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  1. 19 Mar '07 15:56 / 1 edit
    Does anyone know the name for this variation of the Sicilian opening?

    1.e4
    1...c5
    2.d4
    2...cxd4
    3.c3
    3...dxc3
    4.Bc4
    4...cxb2
    5.Bxb2

  2. 19 Mar '07 15:58
    Originally posted by 93confirmed
    Does anyone know the name for this variation of the Sicilian opening?

    1.e4
    1...c5
    2.d4
    2...cxd4
    3.c3
    3...dxc3
    4.Bc4
    4...cxb2
    5.Bxb2

    rnbqkbnr/pp1ppppp/8/8/2B1P3/8/PB3PPP/RN1QK1NR w KQkq - 0 1
    it's like a danish gambit where black's using his c-pawn instead of e-pawn
    i don't recommend it
    the danish gambit thrives on black's lack of an e-pawn
    with it, black shouldn't have to give back his two pawns at all
  3. 19 Mar '07 16:41
    Originally posted by rubberjaw30
    it's like a danish gambit where black's using his c-pawn instead of e-pawn
    i don't recommend it
    the danish gambit thrives on black's lack of an e-pawn
    with it, black shouldn't have to give back his two pawns at all
    Its a morra gambit, very famous and full of traps. The gambit doesnt have to give up both pawns, it can go
    1. e4 c5
    2. d4 cxd4
    3. c3 dxc3
    4. Nxc3

    But this one tries to take advantage of the diagonals for the bishops and you can't really say you dont recommend it based on that analysis, its an opening full of traps and carefull play is needed by both sides. Iv never played it but high rated players are'nt keen to face it as black, i think sicilian smaug once said to me he hated facing it.
  4. 19 Mar '07 16:45
    Originally posted by mazziewag
    Its a morra gambit, very famous and full of traps. The gambit doesnt have to give up both pawns, it can go
    1. e4 c5
    2. d4 cxd4
    3. c3 dxc3
    4. Nxc3

    But this one tries to take advantage of the diagonals for the bishops and you can't really say you dont recommend it based on that analysis, its an opening full of traps and carefull play is needed by both ...[text shortened]... rs are'nt keen to face it as black, i think sicilian smaug once said to me he hated facing it.
    yeah, and i knew that...
    i am somewhat familiar with the Nxc3 variation-- Smith-Morra gambit
    but when Bc4 and cxb2 and Bxb2, it looks like a poor danish gambit
    not playable against an opponent of equal or greater strength, IMO
  5. 19 Mar '07 17:02
    I guess it's categorized as the Danish gambit even thought Black has a pawn on c5 instead of e5. One website says:

    Danish Gambit br> A two-pawn gambit for a strong development for white and a totally chaotic, open board game. You'd better have something up your sleeve!

    1.e4 e5 2.d4 exd4 3.c3 dxc3 4.bc4 cxb2 5.Bxb2

    Club Capablanca – Juan Corzo
    Correspondence game
    Danish Gambit

    http://www.chesshistory.com/winter/extra/corzo.html

    1 e4 e5 2 d4 exd4 3 c3 dxc3 4 Bc4 cxb2 (‘The theorists consider that it is dangerous to accept the third pawn. Nonetheless in practice the position is defendable and Mieses, that great advocate of the Danish Gambit, has suffered reverses, such as the game he lost to Maróczy in the Paris tournament of 1900, which seem to demonstrate quite the opposite. In other words, the danger involved in playing this opening is greater for White than for Black.&rsquo 5 Bxb2 d6 6 Nf3 Qe7 7 O-O Be6 8 Qb3 Nd7 9 Bxe6 Qxe6 (‘A fundamental error. 9...fxe6, followed by 10...Nc5 would have given Black a solid position.) 10 Qxb7 Rb8 (‘When I played this move I saw the attack with which I should be confronted, but I preferred a rapid death to the kind that would have awaited me if I had played 10...Nb6 or some similar move leaving me with the same number of pawns and an inferior position.&rsquo 11 Qxc7 Rxb2 12 Qc8+ Ke7 13 Nd4 Qxe4 14 Nc6+ Kf6 15 Qxd7 (‘15 Nc3, and if 15...Qf5 then 16 Rad1, would seem very strong.&rsquo 15...Rc2 16 Nxa7 d5

    17 Nc3 (‘An unexpected sacrifice which proves sound.&rsquo 17...Rxc3 18 Nb5 Rc2 (‘The position is interesting. Another possible defensive move is 18...Rc4, but the entry of the White rook and the bad position of the Black king would make the second player’s situation almost desperate.&rsquo 19 Rae1 Re2 20 Qc6+ Qe6 21 Qc3+ Kg6 22 Qd3+ Re4 23 f3 Bc5+ 24 Kh1 Nf6 25 fxe4 Nxe4 (‘The decisive error. 25...dxe4 would have left drawing chances.&rsquo 26 Nc7 (‘Well played. If 26 Nc3, Black could have drawn by perpetual check: 26...Re8 27 Nxd5 Qxd5 28 Qxd5 Nf2+ 29 Kg1 Nh3+.&rsquo 26...Qe5 27 Nxd5 f5 28 Nf4+ Kg5 29 Rxe4 (‘Brilliant and decisive. Black is irretrievably lost irrespective of whether he accepts the sacrifice.&rsquo Black resigned.
  6. 19 Mar '07 22:06
    Originally posted by 93confirmed
    I guess it's categorized as the Danish gambit even thought Black has a pawn on c5 instead of e5. One website says:

    Danish Gambit br> A two-pawn gambit for a strong development for white and a totally chaotic, open board game. You'd better have something up your sleeve!

