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Posers and Puzzles

Posers and Puzzles

  1. 28 May '05 13:58 / 1 edit
  2. 28 May '05 14:13
    Of course it is a "drawish" position, but I don't see a 'forced' draw if black does not take on h4 after Ra4.
  3. 28 May '05 14:23
    Originally posted by Mephisto2
    Of course it is a "drawish" position, but I don't see a 'forced' draw if black does not take on h4 after Ra4.
    The point wasn't really to find a forced draw, but to make the (only) right move that leads to an equal position.
  4. 28 May '05 20:22
    Well Ra4 looks promising. Defendsthe pawn indirectly. 1. Ra4 Rxh4 2. Kg5 Rh1 (2... Txa4 stalemate) 3. Ra7+ and the pawn on g6 will die.
  5. 28 May '05 21:13
    What's wrong with 1.Ra7+ Kf8!? (or 1...Kf6 2.Ra6+ Ke7 3.Ra7+ Kd6 4.Kg5! Rg3+ 5.Kh6 =) 2.Kg5! Rg3+ 3.Kh6! Rg4 4.Rg7=
    Or perhaps I am missing something?
  6. 29 May '05 02:02
    Originally posted by ilywrin
    Or perhaps I am missing something?
    1...Kh6 perhaps.
  7. Standard member Lockheed
    Nobody Special
    29 May '05 18:29
    Originally posted by schakuhr
    [fen]8/6k1/R5p1/7p/5K1P/7r/8/8 - - 3 51[/fen]
    I don't know if I'm missing something, but if the white rook moves to a4 black wins. Ra4 is followed by Rxh4+. White moves his king and loses his rook. Did I read the board incorrectly somehow?

    It seems like a good move for white would be Kg5.
  8. 29 May '05 18:37
    Originally posted by Lockheed
    I don't know if I'm missing something, but if the white rook moves to a4 black wins. Ra4 is followed by Rxh4+. White moves his king and loses his rook. Did I read the board incorrectly somehow?

    It seems like a good move for white would be Kg5.
    The point of the puzzle is that Ra4 Rxh4+ Kg5 Rxa4 = stalemate
  9. Subscriber BigDoggProblem
    The Advanced Mind
    29 May '05 20:47
    Originally posted by Lockheed
    I don't know if I'm missing something, but if the white rook moves to a4 black wins. Ra4 is followed by Rxh4+. White moves his king and loses his rook. Did I read the board incorrectly somehow?

    It seems like a good move for white would be Kg5.
    1.Kg5? Rg3+ 2.Kf4 Rg4+ wins the h-pawn. I'd imagine Black wins with the two connected passers.

    It appears that only 1.Ra4! draws. The puzzle has a nice paradox to it - at first this move looks like a senseless blunder, yet it is the only move that saves the game.
  10. Standard member Lockheed
    Nobody Special
    30 May '05 07:30
    Originally posted by Mephisto2
    The point of the puzzle is that Ra4 Rxh4+ Kg5 Rxa4 = stalemate
    My point is that I don't understand <i>why</i> that equals stalemate. If black takes white's pawn and rook he can force mate by making a pawn run. Hell he doesn't have to do that. It's just quicker. You can checkmate someone with a king and a rook if all he's got left is his king.
  11. 30 May '05 07:57
    Originally posted by Lockheed
    My point is that I don't understand <i>why</i> that equals stalemate. If black takes white's pawn and rook he can force mate by making a pawn run. Hell he doesn't have to do that. It's just quicker. You can checkmate someone with a king and a rook if all he's got left is his king.
    Have a look again. After Ra4 Rxh4+ Kg5 Rxa4, white has to move. He is not in check, but what move can he make?
  12. 30 May '05 13:15
    Originally posted by THUDandBLUNDER
    1...Kh6 perhaps.
    Apparantely So embarassing...
    And after 1.Ra4! Kh6!? 2.Ke5 Rg3 3.Rb4 Rg4 4.Rxg4 hxg4 5.Kf4 Kh5 6.Kg3 g5 7.hxg5 Kxg5 8.Kg2 the game is a dead draw.
  13. Standard member Lockheed
    Nobody Special
    30 May '05 17:40
    Originally posted by Mephisto2
    Have a look again. After Ra4 Rxh4+ Kg5 Rxa4, white has to move. He is not in check, but what move can he make?
    Ah! Thank you. I completely forgot the possiblity of that sort of stalemate for a moment there. I was thinking to myself, "These guys are nuts. You can draw this thing out to fifty moves when your opponent has two pawns and a rook to his name!"
  14. Standard member Lockheed
    Nobody Special
    30 May '05 18:12
    Originally posted by schakuhr
    [fen]8/6k1/R5p1/7p/5K1P/7r/8/8 - - 3 51[/fen]
    Well okay. It still seems like black can win if white moves Ra4. Help me out here:

    1. Ra4 Rxh4+ 2. Kg5 Rg4+ 3. Rxg4 h5xg4

    After that, whether or not the white king takes the pawn at g4 (which he probably will), black can force a pawn through to promotion. Though looking at it, it seems like white can still force a draw at that point. Is it possible for black to avoid the stalemate? (I'm quickly turning this into a lesson for which I apologize)
  15. 30 May '05 18:26
    Originally posted by Lockheed
    Well okay. It still seems like black can win if white moves Ra4. Help me out here:

    1. Ra4 Rxh4+ 2. Kg5 Rg4+ 3. Rxg4 h5xg4

    After that, whether or not the white king takes the pawn at g4 (which he probably will), black can force a pawn through to promotion. Though looking at it, it seems like white can still force a draw at that point. Is it possible for black to avoid the stalemate? (I'm quickly turning this into a lesson for which I apologize)
    That is a theoretical draw (after 4.Kxg4 or even Kh4 or Kf4). The black king cannot get in front of his pawn. Black can push the pawn, supported by his king, but the only thing white has to make sure of is that it has to be black's move (i.e. white has the opposition) in the following position:



    black cannot make progress since g3+ Kg1 Kg3 (if not the pawn is lost) = stalemate.

    If white were to move, then black wins easily e.g.Kg1 g3 and white has only Kh2 allowing black's king to move to f2 and promote the pawn