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Debates Forum

  1. Standard member vivify
    rain
    21 Feb '16 16:32 / 2 edits
    Thread 165274

    Originally posted by vivify
    Can we finally say, in light of the fact that Donald freakin' Trump is front-runner for the GOP, that Republicans are god-damned morons?


    Originally posted by sh76 to vivify
    It's still extremely early.

    Come back to me when he has 500 delegates and then we can talk about that question.

    So sh76,

    Can we finally say, in light of the fact that Donald freakin' Trump is still front-runner for the GOP, that Republicans are god-damned morons? Or is it still "too early", given that Trump has six times as many delegates as his nearest rival?
  2. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    21 Feb '16 16:42
    Originally posted by vivify
    Thread 165274

    Originally posted by vivify
    [b]Can we finally say, in light of the fact that Donald freakin' Trump is front-runner for the GOP, that Republicans are god-damned morons?



    [quote]Originally posted by sh76 to vivify
    It's still extremely early.

    Come back to me when he has 500 delegates an ...[text shortened]... is it still "too early", given that Trump has six times as many delegates as his nearest rival?
    Well, he doesn't quite have 500 delegates, but I will concede that he's still the front runner and that's it's not that early any more.

    Are Republicans "god-damned morons"? Some are, I suppose. Keep in mind that Trump is only getting about 1/3 of the GOP vote, though that is a plurality.

    I can kind of see Trump's extremely superficial appeal. He's as straight-talking a politician as we've ever seen and his sound bites have appeal for people with extremely short attention spans. Also, just the fact that the media dislikes him may be good for 10 points in today's GOP environment.

    I think Trump would make a miserable President, though I don't think he will win. A Trump nomination would just gift wrap the election for Hillary.

    I will say, though, that I'm finding it harder and harder to identify with today's Republican party. I don't think I'm going to change my registration to Independent (why bother?) but I would dearly love to see a third party emerge; maybe behind Mike Bloomberg. We can recruit the John Kasichs and Mike Castles of the world and become a true centrist party.
  3. 21 Feb '16 16:43
    We can safely say that a significant minority of Republicans are morons, but that's hardly news, is it?
  4. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    21 Feb '16 17:10
    Originally posted by sh76
    Well, he doesn't quite have 500 delegates, but I will concede that he's still the front runner and that's it's not that early any more.

    Are Republicans "god-damned morons"? Some are, I suppose. Keep in mind that Trump is only getting about 1/3 of the GOP vote, though that is a plurality.

    I can kind of see Trump's extremely superficial appeal. He's as stra ...[text shortened]... We can recruit the John Kasichs and Mike Castles of the world and become a true centrist party.
    If you're anti-Trump, the SC exit polls aren't very reassuring; he finished at least 10 points ahead of Rubio among Republicans who described themselves as "very conservative" "somewhat conservative" AND "moderate". I suppose the March 1st primaries might be where his tide must be turned and that's possible; polls in the last month have Cruz ahead in Texas and Arkansas and both Rubio and Cruz within striking distance in Georgia, Virginia and Oklahoma. If Trump can be beaten in most of those, then he could be very vulnerable in the other States on Super Tuesday (where no recent polling exists)..
  5. Standard member vivify
    rain
    21 Feb '16 17:12 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by sh76

    A Trump nomination would just gift wrap the election for Hillary.
    I honestly don't think so anymore. I don't think Hillary is sharp enough to combat Trump. Bernie and Trump have been compared to each other because they're both straight-talking non-establishment types. Because of that similarity, I think Sanders is the only one who stands a chance against Trump. Merely pointing out Trump's flaws (like Hillary would do) won't work, since nothing Trump says or does seems to put even the smallest dent in his poll numbers.

    You can only fight fire with fire here, and that would be Sanders against Trump.
  6. 21 Feb '16 17:36
    Originally posted by KazetNagorra
    We can safely say that a significant minority of Republicans are morons, but that's hardly news, is it?
    How large a percentage of Democrats are morons? Is it news that there are morons on both sides of the political divide?
  7. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    21 Feb '16 17:38 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by vivify
    I honestly don't think so anymore. I don't think Hillary is sharp enough to combat Trump. Bernie and Trump have been compared to each other because they're both straight-talking non-establishment types. Because of that similarity, I think Sanders is the only one who stands a chance against Trump. Merely pointing out Trump's flaws (like Hillary would do) w ...[text shortened]... ll numbers.

