Did the First Humans Arrive Earlier in North America?

Originally posted by twhitehead
I still say that there are two key problems:
1. The evidence does not conclusively point to humans or our relatives.
2. The dating is based on the age of the bones, which does not conclusively date either the breakage date or the date of the other supposed activity such as moved rocks or a tusk stood upright.
When they find a hearth, or stone age tools, then they might be on to something.

I generally agree with you that the evidence of humans is scant, considering the time frame and lack of other artifacts. But to your point #2, the study authors claim:

The CM site contains spiral-fractured bone and molar fragments, indicating that breakage occured while fresh. Several of these fragments also preserve evidence of percussion. The occurrence and distribution of bone, molar and stone refits suggest that breakage occurred at the site of burial. Five large cobbles (hammerstones and anvils) in the CM bone bed display use-wear and impact marks, and are hydraulically anomalous relative to the low-energy context of the enclosing sandy silt stratum.

Originally posted by wildgrass
I generally agree with you that the evidence of humans is scant, considering the time frame and lack of other artifacts. But to your point #2, the study authors claim:

The CM site contains spiral-fractured bone and molar fragments, indicating that breakage occured while fresh. Several of these fragments also preserve evidence of percussion. The occ ...[text shortened]... ically anomalous relative to the low-energy context of the enclosing sandy silt stratum.

So if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck...... And those bones were definitely quacked🙂

I googled "where did humans come from", already knowing the current well-established view, but wanting to see it again as a baseline for my next question, which is where did neanderthals come from. I'm just looking for, you know, the birthplace, the migration routes, and etc. But I guess I'm not very good at this, because I got distracted by something shiny!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2507377/Humans-NOT-come-Earth--sunburn-bad-backs-pain-labour-prove-expert-claims.html

Daily mail, I know, but it is so stupid it is funny! The weird thing is that, when I stop laughing, I'm not sure it is completely wrong. It does, for example, suggest an explanation for the Garden.

I'm laughing again, darn it. Big jump, indeed!

Originally posted by apathist
I

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2507377/Humans-NOT-come-Earth--sunburn-bad-backs-pain-labour-prove-expert-claims.html

I find that both hilarious and totally appalling that some people actually believe all this trash. The link starts with;

"... A U.S. ecologist says conditions such as bad backs and sunburn suggest humans did not evolve alongside other life on Earth
In a new book, Dr Ellis Silver says aliens put humans our planet as recently as tens of thousands of years ago
He suggests the Earth might be a prison planet, since humans seem to be a naturally violent species and are here until we learn to behave ourselves
..."

"bad backs and sunburn" "proves" we don't originate from planet Earth?
How so?
There exists other Earth animals that sometimes get sunburn and back problems.
And Earth might be a "prison planet"?
So aliens punish people not by a cost effective way of imprisoning them on their home planet but stupidly waste vast amount of time and precious resources on transporting violent criminals to a hospitable planet many light years away that is paradise to life presumably to 'punish' them for their crimes? If all humans are judged to be so bad, why not just kill us all instead? Unless all these aliens are completely stupid, this makes no sense whatsoever.

Originally posted by humy
I find that both hilarious and totally appalling that some people actually believe all this trash. The link starts with;

"... A U.S. ecologist says conditions such as bad backs and sunburn suggest humans did not evolve alongside other life on Earth
In a new book, Dr Ellis Silver says aliens put humans our planet as recently as tens of thousands of years ...[text shortened]... kill us all instead? Unless all these aliens are completely stupid, this makes no sense whatsoever.

He said 'suggests' and right away you quote "proves". Close your mind enough and you wont get oxygen anymore. And for prison planet, have you met australia.

I don't like being the devil's advocate, but cheez wiz you could make it harder.

Originally posted by apathist
And for prison planet, have you met australia.

.

Australia isn't many light years away requiring insanely massive amount of time cost and resources to transport criminals there. Why didn't we ever used Mars instead of Australia as a prison area? -Even now with our space technology, it would be insanely costly to do that when we can make a vastly cheaper prison closer to home.

He said 'suggests' and right away you quote "proves".

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2507377/Humans-NOT-come-Earth--sunburn-bad-backs-pain-labour-prove-expert-claims.html
"...
Humans do NOT come from Earth – and sunburn, bad backs and pain during labour PROVE it
..." (my emphasis)

Originally posted by apathist
He said 'suggests' and right away you quote "proves". Close your mind enough and you wont get oxygen anymore. And for prison planet, have you met australia.

I don't like being the devil's advocate, but cheez wiz you could make it harder.

