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Spirituality

Spirituality

  1. Standard member dj2becker
    rentrer à la maison
    04 Jun '18 16:55
    I would like to challenge Rajk or TOO, or both, to provide me with one example from scripture of someone who was declared righteous without faith. An example where it is specifically stated or implied that they had no faith would be ideal.
  2. Subscriber Rajk999
    Enjoying
    04 Jun '18 17:13
    Originally posted by @dj2becker
    I would like to challenge Rajk or TOO, or both, to provide me with one example from scripture of someone who was declared righteous without faith. An example where it is specifically stated or implied that they had no faith would be ideal.
    Rehab the harlot.
    Cyrus King of Persia.

    There are dozens of examples of faith without righteousness who will be cast out of the Kingdom of God.

    Faith is nothing on its own and does not always lead to righteousness
  3. Standard member Romans1009
    Cretinous Mutterings
    04 Jun '18 17:23
    Originally posted by @rajk999
    Rehab the harlot.
    Cyrus King of Persia.

    There are dozens of examples of faith without righteousness who will be cast out of the Kingdom of God.

    Faith is nothing on its own and does not always lead to righteousness
    <<Rehab the harlot.>>

    “By faith the harlot Rahab perished not with them that believed not, when she had received the spies with peace.”

    (Hebrews 11:31)
  4. 04 Jun '18 21:07
    Originally posted by @dj2becker
    I would like to challenge Rajk or TOO, or both, to provide me with one example from scripture of someone who was declared righteous without faith. An example where it is specifically stated or implied that they had no faith would be ideal.
    Not sure why you included me here, but if you have a point to make, plainly state it.
  5. Standard member dj2becker
    rentrer à la maison
    05 Jun '18 02:46
    Originally posted by @rajk999
    Rehab the harlot.
    Cyrus King of Persia.

    There are dozens of examples of faith without righteousness who will be cast out of the Kingdom of God.

    Faith is nothing on its own and does not always lead to righteousness
    Could you provide a passage of scripture for the King of Cyprus? Rahab clearly had faith according to Hebrews 11.
  6. Standard member sonship
    the corrected one.
    05 Jun '18 02:47
    Originally posted by @romans1009
    <<Rehab the harlot.>>

    “By faith the harlot Rahab perished not with them that believed not, when she had received the spies with peace.”

    (Hebrews 11:31)
    Bull's eye!
  7. Subscriber Rajk999
    Enjoying
    05 Jun '18 02:53 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by @dj2becker
    Could you provide a passage of scripture for the King of Cyprus? Rahab clearly had faith according to Hebrews 11.
    Faith in what? Rehab was a prostitute from an idol worshiping nation. Who is king of Cyprus?
  8. Standard member sonship
    the corrected one.
    05 Jun '18 02:55
    Originally posted by @dj2becker
    Could you provide a passage of scripture for the King of Cyprus? Rahab clearly had faith according to Hebrews 11.
    If I recall rightly, I think Cyrus had a prophecy about him that he would do something to assist the Jewish captives in Babylon.

    I think, he was impressed that a prophecy was made concerning him by God.

    This is tentative and needs to be double checked. My main source to check this is down with tech problems at the moment.
  9. Standard member Romans1009
    Cretinous Mutterings
    05 Jun '18 02:56
    Originally posted by @rajk999
    Faith in what? Rehab was a prostitute from an idol worshiping nation.
    It’s Rahab, not Rehab. At least get her name right, amigo. She didn’t have a substance abuse problem.
  10. Standard member sonship
    the corrected one.
    05 Jun '18 02:58 / 4 edits
    Originally posted by @rajk999
    Faith in what? Rehab was a prostitute from an idol worshiping nation.
    That's the point. She was a prostitute in a city cursed by God. But regardless, she exercised faith in God and was saved from the divine judgment that fell on Jericho.

    Argue with the Bible why don't you?

    “By faith the harlot Rahab perished not with them that believed not, when she had received the spies with peace.”

    (Hebrews 11:31)
  11. Subscriber Rajk999
    Enjoying
    05 Jun '18 03:07
    Originally posted by @sonship
    That's the point. She was a prostitute in a city cursed by God. But regardless, she exercised faith in God and was saved from the divine judgment that fell on Jericho.

    Argue with the Bible why don't you?

    [b] “By faith the harlot Rahab perished not with them that believed not, when she had received the spies with peace.”

