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  1. 27 Mar '11 21:25


    I'm wanting to play Ne5 threatening mate, but the program is telling me to sac the bishop with Bf7+ followed by Ne5+. Won't I have the opportunity to capture the g4 bishop either way? Why sac my bishop?
  2. 27 Mar '11 21:54
    Originally posted by Eladar
    [fen]rn1qkb1r/ppp1pppp/5n2/8/2B3b1/2N2N2/PPPP1PPP/R1BQK2R w - - 0 1[/fen]

    I'm wanting to play Ne5 threatening mate, but the program is telling me to sac the bishop with Bf7+ followed by Ne5+. Won't I have the opportunity to capture the g4 bishop either way? Why sac my bishop?
    Ne5 Be6. Stops the mate and prevents you grabbing a free bishop. On the other hand, after Ne5 Be6 Bxe6 fxe6 black's king is stuck in the centre and the knight on e5 isn't going to be kicked away anytime soon, especially if you give it some support with d4.

    After Bxf7 I see Kxf7 Ne5+ Kg8 Nxg4 Nc6 and the black king has escaped. You are a pawn up but I prefer the position after Ne5 to be honest.
  3. Subscriber no1marauder
    Humble and Kind
    27 Mar '11 23:47
    Originally posted by Diophantus
    Ne5 Be6. Stops the mate and prevents you grabbing a free bishop. On the other hand, after Ne5 Be6 Bxe6 fxe6 black's king is stuck in the centre and the knight on e5 isn't going to be kicked away anytime soon, especially if you give it some support with d4.

    After Bxf7 I see Kxf7 Ne5+ Kg8 Nxg4 Nc6 and the black king has escaped. You are a pawn up but I prefer the position after Ne5 to be honest.
    I don't. Black's King might have gotten to g8, but he's going to have a hard time activating his King's Rook. White will thus have a long term edge in development and King security to go along with his being a pawn up.

    Black's King isn't stuck in the center after the Ne5 line; he can always set up to castle long in which case the half open d-file with a Rook on it is some compensation for the ugly doubled e-pawns.
  4. 27 Mar '11 23:59
    Hi Eladar.

    No idea why a computer would prefer one over the other.
    I guess it is because it has too give preference to one of them.

    Perhaps it's because Bxf7+ does prevent Black from castling
    and it is winning a pawn. (most likely the latter).

    However:

    Let your peers be your inspriation. Allow their bright light to guide
    you as you stumble through the misty haze of the 64 squares in your
    endless quest for the truth.

    Actually I found this postion 30 times on the DB and White
    did not play either 6.Ne5 or 6.Bxf7 in 16 of them!
    Most castled or played 6.h3 with mixed results.

    So ignore that set of peers. (even though the ratio is more than 50% )
    I'll be having words with them.

    But what is best. 6.Ne5 or 6.Bxf7+.

    Lix - Blue Mon RHP 2006

    6.Ne5

    This is good, the attention switches from King to Queen.



    RojZg - kulkarni vihang RHP 2007

    6.Bxf7+

    After the first round White thinks:

    "Well if he set up and fell for that one, he will set up another."

    And so he retreats into his shell and waits.....

    He did not have to wait long.



    Conclussion. Either will give you a plus.
  5. 28 Mar '11 03:34
    What about Qd4 after Ne5, looks interesting.
  6. 28 Mar '11 22:37
    Diopantus,

    Thanks for pointing out black's bishop retreat, I didn't even see it.

    No1,

    I agree with you. I prefer the outcome of the bishop exchange. Winning the pawn isn't worth much to me, but preventing the black king from castling does.

    GP,

    I think all of the positions are from actual games, so it is choosing the line that was used in the game. Thanks for validating both moves. Thanks for going through the effort of finding both lines in action and posting the games. It was very informative and educational.
  7. Subscriber sonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    29 Mar '11 00:17
    Originally posted by greenpawn34
    Hi Eladar.

    No idea why a computer would prefer one over the other.
    I guess it is because it [b]has too
    give preference to one of them.

    Perhaps it's because Bxf7+ does prevent Black from castling
    and it is winning a pawn. (most likely the latter).

    However:

    Let your peers be your inspriation. Allow their bright light to guide
    you as you ...[text shortened]... onclussion. Either will give you a plus.[/b]
    That's good just as long as your peers don't stain their underwear