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Originally posted by AThousandYounge5 is definitely not standard in the Najdorf; unless White plays 6 Be2 (and I still don't like it there; the d5 hole is a real problem) OR later, AFTER e6, in response to a kingside pawn storm by White, IF the position allows it. I would say a good rule of thumb is don't play it, unless you have to.
[b/]If you play e6 you need to play Be7 to hold the d6 Pawn which is weak. I'd have played 6...Nf6. Also I generally play an early ...a6 to keep my opponent's minor pieces off b5.
"consider rook sacs on c3."
I didn't k ...[text shortened]... I think), because it leaves that beatiful outpost for White on d5.[/b]
This all illustrates why the Dragon SUCKS! Weak d5 outpost, white Bc4 strongpoint, waste time doing non tempo pawn moves to fianchetto bishops, perhabs the need to sacrefice a rook, etc. . . You need a more SOLID Sicilian. I'm sure you read up the Dragon and became a huge fan of it, because of it's hee-haw Dragon vs Yugoslav or Keres attack games, an attacking player like you probably likes this, but Black's winning chances with the Dragon against the Yugoslav is not high, black goes down fighting, but that's about it, he goes down fighting. Also, white can play the Maroczy Bind against the accelerated dragon, and this is a real black killer IMHO.
Originally posted by mateulosewhatever man i love the dragon and i have been playing it for 6 years now with a lot of succes. if you play it correctly you won't lose a tempo anyway. SOLID = BORING
This all illustrates why the Dragon SUCKS! Weak d5 outpost, white Bc4 strongpoint, waste time doing non tempo pawn moves to fianchetto bishops, perhabs the need to sacrefice a rook, etc. . . You need a more SOLID Sicilian. I'm sure you read up the Dragon and became a huge fan of it, because of it's hee-haw Dragon vs Yugoslav or Keres attack games, an att ...[text shortened]... can play the Maroczy Bind against the accelerated dragon, and this is a real black killer IMHO.
the najdorf thats what i call loss of tempo making like 20 pawn moves before actualy starting to develope.
try the sveshnikov if you don't like the dragon.
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Originally posted by LordOfTheChessboardDon't take it personally. SUCKS here is equal to "mateulose does not like it". I am not a Sicilian player, but I love Pirc which sometimes transposes to Dragon. Dragon is fun to play for and against. I would say that on the white side of Sicilian I have most difficult time against Najdorf, but it does not mean much in terms of soundness/unsoundness of certain line🙂
whatever man i love the dragon and i have been playing it for 6 years now with a lot of succes. if you play it correctly you won't lose a tempo anyway. SOLID = BORING
the najdorf thats what i call loss of tempo making like 20 ...[text shortened]... to develope.
try the sveshnikov if you don't like the dragon.
Originally posted by LordOfTheChessboardYou apparently don't know the Najdorf very well if you think that it requires a lot of pawn moves before developing; I think the standard set up requires one more pawn move early and that's a very aggressive one: b5. The Dragon has to be played very accurately against the White castling Queenside and pawn storm or you can get a quick smash; the Najdorf is more tactically varied and aggressive. Why do you think Fischer and Kasparov played it? To make 20 pawn moves?
whatever man i love the dragon and i have been playing it for 6 years now with a lot of succes. if you play it correctly you won't lose a tempo anyway. SOLID = BORING
the najdorf thats what i call loss of tempo making like 20 pawn moves before actualy starting to develope.
try the sveshnikov if you don't like the dragon.
Originally posted by no1marauderkasparov also played the dragon and all other siccian lines. White can get smashed as easy as white in the dragon if he does not play precisely.
You apparently don't know the Najdorf very well if you think that it requires a lot of pawn moves before developing; I think the standard set up requires one more pawn move early and that's a very aggressive one: b5. The Dragon has to be played very accurately against the White castling Queenside and pawn storm or you can get a quick smash; t ...[text shortened]... y varied and aggressive. Why do you think Fischer and Kasparov played it? To make 20 pawn moves?
Originally posted by LordOfTheChessboardActually I wasn't criticizing the Dragon per se like you were criticizing the Najdorf. Most lines of the Sicilian are very playable and give good winning chances to Black if he knows the lines. I still think the Kingside pawn storm is more dangerous against the dragon than the Najdorf, but hey it's a personal preference.
kasparov also played the dragon and all other siccian lines. White can get smashed as easy as white in the dragon if he does not play precisely.
Originally posted by paultopiaWell, personally I like playing Bc4 against the Sicilian; it pressures the center. The Bishop is generally going to be forced back to b3 after Black plays b5, but it still working on the diagonal esp. d5. However, if Black plays e6, he's biting on granite, although their are plenty of games with a sac at e6 (I'm in one now as White):
no1marauder, would you expound on the basic plans in the najdorf? I mean, "attack up the c file," sure... but otherwise? and how it handles this Bc4 business?
thanks.
They're a standard setup for Black in the Najdorf. I'll give it to 'ya. Pawns: a6, b5,d6,e6,f7,g7,h7
Knights: d7,f6
Bishops: b7, e7
Rooks: c8, f8
Queen: c7
King: g8
Just put the Black pieces on the board in this configuration and you'll see the basic plan: the Rook and Queen attack down the c-file, the Bishop is on the long diagonal aimed at White's king side, the other Bishop and one Knight are basically for defensive purposes on the Kingside; the other Knight is preventing e5 and threatening c4.
One thing I've noticed is that if White castles Queen side and starts setting up a Kingside pawn storm, it is often a good idea to delay or not castle at all! Why give him a target and the King is well defended in the standard setup. But you always have to think aggressively; you can't just play passively in the Najdorf or you'll get overwhelmed. And keep on your toes for tactical opportunities for BOTH sides; they're there in pretty much every Najdorf game.
If you have any specific questions or want some representative games I've played on the site (some good, some not so good although I have an excellent record here with the Najdorf) I'll give you some links; I'm not Iron31 but I've been playing the line for about 30 years so I've given and taken my lumps with it!
Originally posted by paultopiaPaul,
WHERE WAS THE BLUNDER?????????????????????????????????????
I'm not sure what the others are on about with lines, Najdorfs and Dragons, but the way I see it looking at the board (without any opening theory) is that after 6. Nxd4, he has 3 pieces attacking b5, which is something I don't like, so I would have pushed the a pawn (I'm a firm believer in pushing a, h pawns, especially if required as in here).
Apart from that, I had to admire your opponents play. Very, very nice.
D
Originally posted by paultopiaTrue enough, but it would have stopped his attack which hinged around b5.
if 6. ... a6, wouldn't I have been insurmountably far behind in development? he already had 3 pieces out to my one...
If you were very worried about development, then yuo could have played 6. ..Nf6 and 7. ..a6. As it stood, your development of the Bishop was just a waste of 2 moves, because of his strength on b5.
I'm not saying you would have won if you played a6, but it would have given him something to be thinking about, rather than having 2 knight outposts on the 5th rank.
D
Originally posted by no1marauderThanks no1marauder. I wouldn't mind seeing a representative game or two if you have any in mind 🙂
Well, personally I like playing Bc4 against the Sicilian; it pressures the center. The Bishop is generally going to be forced back to b3 after Black plays b5, but it still working on the diagonal esp. d5. However, if Black plays e6, he's biting on granite, although their are plenty of games with a sac at e6 (I'm in one now as White):
T ...[text shortened]... 31 but I've been playing the line for about 30 years so I've given and taken my lumps with it!