    You can only fight fire with fire here, and that would be Sanders against Trump.
    The problem is that I think 55% of the people would vote for a ham sandwich over Trump, whereas only 45% will vote for a ham sandwich over Hillary. In a Trump vs. Hillary match-up, 20% will enthusiastically support each candidate and the middle will hold their collective noses and vote for Hillary.
  8. 21 Feb '16 17:43
    Originally posted by sh76
    The problem is that I think 55% of the people would vote for a ham sandwich over Trump, whereas only 45% will vote for a ham sandwich over Hillary. In a Trump vs. Hillary match-up, 20% will enthusiastically support each candidate and the middle will hold their collective noses and vote for Hillary.
    I disagree. A lot of Trump support comes from centrists and some leftists. Hillary has probably the highest negatives ever, and even die hard Democrats will have difficulty voting for her. They may prefer to stay home instead.
  9. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    21 Feb '16 17:53
    Originally posted by sh76
    The problem is that I think 55% of the people would vote for a ham sandwich over Trump, whereas only 45% will vote for a ham sandwich over Hillary. In a Trump vs. Hillary match-up, 20% will enthusiastically support each candidate and the middle will hold their collective noses and vote for Hillary.
    Both have terrible unfavorable ratings among voters (Trump on average -20; Hillary -12) and given how well known each are I really don't see that changing much by November. Trump is really unpopular among independents though at -27%. I could see Hillary losing to him if the economy tanks or there's some type of big terrorist attack but other than that it's probably an Obama-McCain replay.
  10. Standard member vivify
    rain
    21 Feb '16 17:54
    Originally posted by KazetNagorra
    We can safely say that a significant minority of Republicans are morons, but that's hardly news, is it?
    If only a minority of Republicans were morons, Trump wouldn't have over six times the delegates of his nearest opponent.
  11. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    21 Feb '16 17:56
    Originally posted by normbenign
    I disagree. A lot of Trump support comes from centrists and some leftists. Hillary has probably the highest negatives ever, and even die hard Democrats will have difficulty voting for her. They may prefer to stay home instead.
    You are wrong as usual; Trump has higher negatives than Hillary and a far higher percentage of Republicans express the idea that Trump is an unacceptable nominee than do Democrats regarding Hillary.
  12. 21 Feb '16 18:06 / 1 edit
    Trump is there to destroy the GOP.

    Trump is a life long democrat and it was just a few years ago he was singing the praises of Hilary as Secretary of State and wished she would run for President.

    If Trump does not win the nomination so that Hillary can win in the general election, he will go third party and torpedo the GOP nominee.

    It's like Bernie said, who also has no chance because he does not have the delegates, it's all rigged.
  13. 21 Feb '16 18:10 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    You are wrong as usual; Trump has higher negatives than Hillary and a far higher percentage of Republicans express the idea that Trump is an unacceptable nominee than do Democrats regarding Hillary.
    I saw your post with the numbers, and all I can say is it all depends on who you ask, and when. The fact that there are a number of choices for Republicans necessarily leads to greater negatives for Trump. Hillary is facing only one competitor, which really surprises me. A year ago, she was virtually dead in the water as a potential candidate. Now she is rehabbed, or is she, with Bernie a virtual unknown running neck and neck. That ought to worry folks on her side. With her name and political capital, it really ought not be that close, especially in the party of the current President.
  14. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    21 Feb '16 18:11
    Originally posted by whodey
    Trump is there to destroy the GOP.

    Trump is a life long democrat and it was just a few years ago he was singing the praises of Hilary as Secretary of State and wished she would run for President.

    If Trump does not win the nomination so that Hillary can win in the general election, he will go third party and torpedo the GOP nominee.

    It's like Bernie said, who also has no chance because he does not have the delegates, it's all rigged.
    Conspiracy nuts gotta do what they do.

    I think Trump wants to be President. He saw that his chances of winning the Democratic nomination against Hillary were pretty poor, so he remade himself into a conservative Republican. I don't think he'd run a 3rd Party campaign because he would lose and he hates losing. He probably does think like norm and believe he can beat Hillary in the general as the GOP candidate though.
  15. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    21 Feb '16 18:13
    Originally posted by normbenign
    I saw your post with the numbers, and all I can say is it all depends on who you ask, and when.
    Naturally you would say that; reality cannot intrude on your preconceived ideological suppositions.