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Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

Originally posted by xs
Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

First of all, are you a Jew currently living in Israel? If not, you have nothing to worry about...well, except law enforcement finding out you possess slaves.

Originally posted by xs
Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

In the Bible, the term nations is meant in the racial, rather than the political sense. Presumably, your friend believes you share more racial affiliation with Canadians than with Mexicans.

Ignore Darfius's answer, as he has forgotten that the United States is Israel.

Originally posted by Wulebgr
In the Bible, the term nations is meant in the racial, rather than the political sense. Presumably, your friend believes you share more racial affiliation with Canadians than with Mexicans.

Ignore Darfius's answer, as he has forgotten that the United States is Israel.

He's right, it doesn't matter where you live. What matters is that you're an Orthodox Jew who is engaged in war. Remember to release your slave after 6 years of service and to treat him fairly.

Originally posted by Darfius
First of all, are you a Jew currently living in Israel? If not, you have nothing to worry about...well, except law enforcement finding out you possess slaves.

Are you saying that Jews living in Israel can posses slaves?
That is, there is no moral problem with the possesion of slaves
as long as you are Jewish and live Israel?

Nemesio

Originally posted by Nemesio
Are you saying that Jews living in Israel can posses slaves?
That is, there is no moral problem with the possesion of slaves
as long as you are Jewish and live Israel?

Nemesio

Nope, I was mistaken. I ammended the mistake.

Originally posted by Darfius
Nope, I was mistaken. I ammended the mistake.

I'm sorry, but I want to be clear on your position.

Is it permissible to own a slave? If so, under what
conditions? If not, what about the passage cited by xs?

Nemesio

Originally posted by Nemesio
I'm sorry, but I want to be clear on your position.

Is it permissible to own a slave? If so, under what
conditions? If not, what about the passage cited by xs?

Nemesio

Copied from my ammended position:

"He's right, it doesn't matter where you live. What matters is that you're an Orthodox Jew who is engaged in war. Remember to release your slave after 6 years of service and to treat him fairly."

I feel I must add that Christians view this as superfluous, because Jesus released us from the laws of the Old Testament (except the Commandments). And His message that we love our enemies as our friends neatly dismisses the possibility of owning a slave.

Originally posted by Darfius
"He's right, it doesn't matter where you live. What matters is that you're an Orthodox Jew who is engaged in war. Remember to release your slave after 6 years of service and to treat him fairly."

So, to return to my question, a Jew who lives in Israel (which is at war
with Palestine) can morally possess a slave (for 6 years)? God would
not find this to be morally problematic?

I feel I must add that Christians view this as superfluous, because Jesus released us from the laws of the Old Testament (except the Commandments). And His message that we love our enemies as our friends neatly dismisses the possibility of owning a slave.


He released us from being BOUND by the old Laws, but we could still
follow them. His Laws cannot be evil or wrong, but they don't lead to
eternal life. Remember, not one jot or tittle of the Law will pass away.

Since America is at war with Iraq, can I not own an Iraqi prisoner
for six years (assuming I keep all the other Laws)?

Nemesio

Originally posted by Nemesio
Originally posted by Darfius
[b]"He's right, it doesn't matter where you live. What matters is that you're an Orthodox Jew who is engaged in war. Remember to release your slave after 6 years of service and to treat him fairly."

So, to return to my question, a Jew who lives in Israel (which is at war
with Palestine) can morally possess a ...[text shortened]... can I not own an Iraqi prisoner
for six years (assuming I keep all the other Laws)?

Nemesio[/b]

On the contrary, to follow even one law is a slap in the face of God. You would be implying that Jesus' sacrifice was not enough. Are you not aware that Paul was very vehement about that?

Originally posted by Darfius
On the contrary, to follow even one law is a slap in the face of God. You would be implying that Jesus' sacrifice was not enough. Are you not aware that Paul was very vehement about that?

Why do you conclude this? All St Paul says is that 'the Law cannot
save.' He does not say that 'to follow the Law is an insult to God.'
And he does not exclude the possibility of following the Law to the
letter and salvation. If I keep kosher because I believe in ritual
cleanliness and I profess that Jesus is my Lord and Savior and live
a loving Christian life, how is this a slap in God's face?

And, I'll ask this again: if God's Word is eternal and inerrant, how
could following it lead me into sin? That is, by noting that I am at
war with Iraq, how can following the guidlines of Leviticus ever lead me
into sin?

Are you saying that following the guidelines 'given by God' in Leviticus
contradict the guidelines 'given by God' in the NT?

Nemesio

Originally posted by Darfius
On the contrary, to follow even one law is a slap in the face of God. You would be implying that Jesus' sacrifice was not enough. Are you not aware that Paul was very vehement about that?

I'm much relieved to know that I have slapped God in the face through my rigid adherence to 'You shall not commit adultery.' Now I can freely pursue my neighbor's wife.

Originally posted by Nemesio
Why do you conclude this? All St Paul says is that 'the Law cannot
save.' He does not say that 'to follow the Law is an insult to God.'
And he does not exclude the possibility of following the Law to the
letter and salvation. If I keep kosher because I believe in ritual
cleanliness and I profess that Jesus is my Lord and Savior and live
a loving ...[text shortened]... 'given by God' in Leviticus
contradict the guidelines 'given by God' in the NT?

Nemesio

Yes, I am saying that, because God warned that's how it would be from His first contact with us. He didn't change His mind, He simply changed the situation. Ritual cleansing? That would be implying that Jesus' blood was not enough to cleanse you.

Originally posted by Wulebgr
I'm much relieved to know that I have slapped God in the face through my rigid adherence to 'You shall not commit adultery.' Now I can freely pursue my neighbor's wife.

If you'll note, I pointed out that we were free from all laws but the 10 Commandments.

Originally posted by Darfius
Yes, I am saying that, because God warned that's how it would be from His first contact with us. He didn't change His mind, He simply changed the situation. Ritual cleansing? That would be implying that Jesus' blood was not enough to cleanse you.

So God's Word, then, is not eternal nor inerrant, for following the
strictures of the OT would then constitute a sin.

And, what is your Scriptural support for believing that adherence
to the Old Law (as such) is an insult to God? How do you reconcile
this with the idea that 'the Law will never be abolished' said by
Jesus, Himself?

Nemesio