1. Joined
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    23 May '09 11:00
    Originally posted by FabianFnas
    snip...
    A big problem with tournaments is about the sand-baggers. *This* is a big problem!


    Hiya Fab

    snips, and new thread to try and reduce it to one problem at a time. Hopefully I have not changed the meaning of what you wrote.

    On sandbaggers, I'd need a definition first. There have been a dozen arguments about this one, so let's start from the start. What do you mean by sandbaggers?

    1) People who deliberately dump their rating so that they can enter a low tourney band, and get a tournament win?
    2) People who go away, resigning all their games, and come back rated 600, but in a 1800+ tourney (because their TER is still high)?
    3) Something else?

    Thanks,
    Gezza
    p.s. I exaggerate the numbers, but you get the point.
  2. Standard memberO Artem O
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    25 May '09 19:191 edit
    I just found out that in my 1450-1500 tourny we got a 1800-1900 player current rating of around 1000. I am not calling him a sangbagger but i looked at his tourny wins an most of his wins are in very low rating tournys highest being in 1550-1600 range and lowest 0-1000
    i have never played him before and i was wondering if any one has played User 434816 Duckboy before and does he do this regularly or what?
    tnx
  3. Standard memberDaemon Sin
    I'm A Mighty Pirateā„¢
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    25 May '09 22:311 edit
    Originally posted by O Artem O
    I am not calling him a sangbagger but i looked at his tourny wins an most of his wins are in very low rating tournys highest being in 1550-1600 range and lowest 0-1000
    Tournament 4233
  4. Standard memberO Artem O
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    25 May '09 22:36
    Originally posted by Daemon Sin
    Tournament 4233
    yep there u go, ill will send him a PM
    and what do u think of him?
  5. Joined
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    26 May '09 01:25
    I'm just curious (having only been on the site a little while,) why would someone do this? Just to make their little pencil happy? There's no money involved and pride comes from what you accomplish against odds so what is the point?
  6. Standard memberO Artem O
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    26 May '09 01:27
    Originally posted by TerrierJack
    I'm just curious (having only been on the site a little while,) why would someone do this? Just to make their little pencil happy? There's no money involved and pride comes from what you accomplish against odds so what is the point?
    well some people really do go away and come back to a low rating, but other I would have to think do it for the tourny wins or maybe they like bulling weak players....who knows....
  7. Standard memberbarstudd
    dinky-di Aussie
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    26 May '09 03:35
    I dont believe resigning games should be as easy as it is, there should be something in place to stop people resigning games that are not necessarily lost.
    Limiting resignations should fix sand bagging.
  8. Standard memberSwissGambit
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    26 May '09 04:05
    Rating floors would largely eliminate this problem. Take your established 1800+, and do not let his rating ever drop below 1600. Then he can never run amok in an U1200 tourney.
  9. Standard memberO Artem O
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    26 May '09 15:12
    about floor rating, how about having a floor rating but if you rating goes bellow it, you just can not enter those tornys, because thats what all the commotion is about.

    from what i understand, in the current proposal your rating can go down below that point at all. That right?
  10. Standard memberSwissGambit
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    26 May '09 16:48
    Originally posted by O Artem O
    about floor rating, how about having a floor rating but if you rating goes bellow it, you just can not enter those tornys, because thats what all the commotion is about.

    from what i understand, in the current proposal your rating can go down below that point at all. That right?
    They've already tried the Tournament Entry Rating. It has failed to stop the sandbagging.

    Real rating floors, on the other hand, solve the problem for ALL forms of rated competition. I mean, why should the rating of an established player be allowed to drop so low in the first place? Odds are, it is not due to an actual decrease in playing strength.
  11. Standard memberO Artem O
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    26 May '09 17:25
    Originally posted by SwissGambit
    They've already tried the Tournament Entry Rating. It has failed to stop the sandbagging.

    Real rating floors, on the other hand, solve the problem for ALL forms of rated competition. I mean, why should the rating of an established player be allowed to drop so low in the first place? Odds are, it is not due to an actual decrease in playing strength.
    ow I actually looked at USCF site and saw that other players had a current floor rating, didnt know that before. and i dont have enough games to get one yet. so if my floor rating is say 1400 and i resign 100 games it will stay at 1400. right?
  12. Standard memberSwissGambit
    Caninus Interruptus
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    26 May '09 19:56
    Originally posted by O Artem O
    ow I actually looked at USCF site and saw that other players had a current floor rating, didnt know that before. and i dont have enough games to get one yet. so if my floor rating is say 1400 and i resign 100 games it will stay at 1400. right?
    Correct.
  13. Joined
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    01 Jun '09 14:41
    i like the tournament entry rating as a floor,

    max 100 below highest score, else (CurrentRating + HighestRating) / 2

    wouldn't mind seeing it reflected in game by game scoring either

    there are some massive dips in scores from some who resign a multitude of games, then if you happen to bump into one in a tournnament, bang

    you cop a beating because although they're really quite good - their score is not an accurate reflection of their ability..

    i don't mind if their score stays low, but it seems a tad unfair to be on the other end of the stick

    whinge whinge whinge whinge whinge

    don't get me wrong, love this place a little too much, but sort out these creeps please........
  14. Joined
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    01 Jun '09 18:291 edit
    With all tools you destroys the truth of ranking. If you made a floor-rating the rating of all people will goes up; so in three years we are all better than the worldchampion in the real live.
    Also no influence to calculation the rating by winning by timeouts, this is in the real world also.
  15. Standard memberPhlabibit
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    01 Jun '09 20:58
    Originally posted by Hannilein007
    With all tools you destroys the truth of ranking. If you made a floor-rating the rating of all people will goes up; so in three years we are all better than the worldchampion in the real live.
    Also no influence to calculation the rating by winning by timeouts, this is in the real world also.
    As it stands with no ratings floor, there are users losing out on ratings points they should have earned, or stripped of ratings points being beaten by a low-rated sand bagger.

    Anyway, rating is just a number not to be compared with ratings in other systems. If I'm rated 1500 and you're rated 1700 we know you're better. What is the difference if I were rated 1700 and you were 2100? We'd still have a feeling for our chess strength. Plus, the inflation isn't going to be noticeable if at all noticed.

    P-
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