Has anybody played this as one of their main lines? I've started trying it out, to expand my repertoire from 1 e4 and 1 c4...it seems to basically let black call the shot. So far, I have had it turn into the french defense and to the classical 1 Nc3 e5, 2 e4...I think black can change it into anything...
I like it so far as I play passively - any thoughts?
Originally posted by RamnedMost people call it the Van Geet after the famous dutch (still active) correspondence chessplayer Dick Van Geet.
Has anybody played this as one of their main lines? I've started trying it out, to expand my repertoire from 1 e4 and 1 c4...it seems to basically let black call the shot. So far, I have had it turn into the french defense and to the classical 1 Nc3 e5, 2 e4...I think black can change it into anything...
I like it so far as I play passively - any thoughts?
It can transpose quite easily to french , caro and vienna but I think its much better than its reputation.
Morozevich has played it on several occaissons and stated once that he found it weird that 1. Nf3 has such a good theoratical reputation but the other knight move 1. Nc3 lacked credibility.
He suggested it had something to do with chesspsychology and the fact that most people are right handed, this seems a bit far fetched to me.
i'm only 1400 so my opinion means nothing...
i used to play it....it does let black do what he wants and he equalizes after 1...d5
whenever i played it we would always transpose...unless i got 1.Nc3 2.e4 and 3.f4 in....but i'm sure that is even an opening somewhere..
it's sound but i always got bored.....i dunno....the book.."Knight on the left 1.Nc3"
is a great book....should cover all you need.
Originally posted by RamnedI personally think the better move order would be 1. e4 e5 2. Nc3, but if it works for you, "don't fix what isn't broken."
Has anybody played this as one of their main lines? I've started trying it out, to expand my repertoire from 1 e4 and 1 c4...it seems to basically let black call the shot. So far, I have had it turn into the french defense and to the classical 1 Nc3 e5, 2 e4...I think black can change it into anything...
I like it so far as I play passively - any thoughts?
Originally posted by chessisvanity1. Nc3 2. e4 3. f4 could easily be an opening. 1. Nc3 e5 2. e4 Nf6 (or Nc6) 3. f4 is a Vienna. 1. Nc3 c5 2. e4 something 3. f4 is a Sicilian. I bet there are several other possibilities
i'm only 1400 so my opinion means nothing...
i used to play it....it does let black do what he wants and he equalizes after 1...d5
whenever i played it we would always transpose...unless i got 1.Nc3 2.e4 and 3.f4 in....but i'm sure that is even an opening somewhere..
it's sound but i always got bored.....i dunno....the book.."Knight on the left 1.Nc3"
is a great book....should cover all you need.
Also called "Der linksspringer"
quoting Richard Pallisers book "Beating Unusual Openings:
...perhaps the majority of players remain ignorant that 1.Nc3 is both an independent system and not just a transpositional tool, as well as allowing white early piece play. This opening has been referred to as the Dunst, the Van Geet and Der Linkssrpinger (the knight on the left) and black should not neglect it in his preparation unless he wants to join the ranks of miniature victims (particularly in the lines featuring an early ...e5: either on move one or after 1.Nc3...d5, 2.e4...dxe4, 3. Nxe4). We will focus on a) 1...d5 and b) 1...c5 (the choice for Sicilain players)
French players should meet 1.Nc3 with 1.e6
Caro-Kann players 1.Nc3...c6
etc.
Danish correspondence GM Ove Ekebjaerg plays it...
I am tempted to take this up. It actually fits perfectly with my current 1. e4 opening repetoire. In fact, I'm pretty sure black can't prevent me from playing something I'd be playing anyway if I used instead my current move order, particularly since 2. Nc3 is my usual 2nd move. Going this route gives me the added bonus of it being a little off the beaten path looking (appealing to me) and potentially catching some oponents out of their normal opening lines. And psychologically it may look "weak" or "stupid" which might encourage some over-confidence, another plus. Definitely need to research this further.
Nice catch to whoever brought this up. Not an opening move I'd seen enough to remember (so maybe never) and not something I'd think to play on my own but for the discussion here that illustrated how it can lead to so many lines of mine already.
Originally posted by scandium1...d5 can prevent 2.e4
I am tempted to take this up. It actually fits perfectly with my current 1. e4 opening repetoire. In fact, I'm pretty sure black can't prevent me from playing something I'd be playing anyway if I used instead my current move order, particularly since 2. Nc3 is my usual 2nd move. Going this route gives me the added bonus of it being a little off the beaten p ...[text shortened]... the discussion here that illustrated how it can lead to so many lines of mine already.
Originally posted by tomtom232Oh really? Maybe you should have said it seems to avoid the Scandinavian altogether.
I should say that it would be like a scandinavian and that 2.Nc3 isn't really all that good against that opening.
1. Nc3 d5 2. e4 and now black can choose between:
2... Nf6 which can transpose into a Scandinavian gambit, with the mainline with 1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Qxd5 avoided altogether. Or white can avoid the gambit mainline as well and push 3. e5 instead, although I can't say whether or not that would be reasonable, I do know that after 2... Nf6 3. exd5 Nxd5 I've reached the exact position as I do when I meet this line in my current move order, and that its just fine for white.
2... dxe4 can lead to a BDG (3. f3) or something independent altogether with 3. Nxe4. My guess at first glance is that this will probably transpose into something resembling a mainline Caro after something like 3... Bf5 4. Ng3. Though there is scope there for both players to move the game into other channels, nothing about that positions suggests it is in way bad for white.
2... d4 3. Ne2 e5. Perhaps the critical line, and something I'd need to have some preparation for before attempting 1. Nc3 d5 2. e4. Hardly resembles a Scandinavian, and white can still avoid this messy position completely with only a little flexibility:
1. Nc3 d5. 2. d4 and this could transpose into either a 2. Nc3 French or a 1.d4 opening that I can't think of the name of where white plays 2. Nc3 instead of c4 (some GM, I think maybe short, wrote an opening book about it).
Bottom line is the Scandinavian is hardly anything a 1. Nc3 player need be concerned about, although like all of the more flexible openings you need some creativity, flexibility, and familiarity with the many possible transpositions if you're going to play it well.
Originally posted by scandiumI know somebody who plays 1. Nc3 intending 2. e4 should Black respond 1. ... d5. As others have said moving the q-pawn up two squares certainly doesn't prevent e4.
... 2... d4 3. Ne2 e5. Perhaps the critical line, and something I'd need to have some preparation for before attempting ....
I agree with Scandium about 2. ... d4 being the critical response in this case. When I played the guy a while back I mentioned this possibility to him after the game and he said he was hoping I'd go down that line because he had something very nasty prepared.
Instead I transposed into a French with 1. Nc3 d5, 2. e4 e6, 3. d4
I suspect 2. ... d4 is objectively a better move than 2. ... e6 but I dont see the value of taking on an opponent on their own territory regardless of how good your position is 'supposed' to be.