Greatest NBA Players of all time

Originally posted by CliffLandin
Shaq would be a sure thing if he could shoot free throws. There are very few who can match Shaq in the low post. Kareem with the sky hook could do very well against Shaq offensively, but Shaq would eat him alive at the other end.

If you are gonna put Lebron in, regardless of where you live, you are gonna have to put Kobe in. And I hate the selfish punk. (Kobe, not Lebron)

I hate Kobe too, but you gotta give him his props. That boy can play!

Is Shaq the biggest effective center ever?

Originally posted by AThousandYoung
I hate Kobe too, but you gotta give him his props. That boy can play!

Is Shaq the biggest effective center ever?

NO Wilt Chamberlain was the most effective center ever check his stats Shaq is nowhere close to Wilt..

Originally posted by richfeet
NO Wilt Chamberlain was the most effective center ever check his stats Shaq is nowhere close to Wilt..

Agreed...Wilt was as strong, or stronger, than Shaq, was a far better leaper, and was much more schooled in the fundamentals.

In addition, Chamberlain's stamina is unmatched by any player in NBA history...no one is even close... Wilt averaged 45.6 min/game over his career, and retired shortly before his 37th birthday (born in 1936, retired in 1973)... Shaq's career HIGH in min/game is exactly 40, which would be a career low for Wilt, by far.

Wilt, of course, is the only player to average MORE than 48 min/game during a season... he was ejected with 8 min to go in one game during the 61-62 season, but played every minute of every other one of the 79 other games, including all overtime minutes. If Shaq plays 40 min, announcers are all over themselves about what an iron-man job he's doing... that's for missing 8 minutes in ONE GAME...Wilt only missed 8 minutes of an entire SEASON.

As a point of reference, here are the original "NBA 50", chosen in 1996:

Abdul-Jabbar, Archibald, Arizin, Barkley, Barry, Baylor, Bing, Bird, Chamberlain, Cousy, Cowens, Cunningham, DeBusschere, Drexler, Erving, Ewing, Frazier, Gervin, Greer, Havlicek, Hayes, Johnson, Jones (Sam), Jordan, Lucas, Malone (Karl), Malone (Moses), Maravich, McHale, Mikan, Monroe, Olajuwon, O'Neal, Parish, Pettit, Pippen, Reed, Robertson, Robinson, Russell, Schayes (Dolph), Sharman, Stockton, Thomas, Thurmond, Unseld, Walton, West, Wilkens, Worthy


In 2004, Elliot Kalb published a book called "Who's Better, Who's Best in Basketball?". While I can't endorse all of his selections, he attempted to 'revise' the top 50 list, to include a few more of today's players. It's a fun read, and he avoids the knee-jerk reaction of placing Jordan at the top of the list. This is how he ranked the top 50 players, in order:

O'Neal, Chamberlain, Jordan, Russell, Abdul-Jabbar, Bird, Johnson, Robertson, Duncan, Cousy, Pettit, West, Baylor, Malone (Moses), Erving, Olajuwon, Malone (Karl), Bryant, Mikan, Robinson, Barkley, Barry, Schayes, Havlicek, Thomas, Gervin, Stockton, Kidd, Pippen, Rodman, Frazier, Cowens, Iverson, McHale, Hayes, Payton, Walton, Ewing, Reed, Garnett, McGrady, Jones (Sam), Archibald, McAdoo, Cunningham, Monroe, Maravich, Miller, Wilkins, Drexler


His reason for placing Shaq # 1 (which I don't necessarily agree with) is that he claims that there has never been a time in NBA history during which the #1 player (Shaq) is THIS much better and more dominant that the #2 player (Tim Duncan).


For reference in comparing the lists, these players were original top 50, but were eliminated in Kalb's book:

Arizin
Bing
DeBusschere
Greer
Lucas,Jerry
Parish
Sharman
Thurmond
Unseld
Wilkens,Lenny
Worthy


These players were in Kalb's top 50, but not in the original 50:

Bryant
Duncan
Garnett
Iverson
Kidd
McAdoo
McGrady
Miller, Reggie
Payton
Rodman
Wilkins, Dominique





The following players are on both lists:

Abdul-Jabbar
Archibald
Barkley
Barry
Baylor
Bird
Chamberlain
Cousy
Cowens
Cunningham
Drexler
Erving
Ewing
Frazier
Gervin
Havlicek
Hayes
Johnson
Jones, Sam
Jordan
Malone, Karl
Malone, Moses
Maravich
McHale
Mikan
Monroe
O'Neal
Olajuwon
Pettit
Pippen
Reed
Robertson
Robinson, David
Russell
Schayes (Dolph)
Stockton
Thomas, Zeke
Walton
West


According to Kalb, there are 8 players who have some type of a legitimate argument to be called "the best player ever". They are:

1) Shaq
2) Wilt
3) Jordan
4) Russell
5) Abdul-Jabbar
6) Bird
7) Magic
8) Oscar

Tim Duncan is ranked 9th all time, but can not be included in this "best ever" group.

Even though no one will agree with all of his picks, it is a fun read. Lots of great trivia (Bill Russell was 10-0 in game sevens, etc)...

