1. Zugzwang
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    20 Sep '15 20:544 edits
    I decided to post this here because Richard Dawkins, an outspoken atheist, seems more
    widely recognized as a name in the Spirituality forum than in any other forum at RHP.

    It hardly seems a coincidence that the target of Richard Dawkins's
    criticism (he already has quite a reputation for Islamophobia) is a
    14 year old schoolboy of black African Muslim heritage.

    http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/sep/20/richard-dawkins-questions-ahmed-mohamed-motive-backlash

    "Richard Dawkins questions Ahmed Mohamed's 'motives' and sparks backlash"
    --Martin Pengelly (20 September 2015)

    After he encountered strong 'backlash' on Twitter, Richard Dawkins
    began to tone down his criticisms of Ahmed Mohamed. Given the famous
    Americans (ranging from President Obama to Steve Wozniak) who
    already have come out in support of Ahmed Mohamed, even Richard
    Dawkins started to realize that he was not going to win this public battle.
    At least Richard Dawkins should be happy knowing that a profound thinker
    (sarcasm intended) such as Sarah Palin was in his (former) corner.

    I would like to criticize some US media hype around Ahmed Mohamed.
    Let's suppose a 14 year old student invented an alarm clock. That's
    nice--perhaps he should enter in a local science or engineering fair.
    But it should *not already* qualify him to enter MIT. There are many
    very intelligent, dedicated students who are denied admission to MIT
    When the time comes for Ahmed Mohamed to apply to MIT, I hope that
    he will be considered according to his merits and not this incident's publicity.
    Being invited to the White House is a memory worth keeping, but it should
    not give him any advantage over equally innovative students with less publicity.

    Although it might already be too late (in the age of social media), I hope that
    Ahmed Mohamed can experience a relatively 'normal' adolescence and be
    remembered more for his mature achievements rather than for only this incident.
  2. Joined
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    20 Sep '15 22:29
    The boy built an alarm clock?

    Obama says he didn't build that. 😛
  3. Standard memberDasa
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    20 Sep '15 23:131 edit
    Originally posted by Duchess64
    I decided to post this here because Richard Dawkins, an outspoken atheist, seems more
    widely recognizfor the sake od Isla.ed as a name in the Spirituality forum than in any other forum at RHP.

    It hardly seems a coincidence that the target of Richard Dawkins's
    criticism (he already has quite a reputation for Islamophobia) is a
    14 year old schoolboy ...[text shortened]... lescence and be
    remembered more for his mature achievements rather than for only this incident.
    Lets all come running to criticise the security people because they were cautions about what looked like a bomb.

    Considering Islamic suicide bombers of all ages and sex kill indiscriminately,........then the security personal should take all precaution's.( ALL THE TIME)

    Point in any direction at any time of the day, and there is a Muslim bombing and murdering or torturing or raping or kidnapping or thieving or decapitating a person.

    Every second, 5 people are victims of Islamic violence.

    The blood is flowing and you say Richard Dawkins has Islamophobia.

    How utterly absurd.

    Hatred of Islam has a cause.

    That cause is the Ugliness and the disgusting violence of Islam...........for the sake of Islam.
  4. Standard memberRJHinds
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    21 Sep '15 00:031 edit
    Originally posted by Duchess64
    I decided to post this here because Richard Dawkins, an outspoken atheist, seems more
    widely recognized as a name in the Spirituality forum than in any other forum at RHP.

    It hardly seems a coincidence that the target of Richard Dawkins's
    criticism (he already has quite a reputation for Islamophobia) is a
    14 year old schoolboy of black African Musl ...[text shortened]... lescence and be
    remembered more for his mature achievements rather than for only this incident.
    The boy may be too young and inexperienced to be faulted for the religion of his parents. It is also nice that he learned how to build a digital clock, but there is nothing really exceptional about that.

    What he is being faulted with is not getting permission from his teacher to do what he did and suddenly surprising his teacher with something he should have known would be looked upon with suspicion. It looked something like a suitcase time bomb.

