Questions on morality

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
Post is edited: This discussion is for those who believe there are no moral absolutes.

Can you explain why you think the killing of children is not absolutely morally wrong?

Originally posted by divegeester
I don't accept your construct of "universal" truth. Jesus died for everyone, I believe that's the truth. FMF doesn't believe that is the truth, so what? Putting the word "universal" in front of the word "truth" doesn't make a truth any more "truth" than it was without it.

Jesus said "I am the way the truth and the life". He didn't say "I am the unive ...[text shortened]... here you are continuing with your crusade. I honestly think there is something a wrong with you.

There are two mainstream beliefs about truth. Absolute truth and relative truth. When you use the word truth without qualifying it how anyone know whether you are referring to absolute truth or relative truth?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
There are two mainstream beliefs about truth. Absolute truth and relative truth. When you use the word truth without qualifying it how anyone know whether you are referring to absolute truth or relative truth?

So if I said it was the truth that you are one of the poorest communicators I've ever met in my entire life. Would that be a universal truth if everyone in this forum agreed with me?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
There are two mainstream beliefs about truth. Absolute truth and relative truth. When you use the word truth without qualifying it how anyone know whether you are referring to absolute truth or relative truth?

Can you explain why, in your world, and without appealing to your version of god killing people, why the killing of children is not absolutely morally wrong?

Originally posted by FMF
Your use of the word "universal" attached to your personal beliefs and opinions is, indeed, superfluous ~ it adds nothing to the claims and hopes you hold so dearly, nothing at all ~ while you arguing about the word "universal" with a fellow Christian who shares your personal beliefs and opinions about Jesus is decidedly peculiar.

I don't believe that two contradictory beliefs can both be true, and I think neither do you and neither does geester. We all believe in universal truth. So your never ending crusade is decidedly peculiar since we share the same belief about the nature of truth.

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
There are two mainstream beliefs about truth. Absolute truth and relative truth.

Is that a truth?
Is an absolute truth or a relative truth?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
I don't believe that two contradictory beliefs can both be true....

You stating this over and over and over again does not add any credence to the unprovable claims you make here (you have admitted you can't prove them) based on your superstitious beliefs. Trotting out the word string I don't believe that two contradictory beliefs can both be true ~ what feels like hundreds of times ~ is not evidence of anything nor an argument per se that makes the stuff you believe any more believable. Yes you use the word "universal"; yes it means you are very very certain; yes it means you think others are wrong; yes it means you are sincere; but that's all it "means" external to you, and your forever-repeating and severely restricted palette of fixed ideas.

Originally posted by divegeester
So if I said it was the truth that you are one of the poorest communicators I've ever met in my entire life. Would that be a universal truth if everyone in this forum agreed with me?

Some truths are in fact relative I don't doubt that, for example, my favorite color is blue that truth is relative to me and does not apply to all people. I disagree that all truths are relative though. Some truths I do believe are absolute. For example, Jesus died for my sins. If everyone alive were to say Jesus died for my sins it would be true, that it is an absolute/universal truth. Geester would also agree with this is he were to man up.

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
Some truths are in fact relative I don't doubt that, for example, my favorite color is blue that truth is relative to me and does not apply to all people.

sonship's favourite supernatural figure is Jesus; that "truth" is relative to him [and presumably you] and does not apply to all people.

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
Some truths I do believe are absolute. For example, Jesus died for my sins. If everyone alive were to say Jesus died for my sins it would be true.

So, in other words, an "absolute truth" is something you are very, very, very certain about. That's what you are saying, right? The word "absolute" simply nails your underpants to your mast, right?

Originally posted by FMF
sonship's favourite supernatural figure is Jesus; that "truth" is relative to him [and presumably you] and does not apply to all people.

If the things that the Bible claims about Jesus are in fact true, that means they would be true even if no one believed them to be true. Truth does not depend upon belief. So if Geester really believes that Jesus died for all people it would mean the Geester believes that Jesus died for you even if you don't believe it to be true. Yet he doesn't want to admit it for some peculiar reason.

Originally posted by FMF
So, in other words, an "absolute truth" is something you are very, very, very certain about. That's what you are saying, right? The word "absolute" simply nails your underpants to your mast, right?

Either the things that the Bible claims are true or they are not true. If they are true they would be true even if I weren't certain about them or didn't believe them, I obviously believe they are true, but their truthfulness doesn't depend on my certainty whatsoever.

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
If the things that the Bible claims about Jesus are in fact true, that means they would be true even if no one believed them to be true. Truth does not depend upon belief.

Your concept of "truth" does depend on your belief though, doesn't it? I'm not denying mine does. But you seem to think dubbing it "absolute truth" lends extra credence to what you just so happen to believe and somehow makes it apply to me... in so far as you appear to want me to "admit" that the stuff you believe about angels and demons and the ancient Hebrews is a set of "absolute" and "universal" truths that I accept too.

But you know full well this is not going to happen. And you know full well that repeating the same assertions over and over and over and over again - and labelling them with portentous adjectives - isn't going to make it happen either. People know what you believe. You should be content that you have had a chance to state what you believe and that you have been clear.

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
Either the things that the Bible claims are true or they are not true.

You've said this kind of thing umpteen times. What impact do you think saying it has on someone who doesn't have the same superstitions as you and doesn't subscribe to the Bible stories that you do?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
If [the things that the Bible claims] are true they would be true even if I weren't certain about them or didn't believe them, I obviously believe they are true, but their truthfulness doesn't depend on my certainty whatsoever.

You've said this before. Many, many times. Why are you saying it again?