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  1. Subscriber mchill
    Independent
    10 Feb '18 03:14
    Written by Joni sung by Judy, this half forgotten gem still has magical powers

    Rows and flows of angel hair
    And ice cream castles in the air
    And feather canyons everywhere
    I've looked at clouds that way

    But now they only block the sun
    They rain and snow on everyone
    So many things I would have done
    But clouds got in my way

    I've looked at clouds from both sides now
    From up and down, and still somehow
    It's cloud illusions I recall
    I really don't know clouds at all

    Moons and Junes and Ferris wheels
    The dizzy dancing way you feel
    As every fairy tale comes real
    I've looked at love that way

    But now it's just another show
    You leave 'em laughing when you go
    And if you care, don't let them know
    Don't give yourself away

    I've looked at love from both sides now
    From give and take, and still somehow
    It's love's illusions I recall
    I really don't know love at all

    Tears and fears and feeling proud
    To say "I love you" right out loud
    Dreams and schemes and circus crowds
    I've looked at life that way

    Oh but now old friends are acting strange
    They shake their heads, they say I've changed
    Well something's lost but something's gained
    In living every day

    I've looked at life from both sides now
    From win and lose and still somehow
    It's life's illusions I recall
    I really don't know life at all

    I've looked at life from both sides now
    From up and down and still somehow
    It's life's illusions I recall
    I really don't know life at all
  2. Subscriber Suzianne
    Misfit Queen
    10 Feb '18 04:18
    Originally posted by @mchill
    Written by Joni sung by Judy, this half forgotten gem still has magical powers

    Rows and flows of angel hair
    And ice cream castles in the air
    And feather canyons everywhere
    I've looked at clouds that way

    But now they only block the sun
    They rain and snow on everyone
    So many things I would have done
    But clouds got in my way

    I've looked at clo ...[text shortened]... m up and down and still somehow
    It's life's illusions I recall
    I really don't know life at all
    I like Judy Collins and I adore Joni Mitchell (her BD is four days before mine), but I hate, hate, hate this song. Suitable for a teenager, maybe.
  3. 10 Feb '18 15:01 / 2 edits
    Originally posted by @suzianne
    I like Judy Collins and I adore Joni Mitchell (her BD is four days before mine), but I hate, hate, hate this song. Suitable for a teenager, maybe.
    This song, read as a poem, leaves me somewhat sad. It’s a feeling of loss, of dis-illusionment. The speaker seems to be saying that they can look at life from either side, from the side having cherished illusions or from the side having lost them, but really, is saying that having lost them, she knows they can never be fully present, as they once were, perhaps as a young teenager. That’s a thoughtful reaction on your part, S*.

    I am suddenly mindful of this and had to go find it:

    “Bookends"

    Time it was
    And what a time it was, it was
    A time of innocence
    A time of confidences

    Long ago it must be
    I have a photograph
    Preserve your memories
    They're all that's left you.

    I am thinking that the teenager in me has been, and is finally, stepping aside to spend a little time in contemplation of my mortality.

    That’s my reaction. I want to say thanks...sort of.

    *Maybe not your intent, but what I got.
  4. Standard member Sleepyguy
    Reepy Rastardly Guy
    10 Feb '18 15:38
    Originally posted by @mchill
    Written by Joni sung by Judy, this half forgotten gem still has magical powers

    Rows and flows of angel hair
    And ice cream castles in the air
    And feather canyons everywhere
    I've looked at clouds that way

    But now they only block the sun
    They rain and snow on everyone
    So many things I would have done
    But clouds got in my way

    I've looked at clo ...[text shortened]... m up and down and still somehow
    It's life's illusions I recall
    I really don't know life at all
    Shorter version... "Boo hoo, my self delusions didn't pan out. I'm challenged by reality and sad about it."

    Very leftist.
  5. Subscriber sonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    10 Feb '18 16:02
    Originally posted by @suzianne
    I like Judy Collins and I adore Joni Mitchell (her BD is four days before mine), but I hate, hate, hate this song. Suitable for a teenager, maybe.
    What about 'Free man in Paris?"

    I was a free man in Paris, I was unfettered and alive, nobody calling me up for favors, no one's future to decide. I'd go back there tomorrow but for this work I've taken on, stoking the star maker machinery behind the popular song.

    If that doesn't wet your whistle I don't know what would
  6. 10 Feb '18 16:05
    Originally posted by @sleepyguy
    Shorter version... "Boo hoo, my self delusions didn't pan out. I'm challenged by reality and sad about it."

    Very leftist.
    I wondered what this post was doing in Debates. It’s too, well, too thoughtful for its own good.
  7. Standard member Sleepyguy
    Reepy Rastardly Guy
    10 Feb '18 16:12
    Originally posted by @js357
    I wondered what this post was doing in Debates. It’s too, well, too thoughtful for its own good.
    Thoughts like this...

