chances in that position,
    but one thing at time.

    Lost a good handful of blitz games battering my head against that move order
    a few years back to know it commands respect.
    Learning from losses I came up with


    6.Nf3 here to try to get a piece to c6.

    Now I won't chop on e5 as White,
    I'd swing it into a genuine Philidor with 4.Nf3 when 4...Bg4 is the trap.
    Then I chop on e5.

    GP - Smith79 RHP 2010.
    I win a piece, then find a brillo mungo trap to wrap up.

  11. 13 Oct '12 22:02
    Originally posted by vivify
    Thanks to reading GP's blogs (like his "Queen Rosaline" one), I think I now have a been understand of position. I feel like I've evolved during this one game.


    [pgn]

    [Event "Open invite"]
    [Site "http://www.redhotpawn.com"]
    [Date "2012.10.06"]
    [EndDate "2012.10.10"]
    [Round "?"]
    [White "vivify"]
    [Black "kingsideattack"]
    [WhiteRating "1445"]
    [Bla ...[text shortened]... want to give GP a great big hug.} 1-0
    [/pgn]
    I find the position after 19 moves interesting. Who is better? White is fully developed but long term blacks 2 bishops are great.
    ps 20 g4 as in the game seems to walk into 20.... f6 with g4 hanging if the knight moves
  12. Standard member RJHinds
    The Near Genius
    14 Oct '12 01:54
    Originally posted by queenabber
    I find the position after 19 moves interesting. Who is better? White is fully developed but long term blacks 2 bishops are great.
    ps 20 g4 as in the game seems to walk into 20.... f6 with g4 hanging if the knight moves
    Yes, it is interesting. White is better if he plays 21.Nb6! However he should have played that move on move 20 instead of 20.g4.