1. Standard memberTirau Dan
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    07 Mar '09 21:41
    What is the state of UK football: Good, bad or indifferent?
    Can anything be learnt from overseas league management?
    Is it a good or a bad thing that money seems to give a few clubs dominance?
    Is the whole set up wrong?

    Would a player salary and transfer payment cap work for football in UK?

    What are the ins and outs of imposing a percentage limit on foreign players?

    Could academy players be bound to play for their club until they are 20
    Could their be a complete revamp in a new UK League

    Should Fifa continue to allow Britain to field three teams when the IOC don't? Maybe United Kingdom of Britain teams would produce the goods at The World Cup. Perhaps keeping the Eng Sco N/Ire thing for commonwealth sport only?
  2. Joined
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    07 Mar '09 22:32
    Originally posted by Tirau Dan
    What is the state of UK football: Good, bad or indifferent?
    Can anything be learnt from overseas league management?
    Is it a good or a bad thing that money seems to give a few clubs dominance?
    Is the whole set up wrong?

    Would a player salary and transfer payment cap work for football in UK?

    What are the ins and outs of imposing a percentage limit ...[text shortened]... he goods at The World Cup. Perhaps keeping the Eng Sco N/Ire thing for commonwealth sport only?
    on the surface i think it's looking pretty good, an all english CL final last year and another 4 in the last 16 this year with rangers unfornately getting to the uefa cup final last year. a lot of top foreign players now what to come to play in england but also a lot of mediocre players as well.

    it has been suggested at the very top of world football that there should be a limit on the number of foreign players playing for each club. i believe the number that's been put forward is 5.

    imo this is wrong but i do think something has to be done within english football to aid the development of the younger english players in the form of more first team high level football.

    but what?

    i said the cap of 5 foreign players was to low but possible 7 per every 11 starting a match with only 2 allowed on the bench? at least 4 starting englishmen shouldn't be a lot to ask for.

    i like the idea of a salary cap, a like it a lot, the players wages are getting out of control. they will never have a US style system were it's possible that the worst team in the league this year turns it all around and becomes the champions the next. it's not going to happen purley because of the collage draft system they have in the states. that can't be brought into england because there is no college for players. they leave school at 16 and join a football club. that's not going to change.

    i don't have the answers how to fix it but it's far from perfect the way it is now. i don't like knowing at the start of the season that there is only a maximum of 4 teams that can win the league but it's like that all across europe and the footballing world.

    as for your question about a uk football team, forget it it's never going to happen. you'll probably even see that the olympic 'british' team is an all english team.
  3. Standard memberTirau Dan
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    07 Mar '09 23:24
    Originally posted by trev33
    on the surface i think it's looking pretty good, an all english CL final last year and another 4 in the last 16 this year with rangers unfornately getting to the uefa cup final last year. a lot of top foreign players now what to come to play in england but also a lot of mediocre players as well.

    it has been suggested at the very top of world football that ...[text shortened]... you'll probably even see that the olympic 'british' team is an all english team.
    Don't the USA National Basketball Association include overseas players in a draft system? I occasionally hear of NZ players getting picked up "In the Draft".

    Does the draft system involve a set cash deal or do the rich teams get the most expensive players or is it a straight draw and set pay level?

    A country is defined as: a politically organised body of people under a single government; That is Britain. What do ppl think? Should (some or all) Scottish teams be given the choice to play in a British League if they want? I think it would be fun to see how Celtic etc fair.
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    08 Mar '09 01:22
    Originally posted by Tirau Dan
    Don't the USA National Basketball Association include overseas players in a draft system? I occasionally hear of NZ players getting picked up "In the Draft".

    Does the draft system involve a set cash deal or do the rich teams get the most expensive players or is it a straight draw and set pay level?

    A country is defined as: a politically organised bo ...[text shortened]... to play in a British League if they want? I think it would be fun to see how Celtic etc fair.
    well since all the money in basketball, american football etc is in america you're going to get people moving there on a college sports scholarship so you're obviously going to get non americans in a draft. you can't really compare the systems in america to here.

    in american football the teams who finish last get the first picks in the draft but they can trade picks or players with other teams. but the worst team from the last year are always at an advantage in the draft. how it works is that there's different rounds and each team has a predefined place to pick a player. but from what i hear the best players always seem to have a way of getting to play where they or their agent wants them to.

