30 May 05
I have a confession. I'm a fan. A particularly embarrassed one, though, because for the past two seasons the show has been a steadily accumulating ball of dreck, and this last season is totally beyond salvage. Does anyone share my current state of despair at a once-promising realtime show that is no longer realtime, and now barely even a show?
30 May 05
Originally posted by AmauroteI watched the first 3 seasons and loved it. I prefer to buy/rent/borrow the DVDs once the season has completed and watch it at my own pace, thus I have yet to see season 4, however I've heard nothing but glowing reviews. Care to expand why you didn't like last season WITHOUT going into ANY plot details?
I have a confession. I'm a fan. A particularly embarrassed one, though, because for the past two seasons the show has been a steadily accumulating ball of dreck, and this last season is totally beyond salvage. Does anyone share my current state of despair at a once-promising realtime show that is no longer realtime, and now barely even a show?
30 May 05
Originally posted by darvlayYep, darvlay, I'm not unlike you in that I watch again on DVD once the season is over on torrent, but although I'll buy this one like the sucker I am, there really is very little merit in it. The entire franchize is in a downward line of diminishing returns now, as you'll already know having seen season 3 (which was poorish again, but at least contained 12 great episodes). This one has at most two.
I watched the first 3 seasons and loved it. I prefer to buy/rent/borrow the DVDs once the season has completed and watch it at my own pace, thus I have yet to see season 4, however I've heard nothing but glowing reviews. Care to expand why you didn't like last season WITHOUT going into ANY plot details?
Without spoiling it for you, season 4's lead villain is the dullest and most lightly-written ever: with Stephen Saunders, they created something interesting, didn't have the ideological clout to make him convincing, but at least Surnow, Kronish and Cochran gave him some witty lines and character handles. The season 4 villain is quite possibly the dullest ever. He's like Mogadon Man, it's that bad, maybe one memorable line in the entire season.
In addition to this, the terrorism they're portraying is increasingly poorly sketched-in, the plotholes are worse than ever, the characters are mere cardboard cut-outs, the realtime is virtually non-existent, the technology is completely specious, and Jack is now officially a tedious character - you know how good he was in seasons 1 and 2, how flawed and ambiguous he was, but how much duller he seemed in season 3? Well, in season 4 he's every bit as dull as the antagonist, and that's saying something.
On the plus side, there's a great episode from one of the mythos villains. It's the only reason I'm buying the box set.
30 May 05
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Originally posted by AmauroteThat sure is one scathing review. But you're correct, Season 3 was not, at all, on the same level of intensity as the first two. I've never been picky on the real-time aspect of the show nor the plotholes. I take the whole thing with a grain of salt. It's fifth-gear suspense/action and it works, for the most part, if the viewer doesn't ask for too much in return by way of plot justification or having loose ends tied up (that's surely a huge benefit when using the whole 24-hour schtick; what issues are ever resolved neatly in one day?)
Yep, darvlay, I'm not unlike you in that I watch again on DVD once the season is over on torrent, but although I'll buy this one like the sucker I am, there really is very little merit in it. The entire franchize is in a downward line of ...[text shortened]... he mythos villains. It's the only reason I'm buying the box set.
WRT villains, I was not at all impressed with Stephen Saunders although I loved the Salazar Bros. and, of course, Nina. I don't understand why they feel the need to switch from villian to villian so frequently. It was done perfectly in the first season (Gaines to the Drazens with Sherry and Nina's turns thrown in for spice) and they have yet to reproduce that formula with 100% success.
I will still watch the 4th season though. I'll let you know what I think. Usually when I start watching these box sets, they're finished within a week or two.
I've heard that Season 4 is coming to stores soon, is that true?
30 May 05
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Originally posted by darvlayIt is interesting the way season 3 divided the fans between those who preferred the Salazars and those who preferred Saunders - I personally felt that Hector and Ramon grated and lacked something, and I liked the Baader-Meinhof angle they appeared (falsely, as it transpired) to be flirting with with the Amador-Saunders plotline. In any event, it picked up pace after the introduction of Amador, and even the badly-conceived finale worked well with the Eric Rabens chase working in a Max Shreck kind of way. It made no sense at all, but they just about covered their blushes. That deus ex machina with Gael's wife was utterly ridiculous.
That sure is one scathing review. But you're correct, Season 3 was not, at all, on the same level of intensity as the first two. I've never been picky on the real-time aspect of the show nor the plotholes. I take the whole thing with a ...[text shortened]...
