The American Dream at the Movies

Originally posted by AThousandYoung
The American Dream is a phrase that describes upward social and economic mobility through hard work, democracy and thrift. I'm not sure how Platoon is relevant.

Boogie Nights is a good one. I considered American Beauty and decided not to offer it, but it's a worthy example.

I haven't seen American Me.

Oh, I see, it must be something positive and presto to praise
how fantastic the A.D. has worked for each and every person
for the last 200 years.

Sorry. Me bad.

- - -

P.D. (1) Platoon has everything to do with the AD, actually.

P.D. (2) Forget about 'Scarface' then.

Originally posted by Seitse
Oh, I see, it must be something positive and presto to praise
how fantastic the A.D. has worked for each and every person
for the last 200 years.

Sorry. Me bad.

- - -

P.D. (1) Platoon has everything to do with the AD, actually.

P.D. (2) Forget about 'Scarface' then.

Get over the sarcasm and explain your point please. It's a movie about the Vietnam War. There aren't many chances to work overtime for extra pay; saving your pennies is not part of the theme; etc.

I now see the connection Fight Club has to the AD. It's about the frustration of those who do "what they're supposed to do" as part of the American Dream "formula" and are frustrated with the outcome.

But Platoon?

EDIT - Scarface is a rags to riches story. Platoon is not.

Originally posted by AThousandYoung
Get over the sarcasm and explain your point please. It's a movie about the Vietnam War. There aren't many chances to work overtime for extra pay; saving your pennies is not part of the theme; etc.

I now see the connection Fight Club has to the AD. It's about the frustration of those who do "what they're supposed to do" as part of the American Dream "formula" and are frustrated with the outcome.

But Platoon?

Apparently, Seitse, you're trying to squeeze out this concept but unable to do so, and have chosen to resort to condescending sarcasm because of your inability to express your point:

Both these films dealt with Vietnam an issue that is of great interest concerning the American Dream. Platoon and Born of the Fourth of July were both anti-war presenting horrific images and criticising the participation of America within Vietnam. This is an interesting stance particularly in light of Bickford’s assertions that the 58,202 who died during Vietnam, were fighting to preserve the American Dream .

http://www.slideshare.net/ninanoo/the-american-dream-in-film

Now, is that what you meant? I don't want you getting sarcastic and claiming I'm putting words in your mouth a la KellyJay.

I am having trouble tracking down the Bickford quote. Did he have anything to do with writing the movie? Did Stone say he inspired the movie? Where's the relevance?

EDIT - Yes, I'm aware a few people have written essays asserting the connection between Platoon and the American Dream, but the links are very tenuous e.g. Victoria Baschzok:

These [soldiers] all believed in the American dream and saw themselves as victims of injustice

http://www.oscarworld.net/ostone/default.asp?PageId=10

Yes, the connection is asserted without any support, just like what you're doing, Seitse.

Is there any support for this claim that Platoon is about the American Dream?

Originally posted by AThousandYoung
I am having trouble tracking down the Bickford quote. Did he have anything to do with writing the movie? Did Stone say he inspired the movie? Where's the relevance?

More importantly, who the heck is Bickford and why does he matter?

Originally posted by Palynka
More importantly, who the heck is Bickford and why does he matter?

He's the only possible connection between "American Dream" and "Platoon" I can find.

Originally posted by AThousandYoung
He's the only possible connection between "American Dream" and "Platoon" I can find.

Well, the American Dream is often connected with the idea of pursuit of happiness (from your constitution) so basically almost anything can be linked to it in one way or the other.

In short, the American Dream is just a trite concept repackaged in red, white and blue to bolster patriotism.

Originally posted by Palynka
Well, the American Dream is often connected with the idea of pursuit of happiness (from your constitution) so basically almost anything can be linked to it in one way or the other.

In short, the American Dream is just a trite concept repackaged in red, white and blue to bolster patriotism.

I disagree. I think Eminem, Steve Harvey etc. are excellent examples of the power of the American Dream. People like these could not thrive in Iran or China.

Originally posted by AThousandYoung
I disagree. I think Eminem, Steve Harvey etc. are excellent examples of the power of the American Dream. People like these could not thrive in Iran or China.

Oh, right. Iran and China. I see.

Originally posted by Palynka
Well, the American Dream is often connected with the idea of pursuit of happiness (from your constitution) so basically almost anything can be linked to it in one way or the other.

In short, the American Dream is just a trite concept repackaged in red, white and blue to bolster patriotism.

Pursuit of Happiness is from the Declaration of Independence, not the Constitution (I think!)

Originally posted by AThousandYoung
He's the only possible connection between "American Dream" and "Platoon" I can find.

Given that you seem to have found that quote in an essay called "The American Dream as Presented on Film / Movies" that has a big paragraph on Vietnam films, perhaps the link isn't all that tangential. What Bickford said isn't really the point, more the fact that someone thought it worth commenting on.

Here's another review in a similar vein: http://www.oscarworld.net/ostone/default.asp?PageId=10

Originally posted by Palynka
Oh, right. Iran and China. I see.

More condescending sarcasm without any actual substance. The American Dream must be a powerful thing for the criticism to be so incredibly weak!

Originally posted by mtthw
Given that you seem to have found that quote in an essay called "The American Dream as Presented on Film / Movies" that has a big paragraph on Vietnam films, perhaps the link isn't all that tangential. What Bickford said isn't really the point, more the fact that someone thought it worth commenting on.

Here's another review in a similar vein: http://www.oscarworld.net/ostone/default.asp?PageId=10

"Someone" will find anything worth commenting on. I can Google anything. That doesn't mean there's some profound truth there.

Perhaps the author wrote a crappy essay.

Originally posted by AThousandYoung
More condescending sarcasm without any actual substance. The American Dream must be a powerful thing for the criticism to be so incredibly weak!

There is substance AND sarcasm. It's just not spelled out for you.

I like to do these types of tests. If you're worth it, you'll see the substance.

Originally posted by AThousandYoung
Pursuit of Happiness is from the Declaration of Independence, not the Constitution (I think!)

I take the point, but it doesn't really make any difference.