    1.e4 e5 2.d4 exd4 3.c3 dxc3 4.bc4 cxb2 5.Bxb2

    Club Capablanca – Juan Corzo ...[text shortened]... lack is irretrievably lost irrespective of whether he accepts the sacrifice.&rsquo Black resigned.
    it looks ugly for white...
    acurate play from black, and he can stop white's attack and hold on to both pawns...
    at least that's what it looks like
  7. 19 Mar '07 23:45
    Originally posted by rubberjaw30
    it looks ugly for white...
    acurate play from black, and he can stop white's attack and hold on to both pawns...
    at least that's what it looks like
    I just realized that this game is played after 1..e5 not the Sicilian version with 1...c5. White still plays the same moves but it's still a different board with the pawn on e7 and not c7.
  8. 20 Mar '07 02:29
    Originally posted by 93confirmed
    Does anyone know the name for this variation of the Sicilian opening?

    1.e4
    1...c5
    2.d4
    2...cxd4
    3.c3
    3...dxc3
    4.Bc4
    4...cxb2
    5.Bxb2

    [fen]rnbqkbnr/pp1ppppp/8/8/2B1P3/8/PB3PPP/RN1QK1NR w KQkq - 0 1[/fen]
    White has better gambit tries in the Sicilian:

    [Event "Friendly Game, 3m + 0s"]
    [Site "Main Playing Hall"]
    [Date "2007.03.18"]
    [Round "?"]
    [White "Zeljo Vuk"]
    [Black "CMSMaster"]
    [Result "1-0"]
    [ECO "B50"]
    [WhiteElo "2009"]
    [BlackElo "1525"]
    [PlyCount "81"]
    [EventDate "2007.03.18"]
    [TimeControl "180"]

    1. e4 {2} c5 {2} 2. Nf3 {1} d6 {0} 3. b4 {1} cxb4 {2} 4. d4 {1} Nf6 {5} 5. Bd3
    {1} Nc6 {2} 6. a3 {1} bxa3 {4} 7. Bxa3 {1} e6 {2} 8. c3 {1} d5 {4} 9. e5 {5}
    Nd7 {4} 10. Bxf8 {3} Nxf8 {1} 11. Na3 {1} Nd7 {3} 12. Nb5 {1} f6 {4} 13. Nd6+ {
    2} Ke7 {3} 14. Qe2 {13} fxe5 {13} 15. dxe5 {5} Qc7 {6} 16. Ng5 {15} Ndxe5 {10}
    17. Nxc8+ {11} Raxc8 {6} 18. O-O {1} Kd6 {16} 19. f4 {14} Nxd3 {5} 20. Qxd3 {1}
    Qb6+ {6} 21. Kh1 {1} Ne7 {12} 22. Nf7+ {1} Kd7 {4} 23. Nxh8 {5} Rxh8 {1} 24.
    Rab1 {1} Qc7 {3} 25. f5 {10} Nxf5 {CMSMaster offers a draw 18} 26. Qb5+ {8} Qc6
    {7} 27. Qd3 {7} Rf8 {3} 28. h3 {10} Qc8 {5} 29. Rf2 {9} Nd6 {3} 30. Rfb2 {4} b6
    {6} 31. Qxh7 {4} Rf7 {3} 32. Qg6 {2} Qf8 {2} 33. Qd3 {7} Rf2 {6} 34. Rxf2 {8}
    Qxf2 {1} 35. Rg1 {1} Qf5 {1} 36. Qd2 {1} Qe5 {1} 37. Qc2 {2} Qe4 {1} 38. Qa4+ {
    2} Ke7 {2} 39. Qxa7+ {1} Kf6 {2} 40. Qa1 {0} Qd3 {1} 41. Rf1+ {
    Time (Lag: Av=0.50s, max=4.5s) 1} 1-0
  9. 20 Mar '07 15:13
    Originally posted by 93confirmed
    Does anyone know the name for this variation of the Sicilian opening?

    1.e4
    1...c5
    2.d4
    2...cxd4
    3.c3
    3...dxc3
    4.Bc4
    4...cxb2
    5.Bxb2

    [fen]rnbqkbnr/pp1ppppp/8/8/2B1P3/8/PB3PPP/RN1QK1NR w KQkq - 0 1[/fen]
    It might be worth an outing some time, who knows? But the main problem could be if black doesn't play 4...cxb2 but just continues with 4...e6 then moves like Nc6 and a6. Sooner or later white will have nothing better to do than play Nxc3 anyway, thereby transposing into main lines of the Smith/Morra Gambit, which I think are pretty OK for black. One offbeat idea I've thought of trying but not yet plucked up the courage to play is 1.e4 c5 2.d4 cxd4 3.c3 dxc3 4.Nxc3 Nc6 5.Bc4 e6 6.f4!? Probably dubious but you never know...
  10. 20 Mar '07 16:05
    Originally posted by Northern Lad
    It might be worth an outing some time, who knows? But the main problem could be if black doesn't play 4...cxb2 but just continues with 4...e6 then moves like Nc6 and a6. Sooner or later white will have nothing better to do than play Nxc3 anyway, thereby transposing into main lines of the Smith/Morra Gambit, which I think are pretty OK for black. One off ...[text shortened]... 1.e4 c5 2.d4 cxd4 3.c3 dxc3 4.Nxc3 Nc6 5.Bc4 e6 6.f4!? Probably dubious but you never know...
    That's exactly what happened in my last game. Black played 4...e6 so I continued with Nxc3.

    Your idea of 6. f4 seems interesting and I'm going to try sometime soon.