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  1. Account suspended
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    17 Feb '17 13:03
    Well well well, what goes around comes around, the hypocrisy of the American Intel exposed once again.

    Wikileaks Exposes CIA Involvement In French 2012 Presidential Election


    CIA espionage orders for the last French presidential election
    All major French political parties were targeted for infiltration by the CIA's human ("HUMINT"😉 and electronic ("SIGINT"😉 spies in the seven months leading up to France's 2012 presidential election. The revelations are contained within three CIA tasking orders published today by WikiLeaks as context for its forth coming CIA Vault 7 series. Named specifically as targets are the French Socialist Party (PS), the National Front (FN) and Union for a Popular Movement (UMP) together with current President Francois Hollande, then President Nicolas Sarkozy, current round one presidential front runner Marine Le Pen, and former presidential candidates Martine Aubry and Dominique Strauss-Khan.

    The CIA assessed that President Sarkozy's party was not assured re-election. Specific tasking concerning his party included obtaining the "Strategic Election Plans" of the Union for a Popular Movement (UMP); schisms or alliances developing in the UMP elite; private UMP reactions to Sarkozy's campaign stratagies; discussions within the UMP on any "perceived vulnerabilities to maintaining power" after the election; efforts to change the party's ideological mission; and discussions about Sarkozy's support for the UMP and "the value he places on the continuation of the party's dominance". Specific instructions tasked CIA officers to discover Sarkozy's private deliberations "on the other candidates" as well as how he interacted with his advisors. Sarkozy's earlier self-identification as "Sarkozy the American" did not protect him from US espionage in the 2012 election or during his presidency.

    The espionage order for "Non Ruling Political Parties and Candidates Strategic Election Plans" which targeted Francois Holland, Marine Le Pen and other opposition figures requires obtaining opposition parties' strategies for the election; information on internal party dynamics and rising leaders; efforts to influence and implement political decisions; support from local government officials, government elites or business elites; views of the United States; efforts to reach out to other countries, including Germany, U.K., Libya, Israel, Palestine, Syria & Cote d'Ivoire; as well as information about party and candidate funding.

    Significantly, two CIA opposition espionage tasks, "What policies do they promote to help boost France's economic growth prospects?" and "What are their opinions on the German model of export-led growth?" resonate with a U.S. economic espionage order from the same year. That order requires obtaining details of every prospective French export contract or deal valued at $200m or more.

    The opposition espionage order also places weight on obtaining the candidates' attitudes to the E.U's economic crisis, centering around their position on the Greek debt crisis; the role of France and Germany in the management of the Greek debt crisis; the vulnerability of French government and French banks to a Greek default; and "specific proposals and recommendations" to deal with "the euro-zone crisis".

    The CIA espionage orders published today are classified and restricted to U.S. eyes only ("NOFORN"😉 due to "Friends-on-Friends sensitivities". The orders state that the collected information is to "support" the activities of the CIA, the Defence Intelligence Agency (DIA)'s E.U section, and the U.S. State Department's Intelligence and Research Branch.

    The CIA operation ran for ten months from 21 Nov 2011 to 29 Sep 2012, crossing the April-May 2012 French presidential election and several months into the formation of the new government.

    https://wikileaks.org/cia-france-elections-2012/#Press Release (English)
  2. Joined
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    17 Feb '17 13:051 edit
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    Well well well, what goes around comes around, the hypocrisy of the American Intel exposed once again.

    Wikileaks Exposes CIA Involvement In French 2012 Presidential Election


    CIA espionage orders for the last French presidential election
    All major French political parties were targeted for infiltration by the CIA's human ("HUMINT"😉 and electr ...[text shortened]... the new government.

    https://wikileaks.org/cia-france-elections-2012/#Press Release (English)
    This can't be Robbie cuz it is against the law.

    Look kids, more fake news!

    Racist!
  3. Standard memberDeepThought
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    17 Feb '17 13:28
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    Well well well, what goes around comes around, the hypocrisy of the American Intel exposed once again.

    Wikileaks Exposes CIA Involvement In French 2012 Presidential Election


    CIA espionage orders for the last French presidential election
    All major French political parties were targeted for infiltration by the CIA's human ("HUMINT"😉 and electr ...[text shortened]... the new government.

    https://wikileaks.org/cia-france-elections-2012/#Press Release (English)
    Just a point, but "spying on" isn't the same as "interfering with". What is described in your OP is just information gathering. Unless there is evidence of actual interference, in other words trying to alter the result, I think this is a non-story. The purpose of releasing it is probably to make a Le Pen victory more likely with the Kremlin friendly result of a collapse of the EU.
  4. Account suspended
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    17 Feb '17 13:334 edits
    Originally posted by DeepThought
    Just a point, but "spying on" isn't the same as "interfering with". What is described in your OP is just information gathering. Unless there is evidence of actual interference, in other words trying to alter the result, I think this is a non-story. The purpose of releasing it is probably to make a Le Pen victory more likely with the Kremlin friendly result of a collapse of the EU.
    First of all the claim was involvement, interference is your own word, but I understand the nuances and its a valid point. Secondly there is more evidence here for CIA involvement in the French election than there was for the so called Russian 'interference' with the US election. The purpose of releasing it is pure propaganda, I agree.

