1. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
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    07 Dec '13 03:283 edits
    "In many parts of the world, Christmas..."

    In many parts of the world, Christmas is a wonderful traditional occasion for families and friends to gather for the giving and receiving of gifts. The greatest gift ever given was prophesied by Isaiah centuries ago: "For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us; And the government will rest on His shoulders; And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace. There will be no end to the increase of His government or of peace, On the throne of David and over his kingdom, To establish it and to uphold it with justice and righteousness From then on and forevermore. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will accomplish this." Isaiah 9:6-7 New American Standard Bible.

    Jesus Christ is God's perfect gift to all mankind. He is the source of all happiness and security in time and for all eternity. When you choose to accept His Grace Gift, you will receive eternal salvation. It’s impossible to fully appreciate this unique gift without first understanding the Grace of God. Though no one ever earns or deserves anything from God, in His Infinite Love He freely provides everything for us to have an eternal relationship with Him: "For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast." Ephesians 2:8-9. God’s Plan of Grace and Truth is learned through Jesus Christ: “For the Law was given through Moses; grace and truth were realized through Jesus Christ.” John 1:17

    Jesus Christ is the unique person of the universe: undiminished deity and true humanity inseparably united in one person forever. He is the visible manifestation and revelation of invisible God. "No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten Son of God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him." John 1:18 and in Hebrews 1:1-2: "God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world." The only issue for eternal relationship with God is a person's attitude toward the Person of Jesus Christ, God’s Perfect Gift. "What do you think about the Christ?" Matthew 22: 42. "He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey [the command to believe in] the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him." John 3:36 (to be continued)
  2. Standard memberwolfgang59
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    07 Dec '13 05:17
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    The greatest gift ever given was prophesied by Isaiah centuries ago: "For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us; ... And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace.
    Didn't prophecy his name would be Jesus Christ then?
  3. Standard membercaissad4
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    07 Dec '13 05:53
    December 25 is actually the conception and late September is actual birth. References to the age diff. of John the Baptist and Jesus and the approx. birthdate of John the Baptist are given in your holy book. I figure the invention of this event at this date has much to do with the Winter Solstice and/or the celebrated birth of the god Mithras.
  4. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
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    07 Dec '13 09:161 edit
    Originally posted by wolfgang59
    Didn't prophecy his name would be Jesus Christ then?
    His name/title "Christ the Messiah" would become known after His First Advent.
  5. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
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    07 Dec '13 09:271 edit
    Originally posted by caissad4
    December 25 is actually the conception and late September is actual birth. References to the age diff. of John the Baptist and Jesus and the approx. birthdate of John the Baptist are given in your holy book. I figure the invention of this event at this date has much to do with the Winter Solstice and/or the celebrated birth of the god Mithras.
    Fact is we don't know the precise timing of this unique event with certainty. I'm not familiar with your reference to "the age diff. of John the Baptist" as a benchmark. Speculation has reasoned that it may well have been in March or April nearer to Spring (since shepherds wouldn't tend their flocks of sheep up on the hills in the dead of Winter); and that the date of remembrance was later changed after Christ's Resurrection and Ascension to coincide with the "Winter Solstice" as you suggest. A quick Google will in all likelihood furnish additional details. Thanks for your thoughtful comments
  6. SubscriberSuzianne
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    07 Dec '13 15:183 edits
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    Fact is we don't know the precise timing of this unique event with certainty. I'm not familiar with your reference to "the age diff. of John the Baptist" as a benchmark. Speculation has reasoned that it may well have been in March or April nearer to Spring (since shepherds wouldn't tend their flocks of sheep up on the hills in the dead of Winter); and t ...[text shortened]... ck Google will in all likelihood furnish additional details. Thanks for your thoughtful comments
    Bob, check the early Gospels (Luke 1, for example) for details of Zacharias and Elisabeth, John's parents. The timeline between the pregnancies of Elisabeth and Mary are there. I, too, believe Jesus' real birthtime was sometime in September. This is what the smart money says, despite Christians' zeal to have Jesus born in Springtime to coincide with Easter. I've already been over this many times with RJH.

    EDIT: It appears that Zacharias and Elisabeth only appear in Luke, chapter 1.
  7. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
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    07 Dec '13 16:301 edit
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    Bob, check the early Gospels (Luke 1, for example) for details of Zacharias and Elisabeth, John's parents. The timeline between the pregnancies of Elisabeth and Mary are there. I, too, believe Jesus' real birthtime was sometime in September. This is what the smart money says, despite Christians' zeal to have Jesus born in Springtime to coincide with East ...[text shortened]... imes with RJH.

    EDIT: It appears that Zacharias and Elisabeth only appear in Luke, chapter 1.
    Thank you, Suzi. As always, you contribute to these site forums in a meaningful way.

    Note: Yes, uninformed blind zeal generates much more heat than light; no one gains.
  8. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
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    07 Dec '13 22:181 edit
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    "In many parts of the world, Christmas..."

    In many parts of the world, Christmas is a wonderful traditional occasion for families and friends to gather for the giving and receiving of gifts. The greatest gift ever given was prophesied by Isaiah centuries ago: "For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us; And the government wi ...[text shortened]... in] the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him." John 3:36 (to be continued)[/b]
    As deity, Jesus Christ possesses all the divine attributes: sovereignty, righteousness, justice, love, eternal life, omniscience, omnipotence, omnipresence, immutability and veracity. Jesus Christ is the Creator and Sustainer of the universe. John 1:3 NASB "All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being." and Colossians 1:16-17 "For by [in] Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through Him and for Him. He is before [or has existed prior to] all things, and in Him all things hold together [or endure]." Jesus Christ declares His eternal existence and equality with God the Father: John 10:30 "I and the Father are one."

    At the same time He is eternal God, Jesus Christ in His incarnation became true humanity. John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." ... "And the Word became flesh, and [tabernacle, lived temporarily] dwelt among us, and we saw His glory, glory as of the only begotten [or unique, one of a kind] from the Father, full of grace and truth." John 1:14

    Through this unique Person, God in His Grace expressed His love to the entire human race. His love was demonstrated to us through Jesus Christ who became true humanity to be our substitute and pay the penalty for our sins. If we are to have eternal life, our sins must be forgiven and blotted out. Jesus Christ did not come into the world simply to perform miracles; to alleviate suffering; or even to teach eternal principles of life and death. He also came for the express purpose of dying [a spiritual death of separation from God the Father] on the cross for your sins and mine and for the sins of the entire world.

    "Just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give His life a ransom for many." Matthew 20:28 and 1 Peter 3:18a: "For Christ also died for sins once for all, the just for the unjust, in order that He might bring us to God." At the cross, Jesus Christ accomplished salvation and He offers eternal life to everyone who will believe in Him. "And I give eternal life to them, and they shall never perish; and no one shall snatch them out of My hand." John 10:28 (to be cont'd)
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