So you are buying into the alien influence theory? Even though we share 97% of our genes with neandertals who have been around for hundreds of thousands of years? We can see changes in our DNA from analysis of DNA from 10,000 years ago and see a definite trend, DNA changes AFTER the supposed alien abduction bullshyte.

You just need to study the issue a bit deeper before going off the deep end, even as devils advocate.

Originally posted by sonhouse
So you are buying into the alien influence theory? Even though we share 97% of our genes with neandertals who have been around for hundreds of thousands of years? We can see changes in our DNA from analysis of DNA from 10,000 years ago and see a definite trend, DNA changes AFTER the supposed alien abduction bullshyte.

You just need to study the issue a bit deeper before going off the deep end, even as devils advocate.

I dunno. Back problems are a thing. Sunburns, childbirth, general malaise. The evidence is there. The theory implies inter-breeding between the prisoners and Neandertals too. So there goes your whole argument. As to how our ancestors got here from there, the means of transporting primitive humans across light years of space....

"..perhaps by arriving on meteors and comets"

is plausible. The prisoners must have been trained to time their jump off the meteor before it hit the ground.

Originally posted by wildgrass
I dunno. Back problems are a thing. Sunburns, childbirth, general malaise. The evidence is there. The theory implies inter-breeding between the prisoners and Neandertals too. So there goes your whole argument. As to how our ancestors got here from there, the means of transporting primitive humans across light years of space....

"..perhaps by arriving on ...[text shortened]... The prisoners must have been trained to time their jump off the meteor before it hit the ground.

let's see. A meteor hits the ground doing say, 10,000 miles per hour or about 3 miles per second. That represents losing about 80 % of it's kinetic energy in the atmosphere where it was going about 60,000 mph when it hit air.

So the meteor is now a meteoroide but it has undergone temperatures high enough to melt iron on its journey to hit the ground, and at our hypothetical 10,000 mph or 3 mile per second velocity, it undergoes maybe 2000 g's of decel as it plows into the Earth, creating a large hole in the ground which incidentally sends out a huge plume of Earth stuff and melted and broken meteor bits into the surrounding area.

In that maelstrom, we are to believe some alien hitchhiker SURVIVES that carnage and then goes on to mutate the native primate or early human DNA stock to create US, the obvious peak of creation?

Does that about cover it?

Originally posted by humy
Australia isn't many light years away requiring insanely massive amount of time cost and resources to transport criminals there. Why didn't we ever used Mars instead of Australia as a prison area? -Even now with our space technology, it would be insanely costly to do that when we can make a vastly cheaper prison closer to home.

[quote] He said 'suggests' and r ...[text shortened]... do NOT come from Earth – and sunburn, bad backs and pain during labour PROVE it
..." (my emphasis)

England shipped criminals to a far off place, rather than just killing the buggers. Glad you agree.

PROVE it, I'm not going to revisit that rag, so I'll take your word.

Originally posted by sonhouse
So you are buying into the alien influence theory? Even though we share 97% of our genes with neandertals who have been around for hundreds of thousands of years? We can see changes in our DNA from analysis of DNA from 10,000 years ago and see a definite trend, DNA changes AFTER the supposed alien abduction bullshyte.

You just need to study the issue a bit deeper before going off the deep end, even as devils advocate.

We found them in California. Don't harsh on me, just attend.

I don't think the alien culture has been here yet. But I don't know. I think we are not alone, wouldn't that be weird if we were?

In all this massive universe, human people are oh so special. Bet you not!

Originally posted by sonhouse
In that maelstrom, we are to believe some alien hitchhiker SURVIVES that carnage and then goes on to mutate the native primate or early human DNA stock to create US, the obvious peak of creation?

Does that about cover it?

Exactly. Hopefully in the book this "expert" scientist explains: 1) How the prisoners were able to climb onto the meteor. 2) What they ate/drank on the ~75,000 year trip on a meteor. 3) Where they found/generated breathable air. 4) How they aimed/steered the meteor towards the only habitable planet in our solar system. 5) How they withstood the immense g forces on landing.

Originally posted by wildgrass
Exactly. Hopefully in the book this "expert" scientist explains: 1) How the prisoners were able to climb onto the meteor. 2) What they ate/drank on the ~75,000 year trip on a meteor. 3) Where they found/generated breathable air. 4) How they aimed/steered the meteor towards the only habitable planet in our solar system. 5) How they withstood the immense g forces on landing.

To say nothing of the 2 or 3 thousand degree temperature going through the atmosphere.

What poppycock. Are they trying to sell this as a movie script? That's what it sounds like.

I can see it now, Ok staff, get Sigourney Weaver on the phone, we need a female alien lead.....