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  1. 16 Nov '11 11:31
    Why should black not have taken the c4 pawn?

    White to move



    cummings v basanta 1999
  2. 16 Nov '11 20:12 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by dzhafner
    Why should black not have taken the c4 pawn?

    White to move

    [fen]2r1kb1r/1b1n1ppp/pp1ppn2/8/2qNP3/2N1B1P1/PP3PBP/2RQR1K1[/fen]

    cummings v basanta 1999
    Well to start I want to say that I know this game did not come to this position - nor could it have from the move choices. Black chose to play Be7 and not Rc8 putting him a move behind this variation. After black did indeed play Rc8 white began his now somewhat legendary pawn storm with f4! This was a very good game to be sure. I think your real question is "Why isn't the c4 pawn hanging?" there are some difficult tactics here - so I understand why you ask this.
    (here is your diagram again - just so we can take a look at it)

    In the above - white has some attacking possibilities. Qxc4 has left the Bb7 piece unprotected. Furthermore there is an attack on the Qc4 piece with Nd5 {Nb5}. Nd5 is better as it will dominate the Q.. (it puts a necessary attack on b4) 1. Nd5 Qxa2 2. Ra1 Qxb2?{Qc4} 3. Re1e2{b3} Qxa1{Qc5 and now Nxe6 with a discovered attack and black must play Qc2 and lose Q+R for a Q else Q for R}
    Now Mr. dzhafner back to your original Diagram!

    Do note that Bb7 is still unprotected. So a simple e5 push is also bad for black here. This push is also available at anytime during the above attack if things get to dicey.

    Q
  3. 18 Nov '11 02:44 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by dzhafner
    Why should black not have taken the c4 pawn?

    White to move

    [fen]2r1kb1r/1b1n1ppp/pp1ppn2/8/2qNP3/2N1B1P1/PP3PBP/2RQR1K1[/fen]

    cummings v basanta 1999
  4. 18 Nov '11 18:33
    Does 1.Nd5 Qxa2 2.Rxc8+ Bxc8 3.Nc7+ Kd8 4.Nc6+ Kxc7 5.Nb4+ winning the queen work? (That was without the silicon monster :-) ).
  5. Standard member Exuma
    Anansi
    18 Nov '11 19:47
    Originally posted by jonrothwell
    Does 1.Nd5 Qxa2 2.Rxc8+ Bxc8 3.Nc7+ Kd8 4.Nc6+ Kxc7 5.Nb4+ winning the queen work? (That was without the silicon monster :-) ).
    5 Nb4 is not check, the rook is gone now
  6. 18 Nov '11 20:10
    Originally posted by Exuma
    5 Nb4 is not check, the rook is gone now
    aha of course! thanks. Me and my feeble calculation skills!
  7. 18 Nov '11 23:50 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by jonrothwell
    That was the original line i wanted to get to work. To prove that the open file would be lethal for black since he was unable to castle quickly enough.

    Kd8 is forced because of the pretty double knight checkmate, but white needs to play Qc1 before Nc6+. The idea being that either you will win the queen, Be7?? Nc6+ Nb4+ Nxa2, or threaten checkmate with Nc6+ Kxc7 Na7+ Kb2 Qxc8+ Kxa7 and the bishops & queen combination should win one of the black knight and then mate.

    The only problem is that after Qc1 black can play Nc5, blocking the open file. So white plays b4 to displace the knight, right? Well ...Nd7 and black loses only if he forgets that he can put his knight back on c6, with Nxe3 he counterproductively invites white to use the e-file, even Nd3 fork Qc3 Nxe1 Nc6+, white can only force perpetual (Kd7) it is black who would need to choose to helpmate (Kxc7???).

    Black's position is very solid after b4 Kxc7! bxc5 exc5 Be5 (why not i guess) Kb7 and now the three connected passed pawns are dangerous.





    White can of course drop his plan of all pieces on the c-file and try Nc7+, Qb1, Na8, Nxb6. after Na8 of course not ...Nd3 because of the weak c7 square. But Bb7 forces the knight to move and now the queen can no longer infiltrate on c7. White moves his knight and after the fork on d3 he is forced to trade queens and enter an endgame.


    I don't think this endgame would be fun for white, he is about to be two pawns down.


    Much nicer is PhySIC's suggestion keeping pawn equality and the bishop pair.



    Too bad, I really liked the knight and queen attack on c7. White just needed one more tempo.
  8. Standard member SwissGambit
    Caninus Interruptus
    19 Nov '11 01:36
    Originally posted by dzhafner
    Why should black not have taken the c4 pawn?

    White to move

    [fen]2r1kb1r/1b1n1ppp/pp1ppn2/8/2qNP3/2N1B1P1/PP3PBP/2RQR1K1 w[/fen]

    cummings v basanta 1999
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