I've heard that Season 4 is coming to stores soon, is that true?
Nevertheless, I think the show totally lacks verisimilitude now, and disdaining realtime is a big part of that, because it's led to some unbelievably lazy writing: in the first season, they couldn't use Jack all the time, because it wasn't chronologically possible; now they use him all the time because he can get anywhere in Los Angeles in five minutes. And then again in season one and two minor characters mattered, as they do in reality - the cop in the alleyway who Penticoff kills, the woman Jack takes hostage to flee the police - whereas now it's simply two sets of superheroes with little or no interaction with the public. I don't mind them trading cogency for drama (which they did anyway with the first season finale, to gret effect), but for the most part they now do this simply because they have no imagination or don't want to sweat the little details...which happen to be the three dramatic unities.
Funnily enough, I don't mind them switching villains, the Russian doll approach worked well in season 2 - in fact, I like the collegial feel of season two a lot better than the ubervillain scenario of season 4, it just feels better.
The season 4 box set will be out in the US very soon, I would guess, although for some reason it comes out in the UK first - the soundtrack is also out at the moment, plenty of cheap copies on amazon, and first-rate as usual, grab it if you can.
31 May 05
Originally posted by darvlaySeason 4 won't be out till September.
That sure is one scathing review. But you're correct, Season 3 was not, at all, on the same level of intensity as the first two. I've never been picky on the real-time aspect of the show nor the plotholes. I take the whole thing with a grain of salt. It's fifth-gear suspense/action and it works, for the most part, if the viewer doesn't ask for too mu ...[text shortened]... ished within a week or two.
I've heard that Season 4 is coming to stores soon, is that true?
31 May 05
4 edits
Originally posted by Jack BauerHee-hee, that was class. Of course you have no affiliated clans, that's not the way Jack works...
You son of a bitch! I should kill you where you stand! I'm Jack Bauer, dammit, and you will treat me with some respect!
Seriously, I still think Kiefer Sutherland does a great job in this series, it's just that the character he plays has become utterly flawless and cartoonish. In season one he was a man with a dark side, and Andre Drazen's description of what he has done in Bosnia actually sowed genuine doubts, although he remained very sympathetic - the balancing-act between country and family made him genuinely unpredictable, and at one point he actually confesses to being more afraid than he's ever been; much of the season is a double-act between himself and Nina, Tony or Mason. In season two, the man is almost insane with grief at times, tot and I don't think the character has ever had better lines than that "The Sunday before you killed my wife" speech he gives to Nina Myers, where he appears to have completely lost it. He's a broken man, and you want him to find his happiness...find it by shooting a lot of corporate terrorists, right-wing militiamen, crazy mercenaries and stray Islamists.
In contrast, season 3 had only tiny moments of self-doubt as in the finale and "We let him down. I let him down" during the Saunders arc. Season 4 is just macho crap. Jack Bauer has no flaws, can do anything and everything (although anything and everything no longer consists of using his brain to think laterally, but just to fire louder and louder guns - DEAR GOD, JACK, are those ordnance pieces you're firing standard issue?), does not develop as a character, and his dialogue is limited to Anne Coulterisms like "It is what it is" and "You don't understand America." I have absolutely no objection to the show developing a right-wing agenda - which was inevitable, because Surnow is a close friend of Rush Limbaugh - any more than I did to the left-wing agenda of the first two seasons...I just wish they'd pay more attention to detail, plot, dialogue and character.
31 May 05
Originally posted by slimjimIf anybody lays a finger on my daughter or even casts more than a passing glance at her heaving bosom I will not think twice about carving out their eyes with my Micro Tech Halo (TM).
I haven't seen season 4 yet but, I'm hoping your daughter gets whacked Jack. Also you should never had killed Nina you a-hole.😉
As for Nina, she was no longer useful to me. She was as tough as a Comanche and our lengthy love-making sessions were the stuff of legends. But you try coincidentally running into your wife's murderer on the worst days of your life and not filling her with hot lead, you sissy Texan.
31 May 05
Originally posted by Jack BauerYou crack me up. 😵😵😵😵 You also get a rec.
If anybody lays a finger on my daughter or even casts more than a passing glance at her heaving bosom I will not think twice about carving out their eyes with my Micro Tech Halo (TM).
As for Nina, she was no longer useful to me. She was as tough as a Comanche and our lengthy love-making sessions were the stuff of legends. But you try coincidentally ...[text shortened]... e's murderer on the worst days of your life and not filling her with hot lead, you sissy Texan.