    Airsoft Mock Suitcase Time Bomb

    YouTube

    Airsoft Briefcase Time Bomb Prop

    YouTube
  5. SubscriberFMF
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    21 Sep '15 00:18
    Originally posted by Dasa
    Every second, 5 people are victims of Islamic violence..
    Are you sure it's not 8 or 9 people, or that it's every half-second?
  6. Standard memberRJHinds
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    21 Sep '15 00:241 edit
    Originally posted by FMF
    Are you sure it's not 8 or 9 people, or that it's every half-second?
    I believe Dasa is just being conservative. 😏
  7. Cape Town
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    21 Sep '15 07:16
    Originally posted by Duchess64
    It hardly seems a coincidence that the target of Richard Dawkins's
    criticism (he already has quite a reputation for Islamophobia) is a
    14 year old schoolboy of black African Muslim heritage.
    Do you have anything to say about what Dawkins said other than the comment about his supposed prior reputation of Islamophobia? I see nothing Islamophobic in Dawkins' comments.
    If the video he linked shows the actual device the boy presented then the video is correct that it was not an invention but merely an alarm clock ripped out of its box and placed in a new case. Why the boy did that we have no idea. And I agree with Dawkins that he should not have been arrested.
  8. Standard memberRJHinds
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    21 Sep '15 10:38
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    Do you have anything to say about what Dawkins said other than the comment about his supposed prior reputation of Islamophobia? I see nothing Islamophobic in Dawkins' comments.
    If the video he linked shows the actual device the boy presented then the video is correct that it was not an invention but merely an alarm clock ripped out of its box and placed ...[text shortened]... he boy did that we have no idea. And I agree with Dawkins that he should not have been arrested.
    My wife said the boy did it on purpose to scare his teacher. Look at that big grin on his face.
  9. Cape Town
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    21 Sep '15 12:09
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    My wife said the boy did it on purpose to scare his teacher. Look at that big grin on his face.
    Your wife is just speculating.
    It remains the case that:
    1. He should not have been arrested.
    2. The teachers were pretty dumb if they genuinely got scared.

    If the boy did do it to scare his teacher then it suggests a rather phobic atmosphere at the school.

    If my son or a Muslim boy took a device like that to school here in SA I doubt any of his teachers would think it was a bomb. (and there are plenty of Muslims at my sons School.)
  10. Zugzwang
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    21 Sep '15 20:491 edit
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    Do you have anything to say about what Dawkins said other than the comment about his supposed prior reputation of Islamophobia? I see nothing Islamophobic in Dawkins' comments.
    If the video he linked shows the actual device the boy presented then the video is correct that it was not an invention but merely an alarm clock ripped out of its box and placed ...[text shortened]... he boy did that we have no idea. And I agree with Dawkins that he should not have been arrested.
    "..about his (Richard Dawkins) supposed prior reputation of Islamophobia?"
    --Twhitehead

    I already have posted articles about Richard Dawkins being criticized for Islamophobia,
    but some people here have ignored them or prefer to pretend that these criticisms don't exist.

    http://www.salon.com/2013/08/10/richard_dawkins_does_it_again_new_atheisms_islamophobia_problem/

    "Richard Dawkins Does It Again: New Atheism's Islamophobia Problem.
    Richard Dawkins goes on another ignorant Twitter rampage.
    The ugly underbelly of his worldview is anti-Muslim hate."
    --Nathan Lean

    http://www.salon.com/2014/09/06/richard_dawkins_sam_harris_and_aheists_ugly_islamophobia_partner/

    "Richard Dawkins, Sam Harris, and Atheists' Ugly Islamophobia"
    --C.J. Werleman

    http://www.salon.com/2015/01/07/richard_dawkins_goes_on_anti_islam_rant_blames_charlie_hebdo_massacre_on_entire_religion/

    "Richard Dawkins Goes on Anti-Islam Rant: Blames Charlie Hebdo Massacre on Entire Religion (update)"
    --Sarah Gray

    "(Richard) Dawkins has an extensive history of Twitter trolling--whether about religion
    (specifically) anti-Islam, sexism or abortion and down syndrome."
    --Sarah Gray

    It's easy to find many criticisms of Richard Dawkins for being Islamophobic.
    I suspect that some atheists, however, will keep dishonestly denying that such criticisms exist.

    "It's about time that the ugly underbelly of his rational atheistic disgust is exposed for it really is."
    --Nathan Lean (author of _The Islamophobia Industry: How the Right Manufactures Fear of Muslims_)
  11. Subscribersonhouse
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    21 Sep '15 21:00
    Originally posted by Duchess64
    "..about his (Richard Dawkins) supposed prior reputation of Islamophobia?"
    --Twhitehead

    I already have posted articles about Richard Dawkins being criticized for Islamophobia,
    but some people here have ignored them or prefer to pretend that these criticisms don't exist.

    http://www.salon.com/2013/08/10/richard_dawkins_does_it_again_new_atheisms_isl ...[text shortened]... -Nathan Lean (author of _The Islamophobia Industry: How the Right Manufactures Fear of Muslims_)
    Dawkins may have put out Islamophobia statements but why is it a big deal he is putting down Islam? What is the difference an atheist puts down Christianity and Islam equally? I am certainly no friend of organised religions but it IS Islam extremists beheading and killing school boys. I don't know of any Christians in this century doing that, I imagine there was a lot of that by Christians in the Crusades and maybe the witch hunts.