    "So many things I would have done
    But clouds got in my way"

    lead to standing in the unemployment line in your jammies or cowering in a safe space. Blech.
  8. Subscriber sonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    10 Feb '18 16:13 / 2 edits
    How about this song, Court and Spark:


    Joni Mitchell
    Love came to my door
    With a sleeping roll
    And a madman's soul
    He thought for sure I'd seen him
    Dancing up a river in the dark
    Looking for a woman
    To court and spark

    He was playing on the sidewalk
    For passing change
    When something strange happened
    Glory train passed through him
    So he buried the coins he made
    In People's Park
    And went looking for a woman
    To court and spark

    It seemed like he read my mind
    He saw me mistrusting him
    And still acting kind
    He saw how I worried, sometimes
    I worry sometimes

    "All the guilty people, " he said
    They've all seen the stain
    On their daily bread
    On their christian names
    I cleared myself
    I sacrificed my blues
    And you could complete me
    I'd complete you

    His eyes were the color of the sand
    And the sea
    And the more he talked to me, you know
    The more he reached me
    But I couldn't let go of L.A.
    City of the fallen angels
    Songwriters: Joni Mitchell
  9. 10 Feb '18 16:40 / 2 edits
    Originally posted by @sleepyguy
    Shorter version... "Boo hoo, my self delusions didn't pan out. I'm challenged by reality and sad about it."

    Very leftist.
    There, there.

    I can direct you to a state run heroin house in San Fran.

    Soon everything will be OK again.

    Do try to avoid all of the poop along the way.
  10. Subscriber mchill
    Independent
    10 Feb '18 17:04
    Originally posted by @whodey
    There, there.

    I can direct you to a state run heroin house in San Fran.

    Soon everything will be OK again.

    Do try to avoid all of the poop along the way.
    I wondered how long it would take Whodey politicize music. Not long I guess.
  11. Subscriber no1marauder
    Humble and Kind
    10 Feb '18 17:12
    Originally posted by @sleepyguy
    Shorter version... "Boo hoo, my self delusions didn't pan out. I'm challenged by reality and sad about it."

    Very leftist.
    I'm not sure; the opening stanza:

    Rows and flows of angel hair
    And ice cream castles in the air
    And feather canyons everywhere
    I've looked at clouds that way

    Kinda describes a childlike way of observing normal, unremarkable objects and seeing in them fantastic things .............................................. kinda like the Nunes memo.
  12. Standard member Sleepyguy
    Reepy Rastardly Guy
    10 Feb '18 17:16 / 1 edit
    "...kinda like the Nunes memo."

    LOL. That cracked me up.
  13. 10 Feb '18 21:38
    Originally posted by @sleepyguy
    "...kinda like the Nunes memo."

    LOL. That cracked me up.
    Keeping oneself well entertained is a perfectly acceptable use of one’s time.
  14. Subscriber FreakyKBH
    Acquired Taste...
    10 Feb '18 22:21
    Originally posted by @sleepyguy
    Shorter version... "Boo hoo, my self delusions didn't pan out. I'm challenged by reality and sad about it."

    Very leftist.
    Agree in part and disagree in part, with a decided weight toward disagree.

    First, the title is rendered: Both Sides, Now (at least, according to Joni's website) which adds another layer to it, a way of saying she's seeing both sides from the standpoint of the present time.
    The "both" sides is where the main crux is, in that she is considering how she used to see things up against how she came to see thing, and that from the position of her current understanding.
    As a child, clouds are wondrous, awe-inspiring encouraging the verdant minds of youth to imagine all of the dreamy things they could be just floating in that blue right above our heads--- nearly reachable, but clearly on stage for us to enjoy.
    Adults see them differently, inured by the worry we're apparently assigned to take on and instead of being portals to possibility--- optimistic possibility--- we begin to see they are simply in the way of better things.
    And then she walks us through a few of life's main post markers: career, friendship, love, etc., remembering the freshness and the overwhelming joy of those opportunities contrasted against the mundane they begin to represent.
    Against it all, it is the illusion of the happiness that each were anticipated to bring:
    clouds which fail to become ice cream castles;
    burgeoning youth which fails to maintain the buzz of life's new discoveries and freedoms;
    heart-felt expressions/confessions which become a song list taped to the hip of the resonance chamber or taped ignobly to the ground in front of the stool;
    intimate relations which drag a cat-of-nine tail of misery right behind them;
    the forging of a new identity which leaves life-long friends wondering what happened to the one they knew.

    I find the words of 24 year old Joni incredibly poignant... even if she did plagiarize the main line from "Henderson the Rain King."
  15. Subscriber Suzianne
    Misfit Queen
    10 Feb '18 22:37
    Originally posted by @sleepyguy
    Shorter version... "Boo hoo, my self delusions didn't pan out. I'm challenged by reality and sad about it."

    Very leftist.
    Watch what you claim is leftist, you're sounding like whodey.

    I'm as idealistic as they come, and I hate this song.