Please turn on javascript in your browser to play chess.
Only Chess Forum

Only Chess Forum

  1. Standard member bannedplayer306509
    Best Loser
    14 Jul '07 20:24
    Game I analyzed in Fritz and was presented with no improvements to make on either end. I also let Fritz play for an extra 20 moves to see what would happen and the game drew so I don't feel particularly bad about the early offer.
    I know fritz had nothing to say but maybe someone else does? I know humans have a creative touch that no engine can match.

    Game 3793362
  2. Standard member irontigran
    Rob Scheider is..
    14 Jul '07 20:35
    Originally posted by ih8sens
    Game I analyzed in Fritz and was presented with no improvements to make on either end. I also let Fritz play for an extra 20 moves to see what would happen and the game drew so I don't feel particularly bad about the early offer.
    I know fritz had nothing to say but maybe someone else does? I know humans have a creative touch that no engine can match.

    Game 3793362
    wow, you were a whole queen up, why did you draw??
  3. Standard member Dragon Fire
    Lord of all beasts
    14 Jul '07 21:05 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by jvanhine
    wow, you were a whole queen up, why did you draw??
    Because R(either)XQ then material is equal. (EDIT: Well black is a pawn down so I guess thats why he took the draw)

    I think with the 2Bs against a player rated 300 points below me I would play on so a great result for you. Well done!
  4. Standard member bannedplayer306509
    Best Loser
    14 Jul '07 21:08 / 2 edits
    Originally posted by Dragon Fire
    Because R(either)XQ then material is equal. (EDIT: Well black is a pawn down so I guess thats why he took the draw)

    I think with the 2Bs against a player rated 300 points below me I would play on so a great result for you. Well done!
    material wasn't quite equal... i was up a pawn but it was insignificant.

    oh lol.. missed your edit.

    ... actually, that leaves me a good question, should black have left me that pawn or should he have recaptured with the pawn, risking his king safety a little?
  5. 14 Jul '07 21:30
    Nice on drawing a much higher ranked player

    And if black had recaptured with the pawn, his black bishop would have been completely useless for several moves, AND his king would have been more vulnerable...not worth a pawn
  6. Standard member Dragon Fire
    Lord of all beasts
    14 Jul '07 21:32 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by ih8sens
    material wasn't quite equal... i was up a pawn but it was insignificant.

    oh lol.. missed your edit.

    ... actually, that leaves me a good question, should black have left me that pawn or should he have recaptured with the pawn, risking his king safety a little?
    I think black should have recaptured with the g pawn as white cannot get his forces into the attack quickly enough.

    Qg3+ .. Kh8 doesn't achieve anything after Rg8 and sooner or later f5 undoubles the pawns and unleashes the 2 Bs. The weakness of the black king seem illusionary and, in my opinion, not worth a whole P to avoid.

    Nd5 is a great square for the N but black can play Be6 and chase or swop so again doesn't seen dangerous long term.
  7. Standard member bannedplayer306509
    Best Loser
    14 Jul '07 21:34 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by Dragon Fire
    I think black should have recaptured with the g pawn as white cannot get his forces into the attack quickly enough.

    Qg3+ .. Kh8 doesn't achieve anything after Rg8 and sooner or later f5 undoubles the pawns and unleashes the 2 Bs. The weakness of the black king seem illusionary and, in my opinion, not worth a whole P to avoid.
    That sounds good ... I just ran a deeper scan and fritz would have done as you say but judges the position to be almost perfectly equal either way.

    edit.. that sounds wierd.. i mean either move was just as good, not the position was equal, white is winning by 3/4 of a pawn.
  8. Standard member Dragon Fire
    Lord of all beasts
    14 Jul '07 21:47
    Originally posted by ih8sens
    That sounds good ... I just ran a deeper scan and fritz would have done as you say but judges the position to be almost perfectly equal either way.

    edit.. that sounds wierd.. i mean either move was just as good, not the position was equal, white is winning by 3/4 of a pawn.
    That sounds about right. Fritz would rate the exposed king and doubled pawn as a weakness or a pawn is, well, a pawn up.

    I think if you leave Fritz a little longer it may reduce that white advantage to about 0.50 pawn unless (which I doubt) it can find a tactical blow.
  9. Standard member bannedplayer306509
    Best Loser
    14 Jul '07 22:07
    Originally posted by Dragon Fire
    That sounds about right. Fritz would rate the exposed king and doubled pawn as a weakness [b]or a pawn is, well, a pawn up.

    I think if you leave Fritz a little longer it may reduce that white advantage to about 0.50 pawn unless (which I doubt) it can find a tactical blow.[/b]
    I just ran a deep position search and let it run for a while... this is rather interesting.

    Analysis by Crafty 19.01

    1. (0.67): 11...Bxf6 12.Qxd6 Be6 13.Qb4 Bg5+ 14.Kb1 Qe7 15.Qb5 Rac8 16.Nd5 Qc5 17.Qxc5 Rxc5 18.b4 Bg4
    2. (1.47): 11...gxf6 12.Nd5 Rc8 13.Be2 Kh8 14.c3 a5 15.Rd2 b6 16.Re1 Be6 17.Nxe7 Qxe7 18.Qxd6 Qxd6 19.Rxd6

    A significantly better move to use the bishop... wow.
  10. Standard member Dragon Fire
    Lord of all beasts
    15 Jul '07 07:27
    Originally posted by ih8sens
    I just ran a deep position search and let it run for a while... this is rather interesting.

    Analysis by Crafty 19.01

    1. (0.67): 11...Bxf6 12.Qxd6 Be6 13.Qb4 Bg5+ 14.Kb1 Qe7 15.Qb5 Rac8 16.Nd5 Qc5 17.Qxc5 Rxc5 18.b4 Bg4
    2. (1.47): 11...gxf6 12.Nd5 Rc8 13.Be2 Kh8 14.c3 a5 15.Rd2 b6 16.Re1 Be6 17.Nxe7 Qxe7 18.Qxd6 Qxd6 19.Rxd6

    A significantly better move to use the bishop... wow.
    Thats quite a difference .80 of a pawn by better for you by giving up a pawn. Rating white better as 1.47 pawns is a winning advantage so maybe you should not have taken the draw.
  11. Standard member irontigran
    Rob Scheider is..
    15 Jul '07 16:16
    Originally posted by Dragon Fire
    Because R(either)XQ then material is equal. (EDIT: Well black is a pawn down so I guess thats why he took the draw)

    I think with the 2Bs against a player rated 300 points below me I would play on so a great result for you. Well done!
    lol, i was joking, im not that dumb (i hope)
  12. 15 Jul '07 17:06
    you two accepted a draw in that position?!? but there is so much play left.
  13. Standard member bannedplayer306509
    Best Loser
    15 Jul '07 18:50
    Originally posted by Stockton
    you two accepted a draw in that position?!? but there is so much play left.
    One, that really helped my rating.
    Two, we were (according to fritz) going to end up in a K v. K endgame anyways. If I was playing someone my own rating I would have tried to push it a little but I don't think being a pawn up in a situation where my opponent had the little tempo that there was would help that much. It could have been played longer but it probably would have drawn anyways I think.
  14. 15 Jul '07 19:14
    I would have definately played on as black & I offer draws reasonably easily.
  15. Standard member bannedplayer306509
    Best Loser
    15 Jul '07 20:31
    Originally posted by Squelchbelch
    I would have definately played on as black & I offer draws reasonably easily.
    played on as black?? a pawn down with a reasonably simple endgame in the making?.. I dunno i suppose but I think if that game had have been played out perfectly a draw would be all black could hope for.