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  1. Standard member RBHILL
    Acts 13:48
    25 Sep '05 01:41
    does it count in these tournys? were if a piece is not taken in 50 move the game is drawn?

    And what about 3 moves rule too?
  2. Standard member Freddie2008
    9 Edits
    25 Sep '05 01:53
    Originally posted by RBHILL
    does it count in these tournys? were if a piece is not taken in 50 move the game is drawn?

    And what about 3 moves rule too?
    They always count....always.
  3. Standard member flexmore
    Quack Quack Quack !
    25 Sep '05 08:56 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by Freddie2004
    They always count....[b]always.[/b]
    there are many positions where more than fifty moves are needed to FORCE a checkmate in the quickest possible way.

    there is debate about how these positions should be handled ... both sides to the debate have a good case.
  4. Standard member Natural Science
    blunderer of pawns
    25 Sep '05 16:27
    Originally posted by flexmore
    there are many positions where more than fifty moves are needed to FORCE a checkmate in the quickest possible way.

    there is debate about how these positions should be handled ... both sides to the debate have a good case.
    Well, I think the spirit of the rule has to be considered. It is meant as an arbitrary way of ending a drawn position where one of the two sides is for some reason refusing to oblige the draw. Or, if someone has a checkmate but clearly does not know what he is doing. It should not be invoked in situations where it can be demonstarted that a checkmate exists, and that it is necessary to breach the 50-move rule to achieve it. Just one patzer's opinion.
  5. Standard member XanthosNZ
    Cancerous Bus Crash
    26 Sep '05 00:16
    Originally posted by flexmore
    there are many positions where more than fifty moves are needed to FORCE a checkmate in the quickest possible way.

    there is debate about how these positions should be handled ... both sides to the debate have a good case.
    Except that as it stands right now the rule is a hard 50 moves with no exceptions. At one point there were certain material combinations where it was ignored. This is no longer the case under FIDE rules.
  6. 26 Sep '05 03:42
    there is no position possible that requires more than 50 moves to force mate. the hardest is with king, knight and bishop against king and it doesnt require 50 moves regardless of where you set up the pieces...
  7. Standard member XanthosNZ
    Cancerous Bus Crash
    26 Sep '05 06:46 / 3 edits
    Originally posted by Starryknight14
    there is no position possible that requires more than 50 moves to force mate. the hardest is with king, knight and bishop against king and it doesnt require 50 moves regardless of where you set up the pieces...
    Bzzt


    White to move and mate in 65 with 1. Bf5 (every other move draws).

    And you wanted to be an elitist. 😠

    Others are known. KNNKP can take up to 115 moves and can contain periods of 50 moves with no pawn moves under optimal play.
    Also one I didn't know but found out about recently was KRP(rook pawn on original square (a/h2)) vs. KP(blockading the other pawn)B(opposite colour to the opponent's pawn).
  8. Subscriber Ponderableonline
    chemist
    26 Sep '05 08:01
    As a very mediocre player I suggest that the rule is the same as the stalemate. There are situations in which one has clearly the advantage, but a stalemate is it. Such arte the rules. IF a checkmate can't be raeched under 50 moves, you just had bad luck.
  9. 26 Sep '05 19:15 / 1 edit
    yes xanthos but in your game it is a draw with correct defense. what was discussed was forced mate... Learn how to read Moran.
  10. Standard member XanthosNZ
    Cancerous Bus Crash
    27 Sep '05 01:47
    Originally posted by Starryknight14
    yes xanthos but in your game it is a draw with correct defense. what was discussed was forced mate... Learn how to read Moran.
    You're an idiot. The position I posted is a forced mate in 65.
    That means that if both white and black play the best move the entire time it will be 65 moves until white mates black.
  11. Subscriber Marinkatomb
    wotagr8game
    27 Sep '05 02:11
    Originally posted by flexmore
    there are many positions where more than fifty moves are needed to FORCE a checkmate in the quickest possible way.
    Got an example by any chance? I've never seen a case like that, though i'd like to 🙂
  12. Standard member XanthosNZ
    Cancerous Bus Crash
    27 Sep '05 03:03 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by marinakatomb
    Got an example by any chance? I've never seen a case like that, though i'd like to 🙂
    Read the thread.

    Here's the forced mate for the position I gave.

    1. Bf5 Rh4 2. Bd3 Rf4 3. Be4+ Ka7 4. Bc6 Rg4 5. Kc7 Rg7+ 6. Bd7 Rg6 7. Be6 Rg7+ 8. Kc6 Rg1 9. Ra2+ Kb8 10. Rb2+ Ka8 11. Bf5 Rc1+ 12. Kb6 Rc3 13. Rb1 Kb8 14. Rb4 Ra3 15. Bd7 Ra2 16. Rh4 Rb2+ 17. Bb5 Rc2 18. Bc4 Rb2+ 19. Kc6 Rc2 20. Rh8+ Ka7 21. Rh7+ Kb8 22. Rb7+ Ka8 23. Rb4 Rg2 24. Bd3 Rg3 25. Rd4 Rf3 26. Bc4 Rh3 27. Rd8+ Ka7 28. Bd5 Rh2 29. Rd7+ Kb8 30. Rb7+ Ka8 31. Rb1 Rc2+ 32. Kb6+ Kb8 33. Be6 Rd2 34. Kc6+ Ka7 35. Ra1+ Kb8 36. Bd5 Rh2 37. Rb1+ Ka7 38. Be4 Rh6+ 39. Kc5 Rb6 40. Rf1 Ra6 41. Rf8 Ra5+ 42. Kc6 Rg5 43. Rf7+ Ka6 44. Bd5 Ka5 45. Kc5 Rg6 46. Rf2 Rg4 47. Rb2 Rh4 48. Rb7 Rh6 49. Bf7 Rf6 50. Bc4 Rf5+ 1/2-1/2 via 50 move rule.

    The mate would continue:
    51. Bd5 Rf6 52. Rb5+ Ka6 53. Rb3 Ka7 54. Rb7+ Ka6 55. Re7 Rf5 56. Re8 Rxd5+ 57. Kxd5 Kb6 58. Re7 Kb5 59. Rb7+ Ka6 60. Rb4 Ka5 61. Kc5 Ka6 62. Kc6 Ka7 63. Ra4+ Kb8 64. Ra3 Kc8 65. Ra8# 1-0