02 Oct 11
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Originally posted by DasaSo if I eat meat I have taken my choice away but if I don't eat meat i haven't taken my choice away?
You eat meat because you are a slave to your senses.
You believe you have freedom - but being a slave to your senses you have taken away your choice to eat meat or not eat meat.
While you are a slave you are not free.
How are you free if you only follow the words of another?
02 Oct 11
Originally posted by tomtom232Like I said, he is one of those who is a slave to his religion and
So if I eat meat I have taken my choice away but if I don't eat meat i haven't taken my choice away?
How are you free if you only follow the words of another?
does not realize it. We all are a slave to sin, however.
02 Oct 11
Originally posted by tomtom232There is no credit to being a vegetarian unless one has transcendental knowledge and follows the spiritual path towards love of God.
I actually only eat fish and poultry which is not considered meat by the meat packing companies.
Vegetarianism in and of itself is useless - without higher transcendental knowledge and pure living in all areas of ones life.
Even the elephants are vegetarians - and they are not returning home back to Godhead.
True religion/spirituality has basic requirements for the student to follow- and vegetarianism is just one of the basic requirements - being one of the 4 pillars of religion.
Spiritual vegetarianism is not just about not eating meat - but its about having a higher understanding why we should not kill - and having knowledge of the soul within all living creatures.
You may be a vegetarian atheist - hence your vegetarianism means nothing.
02 Oct 11
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Originally posted by DasaI eat meat and I bloody well know I had better eat vegetables if I want my body to work right. So I have a choice. I eat both. I am free. I am free in such a way as to not give a rats arse if I approach some theoretical godhead.
You eat meat because you are a slave to your senses.
You believe you have freedom - but being a slave to your senses you have taken away your choice to eat meat or not eat meat.
While you are a slave you are not free.
02 Oct 11
Originally posted by DasaYou are a slave and will never be set free without accepting Yahsua as
There is no credit to being a vegetarian unless one has transcendental knowledge and follows the spiritual path towards love of God.
Vegetarianism in and of itself is useless - without higher transcendental knowledge and pure living in all areas of ones life.
Even the elephants are vegetarians - and they are not returning home back to Godhead.
True rel ...[text shortened]... l living creatures.
You may be a vegetarian atheist - hence your vegetarianism means nothing.
your Savior. You can not work your way free.
02 Oct 11
Originally posted by RJHindsI have never said you work your way free.
You are a slave and will never be set free without accepting Yahsua as
your Savior. You can not work your way free.
However i have said you must develop love of God to return back to Godhead.
Now....to develop love of God you must become self controlled and give up material entanglement and attachment to the things of this world.
This is where the work begins.......to work towards controlling the mind and sense and to giving up attachment to the objects of the senses.
No one can do this for you.
Blood cannot do it for you.
Atonement cannot do it for you.
Confession cannot do it for you.
It is you that must act to become pure.
You cannot pray for purity - for that is like praying to have a full belly.
If you want a full belly you must get to work and plant those crops.
02 Oct 11
Originally posted by sonhouseYou are commenting about Godhead from the platform of ignorance.....not knowledge.
I eat meat and I bloody well know I had better eat vegetables if I want my body to work right. So I have a choice. I eat both. I am free. I am free in such a way as to not give a rats arse if I approach some theoretical godhead.
If you had transcendental knowledge you would not make the many comments you do make.
You have no knowledge of Godhead or the spiritual way - and you are criticising it.
That does not make sense.
When you have knowledge of Godhead and the spiritual way then you may criticize or not criticize - but without knowledge then your comments are baseless.
And to have knowledge means to have internalized knowledge - not just academic knowledge.
Academic knowledge is head knowledge - and spiritual awareness is heart knowledge and thus lending itself to spiritual insight.
With spiritual insight you would not make many of the comments you have made in the past.
02 Oct 11
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Originally posted by DasaYes, the Holy Bible says that he who does not work does not eat or
I have never said you work your way free.
However i have said you must develop love of God to return back to Godhead.
Now....to develop love of God you must become self controlled and give up material entanglement and attachment to the things of this world.
This is where the work begins.......to work towards controlling the mind and sense and to giving ...[text shortened]... ng to have a full belly.
If you want a full belly you must get to work and plant those crops.
something to that effect. But We do not pray for food but pray to
give thanks to God for providing the way to get the food and to make
it good for our bodies. I already love God because He loved me first
by sending His only begotten Son to suffer and die to pay the price
for my sins with His sinless blood. If I still have to work hard to control
senses I am unable to fully control, what good is it for God to send His
Son here to suffer for nothing. Instead of evolving, we humans have
devolved so much that we can not stop sinning without help. That is
why God at the request of His Son sent the Holy Spirit as a helper and
teacher. So why must you do it all alone by yourself? Or do you also
have a helper?
