1. Illinois
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    29 Aug '08 11:38
    Back in August, Stuart Shepard of "Focus on the Family", one of America's leading evangelical groups, asked Christians to pray for rain on the day Obama would give his acceptance speech at Invesco Field, where 80,000+ people were expected to cheer Obama on.

    YouTube

    Despite the prayers of Mr. Shepard and the many evangelicals who prayed along with him, August 28th turned out to be a gorgeous 80 degree day with clear blue skies. It's safe to say, God didn't answer their prayers.

    But is it that simple? Could their prayers have backfired?

    Consider that on the same day of Obama's speech, Republican officials said they are considering delaying the GOP convention in Minneapolis-St. Paul because of Tropical Storm Gustav. This storm threatens the Republicans and their nominee in a few poignant ways:

    (1) For Bush and Republican presidential candidate John McCain, Gustav threatens to provide an untimely reminder of Hurricane Katrina. A new major storm along the Gulf Coast would renew memories of one of the low points of the Bush administration, while pulling public attention away from McCain's formal coronation as the GOP presidential nominee.

    (2) Senior Republicans said images of political celebration in the Twin Cities while thousands of Americans flee a hurricane could be dubious. Staging a convention during a major natural disaster would be a public relations challenge for either political party. But GOP officials say the burden could be especially heavy for their party, whose reputation was tarred by the Bush administration's bungling of Katrina and its aftermath in 2005.

    (3) A hurricane in the Gulf of Mexico could cast unwelcome attention on the offshore oil rigs that McCain has championed as a solution to rising gasoline prices -- they are now being evacuated in the face of the coming storm.

    (4) "You would have to dramatically change the nature of what you do. Much less partisan. Much less political," said the official, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because internal discussions are ongoing. He added that all the speakers would have to retool their addresses to reflect the storm and its impact. "Otherwise, it's the elephant in the room."

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/28/AR2008082803165_2.html?hpid=topnews

    _________


    Any thoughts?
  2. Joined
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    29 Aug '08 11:452 edits
    Originally posted by epiphinehas
    Back in August, Stuart Shepard of "Focus on the Family", one of America's leading evangelical groups, asked Christians to pray for rain on the day Obama would give his acceptance speech at Invesco Field, where 80,000+ people were expected to cheer Obama on.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ohxdvio9n2Q

    Despite the prayers of Mr. Shepard and the many e icle/2008/08/28/AR2008082803165_2.html?hpid=topnews

    _________


    Any thoughts?
    I can just see McCain and company standing on a bridge waving their hands wildly for help after a Hurricane came through. The only problem with that would be, who would blame Bush for not helping them? After all, those on the left would be ecstatic because their opponents were in dire straights and those on the right would not want to attack Bush. LOL.

    I would just like to say that praying for any ones ill is a big no, no. I think it very possible that things you wish on other people will more than likely come to visit your own sorry buttocks.
  3. Joined
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    29 Aug '08 11:57
    Originally posted by epiphinehas
    Back in August, Stuart Shepard of "Focus on the Family", one of America's leading evangelical groups, asked Christians to pray for rain on the day Obama would give his acceptance speech at Invesco Field, where 80,000+ people were expected to cheer Obama on.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ohxdvio9n2Q

    Despite the prayers of Mr. Shepard and the many e ...[text shortened]... icle/2008/08/28/AR2008082803165_2.html?hpid=topnews

    _________


    Any thoughts?
    Lord, please don't let me grin or gloat.

    Pray for our leaders, always.
  4. Standard memberRajk999
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    29 Aug '08 12:03
    Originally posted by whodey
    ..I would just like to say that praying for any ones ill is a big no, no. .....
    But its no big deal.
    Christians all over the world are being taught that as long as you are born again and accept Christ as your personal saviour ... you are saved and your salvation is assured.
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    29 Aug '08 12:06
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    But its no big deal.
    Christians all over the world are being taught that as long as you are born again and accept Christ as your personal saviour ... you are saved and your salvation is assured.
    Do you still have a problem with that?

    Which thread would you like to continue this debate on? Not here.
  6. Standard memberRajk999
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    29 Aug '08 12:18
    Originally posted by jaywill
    Do you still have a problem with that?

    Which thread would you like to continue this debate on? Not here.
    Im just making the point that born-again Christians are saved. They dont need to do good works and pray with humility. I mean Christ does not care about that. Christ just wants you to worship Him with your mouth. So its no surprise that Christians are praying for rain becuse they dont like Obama.

    Christians who are taught that they are saved, generally dont do good works.

    No, no need to discuss it further.
  7. Joined
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    29 Aug '08 12:392 edits
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    Im just making the point that born-again Christians are saved. They dont need to do good works and pray with humility. I mean Christ does not care about that. Christ just wants you to worship Him with your mouth. So its no surprise that Christians are praying for rain becuse they dont like Obama.

    Christians who are taught that they are saved, generally dont do good works.

    No, no need to discuss it further.
    Rajk999,

    If Christians act loosely after being taught security of the GIFT of salvation, how is that the fault of the teaching ?

    In this case the answer is not to adopt an "elevator salvation" - saved this morning, unsaved in the afternoon, saved again at bedtime, unsaved again the next afternoon - saved, lost, saved, lost, ... 10 times a week !

    The answer is to teach OTHER incentives to "overcome" beside the lose of redemption which only confuses and weakens Christian foundations.

    I'm ready to debate it with you. You have made a number of charges particularly towards me. I am ready to defend the security of eternal redemption.

    Where? What thread ?
  8. Standard memberRajk999
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    29 Aug '08 12:55
    Originally posted by jaywill
    .. If Christians act loosely after being taught security of the GIFT of salvation, how is that the fault of the teaching ? ..
    For one Christ never taught that. He taught works+faith+ baptism=salvation.

    If kids act badly after being told they will go to Disney World regardless of their behaviour, is not that the fault of the parents ?
  9. Joined
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    29 Aug '08 13:084 edits
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    But its no big deal.
    Christians all over the world are being taught that as long as you are born again and accept Christ as your personal saviour ... you are saved and your salvation is assured.
    The same good word is there for everyone to read and the same God is there for everyone to seek, therefore, we should all be held equally accountable accordingly. Make your own observations.

    So what does the good book say about cheering when your adversaries fall? Last time I checked it warns us against it.
  10. Joined
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    29 Aug '08 13:261 edit
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    For one Christ never taught that. He taught works+faith+ baptism=salvation.

    If kids act badly after being told they will go to Disney World regardless of their behaviour, is not that the fault of the parents ?
    ==================================
    For one Christ never taught that. He taught works+faith+ baptism=salvation.
    ===================================


    Actually He taught that salvation = Himself, Jesus Christ.

    =================================
    If kids act badly after being told they will go to Disney World regardless of their behaviour, is not that the fault of the parents ?
    ====================================


    The New Testament definitely shows consequences for failing to be sanctified. It is just that you don't like the consequences because they fall short of losing the GIFT of eternal redemption.

    You are blaming immaturity on being born.

    Am I wrong or do you read more books ABOUT the Bible than the Bible itself ?
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