    A country is defined as: a politically organised body of people under a single government; That is Britain. What do ppl think? Should (some or all) Scottish teams be given the choice to play in a British League if they want? I think it would be fun to see how Celtic etc fair.

    the scottish, welsh and n. irish fa all said they didn't want a uk team competing in 2012 in fair of their individual status being under threat.

    celtic and rangers have both said they want to play in the english premiership. cardiff and swansea play in england why not celtic and rangers? i can't see all scottish and welsh teams joining the english league though, there's just too much history involved. n. ireland is more likely to join up with the republic than it is to join any uk league.
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    08 Mar '09 08:53
    i dont have a problem with the top players earning silly money, as the top players come up with the goods week-in week-out. if movie stars can earn millions for a few months work then best players deserve more for working hard all season. for me its all the average players killing the clubs with stupid wage demands then dont deliver the goods, i would bring in wage structures that are closer releated to preformance, lower basic wage with a huge bonus linked to final league position. then clubs at the bootom will have more cash next season to do better, clubs at the top have to spend more but will need less next season as they already have a good team.
    i also think contracts should be binding, how can small teams do well if as soon as a player has a good season hes snatched by a big club to be a bench warmer for a few years on double the money. if you sign a 5yr deal you stay for 5yrs or sold.
    one last thing would be to cap transfer fees rather than wages, this would stop billionaire clubs from getting every player they want.
    40million - current international under 28
    30 million - current int over 28
    20 mill - current under 21 int.

    that kinda thing, but better thought out.
  6. Standard memberTirau Dan
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    08 Mar '09 18:58
    Originally posted by stellspalfie
    i dont have a problem with the top players earning silly money, as the top players come up with the goods week-in week-out. if movie stars can earn millions for a few months work then best players deserve more for working hard all season. for me its all the average players killing the clubs with stupid wage demands then dont deliver the goods, i would b ...[text shortened]... rent int over 28
    20 mill - current under 21 int.

    that kinda thing, but better thought out.
    Perhaps all the stars sports and entertainment could do with a little less.

    In these times the money needs to be cut back. The star money days are numbered. If you have a league with half a dozen money clubs winning all the time ppl will get sick of it and make changes.

    I'm sure football bodies could could just say okay from 2012 no one gets more than 2m and scale things down across the board. (whatever the figure)
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    08 Mar '09 22:54
    Originally posted by stellspalfie
    i dont have a problem with the top players earning silly money, as the top players come up with the goods week-in week-out. if movie stars can earn millions for a few months work then best players deserve more for working hard all season. for me its all the average players killing the clubs with stupid wage demands then dont deliver the goods, i would b ...[text shortened]... rent int over 28
    20 mill - current under 21 int.

    that kinda thing, but better thought out.
    i dont have a problem with the top players earning silly money, as the top players come up with the goods week-in week-out. if movie stars can earn millions for a few months work then best players deserve more for working hard all season.

    so you don't mind paying £40 for a match ticket while players are getting paid 100k+ a week? a new shirt coming out every year, another £40 a pop, scarfs, tv channels and travel costs to games. people work hard in their jobs do they deserve to be getting paid silly money? how hard is a professional footballers life? a few hours training a day and a max of 2 matches a week for what, 10 months? hardly a lot is it?

    fans are getting ripped off, the players are getting paid too much and every club in the prem is in debt. sound right?

    yes movies stars makes millions, the top ones anyway. but is their productions making money? hell yes.
  8. Berks.
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    08 Mar '09 23:561 edit
    Originally posted by trev33

    celtic and rangers have both said they want to play in the english premiership. cardiff and swansea play in england why not celtic and rangers? i can't see all scottish and welsh teams joining the english league though, there's just too much history involved. n. ireland is more likely to join up with the republic than it is to join any uk league.
    If a UK league were instigated, regional leagues would need to start at a much higher level within a pyramid - so most Scottish teams would be playing Scottish based competition on a regular basis.

    Welsh clubs would probably end up with more regular fixtures into England due to the geography of the middle of that country. Biggest problem is with Northern Ireland when it's going to be a sudden large jump at some point in time (and potentially a relatively low level - although perhaps more chance to improve standard in the long run).

    I'm not in favour of the idea, and really can't see the home FAs having any interest in it either - they want to keep their independance. Presumably the most keen to see a British League would be Rangers and Celtic, but at the saem time they would be giving up their present overwhelming dominant position.