    So if someone attacks Islam because of extremists is there any difference in attacking extremist Christians?

    Isn't it in both the Quran and the bible where 'God' commands death of enemies?

    Isn't that right there in both scriptures? And if we say, we don't follow that anymore because we are Christians, but still go on killing like they did in Pakistan against Hindu's, are we wrong in blaming the religion itself?
  12. Zugzwang
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    21 Sep '15 21:214 edits
    Originally posted by sonhouse
    Dawkins may have put out Islamophobia statements but why is it a big deal he is putting down Islam? What is the difference an atheist puts down Christianity and Islam equally? I am certainly no friend of organised religions but it IS Islam extremists beheading and killing school boys. I don't know of any Christians in this century doing that, I imagine ther ...[text shortened]... killing like they did in Pakistan against Hindu's, are we wrong in blaming the religion itself?
    Richard Dawkins demonizes Islam and (diverse) Muslims much more harshly than he
    attacks Christianity and Christians. Richard Dawkins is a de facto ally of some extreme
    right-wing fundamentalist Christians and Jews in hating Islam and all Muslims.

    Why the difference? It's much more politically advantageous *in a Western society* for
    Richard Dawkins to demonize Islam and Muslims than Christianity and Christians.
    Richard Dawkins shows no 'moral courage' in 'piling on' by attacking the easiest target.
    If Richard Dawkins were living (without armed guards) in Pakistan, for instance, and
    making the same criticisms of Islam and Muslims, then he would show some courage.

    Did you (Sonhouse) even bother to read any of the linked articles that I cited?
    Most Westerners who criticize Richard Dawkins for Islamophobia are *not* Muslims, let
    alone 'Muslim fundamentalists'. Indeed, many of his critics tend to agree with Richard
    Dawkins on some issues while rejecting his crude cartoonish stereotyping of all Muslims.

    As an atheist and a feminist, I am a critic in some ways of Islam and many Muslims.
    I also am a critic of the other Abrahamic religions, Christianity and Judaism.
    But there's a difference between making a rational criticism of Judaism and using
    anti-Semitic stereotypes (like the Nazis did) to incite hatred against all Jews.
    And Richard Dawkins has been using Islamophobic stereotypes to incite similar hatred.
    Richard Dawkins also has been widely criticized for his sexism and misogyny, but that's another subject.
  13. Standard memberRJHinds
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    21 Sep '15 21:511 edit
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    Your wife is just speculating.
    It remains the case that:
    1. He should not have been arrested.
    2. The teachers were pretty dumb if they genuinely got scared.

    If the boy did do it to scare his teacher then it suggests a rather phobic atmosphere at the school.

    If my son or a Muslim boy took a device like that to school here in SA I doubt any of his teachers would think it was a bomb. (and there are plenty of Muslims at my sons School.)
    1. He should have been arrested because there was probable cause and evidence - the fake briefcase time-bomb.

    2. The teachers should have gotten scared for the safety of all the children, especially, since it looked like a briefcase time-bomb. A believe many parents would have been upset with the teachers, if it blew up and injured or killed their childern. Perhaps not you.

    As the police spokesman said It is better to be safe than sorry.
  14. Standard memberRJHinds
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    21 Sep '15 22:00
    Originally posted by Duchess64
    Richard Dawkins demonizes Islam and (diverse) Muslims much more harshly than he
    attacks Christianity and Christians. Richard Dawkins is a de facto ally of some extreme
    right-wing fundamentalist Christians and Jews in hating Islam and all Muslims.

    Why the difference? It's much more politically advantageous *in a Western society* for
    Richard Dawkins ...[text shortened]... Dawkins also has been widely criticized for his sexism and misogyny, but that's another subject.
    Richard Dawkins should demonizes Islam and Muslims much more harshly than he attacks Christianity and Christians or Judaism and the Jews, because it is Islam and Muslims that are doing most of the evil in the world today.
  15. Subscribersonhouse
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    25 Sep '15 11:02
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    Richard Dawkins should demonizes Islam and Muslims much more harshly than he attacks Christianity and Christians or Judaism and the Jews, because it is Islam and Muslims that are doing most of the evil in the world today.
    I guess it is not evil when Christians are attacking Hindu's in India. As we speak.
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