piece sac in sveshnikov

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28 Jul '10 11:38

toeternitoe
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28 Jul '10 11:38

In this well known position I read 9.... Qxf6 is a mistake on account of:
10.Nd5 Qd8 11.Bxb5!

Now I very much like a piece for pawns sac but here I'm not seeing it.
Is 11.Bxb5 really considered the best move?

toet.
Macpo
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28 Jul '10 12:491 edit
I think the idea is : Bxb5 axb5 Nxb5 and white has two very strong knights, that will inevitably make further damage... (especially c7 is pretty weak).

for instance, after this, black could play Qa5, met by c3 :

Invert Board PGN
1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. d4 cxd4 4. Nxd4 Nf6 5. Nc3 e5 6. Ndb5 d6 7. Bg5 a6 8. Na3 b5 9. Bxf6 Qxf6 10. Nd5 Qd8 11. Bxb5 axb5 12. Nxb5 Qa5+ 13. c3

and then I don't really what black can do...
(Qxb5 impossible because of the fork on c7 from the other knight),
toeternitoe
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28 Jul '10 13:061 edit
Originally posted by Macpo
I think the idea is : Bxb5 axb5 Nxb5 and white has two very strong knights, that will inevitably make further damage... (especially c7 is pretty weak).

for instance, after this, black could play Qa5, met by c3 :

[pgn]1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. d4 cxd4 4. Nxd4 Nf6 5. Nc3 e5 6. Ndb5 d6 7. Bg5 a6 8. Na3 b5 9. Bxf6 Qxf6 10. Nd5 Qd8 11. Bxb5 axb5 12. Nxb5 Qa5+ eally what black can do...
(Qxb5 impossible because of the fork on c7 from the other knight),
Yes of course,and then I guess 13.... Kd8 (or Kd7,would it make a difference?) 14.a4 and I have no clue for black.

I wouldn't feel comfy playing black,that's for sure.but is it worth a piece?
Probably best I just try it sometime and see what happens.

toet.
Macpo
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28 Jul '10 13:48
well it's not a piece for nothing, it's a piece for two pawns... so let's say you're roughly one point late, materially speaking. I would say this is very much worth it, for white. black cannot castle anymore, and then, you have a clear plan, i.e. pushing your queen pawns, opening lines when possible, etc.
toeternitoe
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28 Jul '10 13:52
When you put it like that it seems so easy.

I've already won! 🙂

All I need to do now is find some geezer who actually plays that line with Qxf6 😛

toet.
Macpo
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01 Oct '08
Moves
13897
28 Jul '10 14:15
eheh...
No sorry this is not what I meant; just that I would feel quite comfortable with such a position; after Kd8, it's a bit like an opposite castling game, with one side being far ahead in development...

but if you want to play it with me, I am fine. I play white though 😀

Macpo

Joined: 01 Oct '08
Moves: 13897

28 Jul '10 14:33

by the way, if you're looking for some funny lines in the sveshnikov, I pretty much like this one myself. I have to say it doesn't happen much, and I found it by mistake, but it's finally an interesting gambit (Fritz says it's equal).

it's in the Nd5 variation

Invert Board PGN

you come quite naturally to this position:

Now the funny move for me is Be6:

the apparent problem is that white can play Nxdf6 Qxf6 Qxd6 and black is one pawn down.

but then, after Rc8 you threaten Rd8, and are getting clearly ahead in development.

and either the guy sees the trick (which he normally should do) and remove quickly his queen, in which case, you have a dynamic advantage, which I personnally find interesting, for the material;

(like this for instance)

or if he doesn't, you just more or less win. (like in this game).

Invert Board PGN Headers

toeternitoe
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28 Mar '10
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28 Jul '10 15:01
I know you didn't mean it was outright winning.was little joke

Looks like an ok gambit line for black,yes.

I don't play the black side of a sicilian,I started out with 1... e5 and am sticking to it till this very day.
But I'll watch out for it playing white.

Thanks for the warning.

toet.

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piece sac in sveshnikov