    The six teams currently within the English pyramid are there on a historial basis, though it does play havoc with the administration (bans and fines having caused problems in the past). The most interesting at the moment is Merthyr, who are currently suffering severe financial problems and sadly it won't be a huge surprise to see them fold. Quite possibly the most vocally opposed to the threat to move them into the Welsh League (and I can't blame them). Where do they start if reformed? Presumably their first choice would be the Hellenic Division One West, whether that is possible is a different matter.
  9. Berks.
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    09 Mar '09 00:07
    Originally posted by Tirau Dan
    What is the state of UK football: Good, bad or indifferent?
    Can anything be learnt from overseas league management?
    Is it a good or a bad thing that money seems to give a few clubs dominance?
    Is the whole set up wrong?
    Personally I'm not impressed with the current set up, it's too skewed towards the top end and the finances are certainly leading to problems (which is sad because it seems more money than ever is being pumped in). In order to be successful it's very hard just to rely on youth - if you've actually got a couple of decent players they'll be snapped up sooner or later.

    Far too many are after success at any cost. Fans go where the success is, effectively pumping more money towards those teams making it riskier for anyone else to catch up. The current format of the Champions League doesn't help, do well and it's easier to end up in it year upon year - I'd like to have European football as a bonus, not the expectation.

    Things can be learned from overseas management, though not en mass from a single country. Financial controls are worthwhile, but need to be across the board, not the present situation where a single league is far stricter than anyone else (they are closer to the ideal model, even if my own team were one of the first to suffer).

    The thing which in my opinion would benefit the game the most is if interest in clubs was spread around more evenly - have people supporting a side they can follow from the terraces, not the successful one on the TV (even in a different country). Have people seeing the whole picture rather than just the tip of the iceberg. How we can do that short of the clearly unreasonable and unworkable of banning TV I don't know.
  10. Standard memberTirau Dan
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    09 Mar '09 06:50
    Only airing thoughts as if their were to be major changes:

    Have a Euro-Super League formed after a special championship tournament for top seeded teams - The top 28 European teams in it. that creams off the top richest club that dominate European premierships.
    In this League the top four play off with semis and a final the team that beat the other in the round robin gets the home semi - biggest winning margin in the semis gets the home final - tie break reverts to round robin or if still tied most away goals.

    British Premiership made from the top 28 teams in Britain. The top 4 Scottish sides auto to prem - blended into new British League Divisions.
    The Brit Prem would have a similar top four play off to decide the champion.
    For the first year bottom eight play off against respective top ordered teams with the lower division getting the home game.
    Second year 4 teams do the same. After that 2 up 2 down next two play off. That should quickly settle the side down.

    Lower division teams with lack of funds may opt for a North south East West regional competition with the top team from each playing semis and a final. The finalist gain entry into the National comp and other two get a play off to gain entry.

    Euro Super League promotion would be gained by the top four teams from the European Cup (which would not include Super League teams). aiming for a two up two down system.

    The Pay TV ppl would love it. Getting FIFA delgates and the leagues to agree would be very unlikely but the whole system would suddenly be a must more level playing field with no dominant top 4 in the prem and something very special to play for.

    Teams feeling hard done by initially would be given every chance to play up in the first two years.

    The big teams like Man U, Chelsea etc would get those fantastic games at home against the best in Europe and the clubs could have gate spot prizes of tickets to away games... The Euro Super League would attract massive sponsorship from the cut priced airlines offering brilliant travel packages to fans.. heck we may get specials from down under.
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    10 Mar '09 14:30
    Originally posted by trev33

    so you don't mind paying £40 for a match ticket while players are getting paid 100k+ a week? a new shirt coming out every year, another £40 a pop, scarfs, tv channels and travel costs to games. people work hard in their jobs do they deserve to be getting paid silly money? how hard is a professional footballers life? a few hours training a day and a max of 2 ma ...[text shortened]... ies stars makes millions, the top ones anyway. but is their productions making money? hell yes.[/b]
    if the clubs are getting into debt thats their stupid fault not the players, if clubs say no to paying high wages then they wont have a problem. im a boro fan (boohoo) and weve had a fair few money grabbing lazy players earning 50,000 - 70,000 for doing nothing, but id be happy to pay a scholes or a giggs for their skill, work ethic and loyalty. they are true pro's and deserve to be paid for it. i agree that most players are over paid, thats why i suggest preformance related pay. if the fans think players are paid too much and the clubs are dishing out too much in wages and charging too much to get in then they should vote with their feet.
    there are lots of over paid people in the world, taking in huge saleries and bonuses (bankers for example). world class players have exeptional talent and short careers and therefore should be paid accordingly.
    its seems to me most of the premier clubs can afford either the wages or the transfer money but not both, why not keep paying the wages but stop spending 30million a year on transfers.
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