Originally posted by TheBloop
As a point of reference, here are the original "NBA 50", chosen in 1996:

Abdul-Jabbar, Archibald, Arizin, Barkley, Barry, Baylor, Bing, Bird, Chamberlain, Cousy, Cowens, Cunningham, DeBusschere, Drexler, Erving, Ewing, Frazier, Gervin, Greer, Havlicek, Hayes, Johnson, Jones (Sam), Jordan, Lucas, Malone (Karl), Malone (Moses), Maravich, McHale, Mikan, Mon ...[text shortened]... n read. Lots of great trivia (Bill Russell was 10-0 in game sevens, etc)...

great read Bloop

Originally posted by richfeet
NO Wilt Chamberlain was the most effective center ever check his stats Shaq is nowhere close to Wilt..

Wilt also played in an era when there where few players over 6' 9" while in Shaq's era there are guards that are 6' 9" and the 7' center is the norm.

Of course Wilt's number are better.

If you watch film of Wilt playing it is like he is playing with and against junior high kids.

Originally posted by CliffLandin
Wilt also played in an era when there where few players over 6' 9" while in Shaq's era there are guards that are 6' 9" and the 7' center is the norm.

Of course Wilt's number are better.

If you watch film of Wilt playing it is like he is playing with and against junior high kids.

If Wilt and Shag meet in a 1 on 1 game and both are in the prime of their careers my money is on WILT .....

Originally posted by AThousandYoung
I hate Kobe too, but you gotta give him his props. That boy can play!

Is Shaq the biggest effective center ever?

I said biggest, not best!

According to Wiki, they are the same height and Shaq has 50 lbs on Wilt.

Originally posted by AThousandYoung
I said biggest, not best!

According to Wiki, they are the same height and Shaq has 50 lbs on Wilt.

1) Shaq
2) Wilt
3) Jordan
4) Russell
5) Abdul-Jabbar
6) Bird
7) Magic
8) Oscar

have to agree with this list. but not the order of it. I would put Shaq near the bottom.

Originally posted by CliffLandin
Wilt also played in an era when there where few players over 6' 9" while in Shaq's era there are guards that are 6' 9" and the 7' center is the norm.

Of course Wilt's number are better.

If you watch film of Wilt playing it is like he is playing with and against junior high kids.

Not only are Bill Russell, Willis Reed, Nate Thurmond etc better than any center in the NBA today (except Shaq), but Wilt had to go against these guys many more times/season because there were so many fewer teams back then.

Nate Archibald was called "Tiny" and he was 6'1"... there were no players under 6 ft back then, now there are a number of them.

The night Wilt scored 100 pts, the Knicks center was 6'11"...a whopping two inches shorter than Wilt... gee, think Yao could ever score 100 against someone who was 'only' 6'11"?

Wilt and Russell played against each other 142 times in 10 years, including playoffs... that's 14 x per year... Multiply that by Willis Reed, Nate Thurmond, Bob Lanier, Dave Cowens, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, etc...

The centers in the NBA are a total joke today... Shaq is the ONLY center in the NBA who will make the Hall of Fame...Tim Duncan and Kevin Garnett will also, but they also play some forward. (Ben Wallace has no shot at the Hall, based on his career so far, and he was 2nd team all NBA last season...shows what a joke today's centers are).

Bet Wilt would have loved to go against Zdrunis Ilgauskas 14x/year instead of Russell...that would have made his job a hell of a lot eaiser...

The 7 ft centers today totally suck.

Funny you should mention jr. high and high school kids...Wilt never played against high school kids in the NBA, a luxury Shaq has enjoyed quite a bit.

Originally posted by mochiron
1) Shaq
2) Wilt
3) Jordan
4) Russell
5) Abdul-Jabbar
6) Bird
7) Magic
8) Oscar

have to agree with this list. but not the order of it. I would put Shaq near the bottom.

Yeah, I would too... the book was published in 2004, not long after Shaq led the Lakers to three straight titles, so some of it was no doubt judgement in the heat of the moment...

But yeah, I would have put Shaq at the bottom of those 8, not at the top.

Originally posted by richfeet
Wilt Chamberlain Oscar Robinson Bill Russell Jabbar Julius Erving Walt Frazier Earl Monroe Bill Walton Jerry West Pete Maravich Larry Bird Earvin Johnson Michael Jordan James Worthy Lebron James

Reggie Miller! !

Originally posted by TheBloop
Not only are Bill Russell, Willis Reed, Nate Thurmond etc better than any center in the NBA today (except Shaq), but Wilt had to go against these guys many more times/season because there were so many fewer teams back then.

Nate Archibald was called "Tiny" and he was 6'1"... there were no players under 6 ft back then, now there are a number of them.
...[text shortened]... r played against high school kids in the NBA, a luxury Shaq has enjoyed quite a bit.

Hey i live in CLEVELAND

Originally posted by Red Night
Nice list. Oscar Robertson

Some of the best names you left off:

Elgin Baylor, Bob Cousy, George Mikan, Rick Barry, Havilcek,

My grandpa was close friends with George Mikan back in high school! But what about Malone or Magic Johnson? Not in there anywhere! What about Jerry West also? And even Larry Bird!

Originally posted by richfeet
If Wilt and Shag meet in a 1 on 1 game and both are in the prime of their careers my money is on WILT .....

I would agree because Wilt could shoot from the outside and inside, Shaq can't shoot from the outside!