    (Hebrews 11:31)
    [/b]
    James said she was justified by works. Its a simple matter. She knew nothing of God. Her country was at war with the Jews. She made a deal to save herself and her family in turn she would help Joshua and his soldiers. She did the right thing.
  12. Standard member Romans1009
    Cretinous Mutterings
    05 Jun '18 03:20
    Originally posted by @rajk999
    James said she was justified by works. Its a simple matter. She knew nothing of God. Her country was at war with the Jews. She made a deal to save herself and her family in turn she would help Joshua and his soldiers. She did the right thing.
    That’s not true at all, amigo. You’re way off base on all counts. Here are the relevant verses:

    And Joshua the son of Nun sent out of xxxx two men to spy secretly, saying, Go view the land, even Jericho. And they went, and came into an xxxx house, named Rahab, and lodged there.

    2 And it was told the king of Jericho, saying, Behold, there came men in hither to night of the children of Israel to search out the country.

    3 And the king of Jericho sent unto Rahab, saying, Bring forth the men that are come to thee, which are entered into thine house: for they be come to search out all the country.

    4 And the woman took the two men, and hid them, and said thus, There came men unto me, but I wist not whence they were:

    5 And it came to pass about the time of shutting of the gate, when it was dark, that the men went out: whither the men went I wot not: pursue after them quickly; for ye shall overtake them.

    6 But she had brought them up to the roof of the house, and hid them with the stalks of flax, which she had laid in order upon the roof.

    7 And the men pursued after them the way to Jordan unto the fords: and as soon as they which pursued after them were gone out, they shut the gate.

    8 And before they were laid down, she came up unto them upon the roof;

    9 And she said unto the men, I know that the Lord hath given you the land, and that your terror is fallen upon us, and that all the inhabitants of the land faint because of you.

    10 For we have heard how the Lord dried up the water of the Red sea for you, when ye came out of Egypt; and what ye did unto the two kings of the Amorites, that were on the other side Jordan, Sihon and Og, whom ye utterly destroyed.

    11 And as soon as we had heard these things, our hearts did melt, neither did there remain any more courage in any man, because of you: for the Lord your God, he is God in heaven above, and in earth beneath.

    12 Now therefore, I pray you, swear unto me by the Lord, since I have shewed you kindness, that ye will also shew kindness unto my father's house, and give me a true token:

    13 And that ye will save alive my father, and my mother, and my brethren, and my sisters, and all that they have, and deliver our lives from death.

    14 And the men answered her, Our life for yours, if ye utter not this our business. And it shall be, when the Lord hath given us the land, that we will deal kindly and truly with thee.”

    (Joshua 2:1-14)
  13. Standard member Romans1009
    Cretinous Mutterings
    05 Jun '18 03:23
    Originally posted by @romans1009
    That’s not true at all, amigo. You’re way off base on all counts. Here are the relevant verses:

    And Joshua the son of Nun sent out of xxxx two men to spy secretly, saying, Go view the land, even Jericho. And they went, and came into an xxxx house, named Rahab, and lodged there.

    2 And it was told the king of Jericho, saying, Behold, there came men i ...[text shortened]... e Lord hath given us the land, that we will deal kindly and truly with thee.”

    (Joshua 2:1-14)
    The xxxxx’s in the first verse were necessary because the words were deemed unsuitable for posting.

    Anyone who wants to know what the words were can just Google “Joshua 2 KJV.”

    Notice Rahab not only knew the Lord but expressed faith in Him and asked for kindness only after she had hid the spies. She didn’t make any deal before she helped them.
  14. Standard member Romans1009
    Cretinous Mutterings
    05 Jun '18 03:38
    Originally posted by @rajk999
    James said she was justified by works. Its a simple matter. She knew nothing of God. Her country was at war with the Jews. She made a deal to save herself and her family in turn she would help Joshua and his soldiers. She did the right thing.
    James’ point is faith and works are intertwined:

    “Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.”

    (James 2:18)

    It’s not at all different from what salvation by faith alone Christians believe - good works (and an aversion to sin) are evidence of salvation, not a requirement for it.
  15. Standard member dj2becker
    rentrer à la maison
    05 Jun '18 04:15
    Originally posted by @rajk999
    Faith in what? Rehab was a prostitute from an idol worshiping nation. Who is king of Cyprus?
    Ok, so you think her prostitution and idol worship saved her ey? 🙄

    *Cyrus king of Persia