03 Oct 11
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Originally posted by DasaInteresting. You've said time and time again on this forum that you do not present "higher spiritual knowledge" and "transcendental knowledge" here because most are "not qualified" to appreciate on account of being meat eaters and not understanding that "killing [animals] is wrong".
There is no credit to being a vegetarian unless one has transcendental knowledge and follows the spiritual path towards love of God.
Vegetarianism in and of itself is useless - without higher transcendental knowledge and pure living in all areas of ones life.
Even the elephants are vegetarians - and they are not returning home back to Godhead.
True rel ...[text shortened]... l living creatures.
You may be a vegetarian atheist - hence your vegetarianism means nothing.
You've often said that someone getting this "basic requirement" right - is a prerequisite to you going on to revealing "higher understanding" to them so that they can hear something deeper from you about Vedic teaching. And yet now here you are, confronted with a fellow poster who is a vegetarian, and you shift the goalposts immediately.
You now say someone's "vegetarianism means nothing" - presumably unless you say so - and that "there is no credit to being a vegetarian unless one has transcendental knowledge" already. So having insisted many times that the horse must be put before the cart, you are now all of sudden saying that the cart must be put before the horse.
So what will it actually take to persuade you to start presenting "higher spiritual knowledge" here Dasa, having admitted that you have not done so yet?
03 Oct 11
Originally posted by DasaExactly what criticism did I make in that post? I said I did not give a rats arse whether I am spiritually in tune with some godhead or not. I am indifferent to your insults.
You are commenting about Godhead from the platform of ignorance.....not knowledge.
If you had transcendental knowledge you would not make the many comments you do make.
You have no knowledge of Godhead or the spiritual way - and you are criticising it.
That does not make sense.
When you have knowledge of Godhead and the spiritual way then you may cr ...[text shortened]... ht.
With spiritual insight you would not make many of the comments you have made in the past.
03 Oct 11
Originally posted by sonhouseI do not insult anyone - but rather I present the truth of the situation which can be upsetting if taken the wrong way.
Exactly what criticism did I make in that post? I said I did not give a rats arse whether I am spiritually in tune with some godhead or not. I am indifferent to your insults.
Most persons are choosing to take what I present the wrong way to create conflict or straw-man arguments.
When I say you - I mean everyone including you..
In the past means - for the last 12 months.
However if some one can put together a polite question I will respond.
My responses to the polite question will be limited - because if persons are having trouble understanding that NOT KILLING is a requirement to begin the spiritual life then I cannot go deep into higher knowledge and the reason should be obvious.
However I have given detailed comments before - and persons have over looked the entire post and have concentrated on one or two words from that post and have made argument from those words - and have neglected the entire essence of the post.
FMF does this with almost every post - and he does this to create conflict where there is no conflict.
Nothing would be more pleasing for me - if persons had a genuine interest in spirituality and stopped creating straw-man complaints in defence of their falsity.
03 Oct 11
Originally posted by DasaI'm saying this as politely and as kindly as I can.
I do not insult anyone - but rather I present the truth of the situation which can be upsetting if taken the wrong way.
Most persons are choosing to take what I present the wrong way to create conflict or straw-man arguments.
When I say you - I mean everyone including you..
In the past means - for the last 12 months.
However if some one can put toge ...[text shortened]... interest in spirituality and stopped creating straw-man complaints in defence of their falsity.
Much of what you say is good and healthy both physically and spiritually, but you are wrong in the aggregate.(my belief)
This is a debate forum. It's for debating. But you insist on lecturing. You must find a way to make your case and provide proofs and irrefutable logic and reason to back it up.
When someone criticises what you say, you must try to refute them. Be objective.
Appeals to a higher authority in the person of God will do little if anything to persuade your readers. You're not preaching to the choir. This is a level playing field. If someone does an open field tackle on you don't be dismayed. It's a legal move.
You really should refrain from using terms like "dishonest", or the like, when referring to your debate opponent. I think it is safe to assume that the posters in this forum are not liars, or deliberately dishonest. After 6 years in here I feel I know most of them fairly well. They are not dishonest people. They are wrong about a lot of stuff, but so are you and I.
Above all else, find the humor embedded in this forum. You'll find peace in it.