    efforts to influence and implement political decisions; support from local government officials, government elites or business elites - when does involvement become interference?
  5. Standard membervivify
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    17 Feb '17 13:59
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    Secondly there is more evidence here for CIA involvement in the French election than there was for the so called Russian 'interference' with the US election.
    That's not correct. The FBI released a report detailing tools the Russians used to hack the DNC. Those hacks directly lead to the information being distributed by Wikileaks. This is not in dispute. The only thing that's not yet proven is whether or not Putin was behind this.

    http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/trump-associates-communicated-suspected-russian-intelligence-officials-ahead/story?id=45500891

    It has now been shown that Trump communicated with suspected Russian intelligence during the campaign. This is possibly an impeachable offense.

    when does involvement become interference?

    Interference is involvement that's not allowed or is illegal. Hacking the DNC would likely fit that criteria.
  6. Account suspended
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    17 Feb '17 14:331 edit
    Originally posted by vivify
    That's not correct. The FBI released a report detailing tools the Russians used to hack the DNC. Those hacks directly lead to the information being distributed by Wikileaks. This is not in dispute. The only thing that's not yet proven is whether or not Putin was behind this.

    http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/trump-associates-communicated-suspected-russia ...[text shortened]... s involvement that's not allowed or is illegal. Hacking the DNC would likely fit that criteria.
    As a web developer i am sure you know how networking functions. Shall we consider the technical evidence for these unfounded and unsubstantiated allegations?

    To see the evidence of Russian hacking first hand, I downloaded the CSV file and converted it into a spreadsheet. The CSV file and the XML file both contained the same data. Here is the XML link to this data which can be viewed online in a web browser.
    https://www.us-cert.gov/sites/default/files/publications/JAR-16-20296.xml

    Both files provide a list of 895 “indicators” of Russian Hacking. Unfortunately, nearly all of these indicators are simply IP addresses. In other words, it is a list of 895 servers from from more than 40 countries around the world. But the list also includes a few website domain names. (Domain names are simply the name of the website such as Youtube.com). I looked up these website domain names with the the following tool which tells us who owns the domain names and where they are located:
    https://www.whois.net/

    My review of these domain names confirmed that none of these domain names have any relationship to Russian government hackers. Here are the results for four of the domain names provided by the DHS and the FBI as evidence of Russian hacking:

    ritsoperrol.ru is not in use. It is registered to a private person. The named server hosting the domain is nserver: ns0.xtremeweb.de. This is a German web hosting and consulting company whose address and phone number are publicly listed on their website. It is highly unlikely that Russian hackers would use a public German web host to register and host their domain names.

    littlejohnwilhap.ru is not in use and is available to be purchased. It is unlikely that Russian hackers would use a domain name like this to launch a cyber attack on the US.

    wilcarobbe.com is taken and is not in use. It is registered to Arsen Ramanov in Groznenskaya Russia. His address, phone number and email address are all publicly listed. It is highly unlikely that Russian hackers would use a domain name that was publicly listed. Hackers are not idiots.

    one2shoppee.com is taken and is registered with GoDaddy.com. It is not currently in use. But it is highly unlikely that Russian Hackers would register their domain names with GoDaddy – which is a US server. In fact, it is very unlikely that Russian hackers would ever use any US servers. They would only use their own servers.

    None of the 885 IP addresses have any confirmed relationship to Russian Government Hackers

    An IP address is simply a numerical designation for a server. The 885 IP addresses listed in the DHS – FBI CSV file were even more interesting. The IP addresses were located on servers from the US and more than 40 nations around the world including more than 30 IP addresses supposedly located in China. Here are a few of the IP addresses

    167.114.35.70
    185.12.46.178
    46.102.152.132
    178.20.55.16
    I looked up several of these IP addresses using the following tool:
    http://whatismyipaddress.com/ip-lookup

    Here are a four examples of IP addresses in the DHS-FBI report:

    167.114.35.70 is a Canadian Corporate server specializing in the promotion of Bitcoin. They are within a few miles of the US border.

    185.12.46.178 is a Swiss corporate server associated with the domain name leavesorus.com. The domain name leavesorus.com is currently available to be purchased. This indicates that this is a fake domain name and likely a fake corporation.

    46.102.152.132 is another Swiss corporate server this one specializing in emails and associated with the domain name maxsultan.xyz which is a fake domain name. This also indicates that this is another fake corporation.

    178.20.55.16 is a proxy server with no known location but has been used as a TOR router exit node. A proxy server is another name for a mirror or server used to bounce information from one server to another in order to hide the true location of the original server. This proxy server is associated with the domain name nos-oignons.net. This domain name was registered on December 31 2012 and is valid until December 31 2017. In other words, whoever got this domain name paid for its use for 5 years. But they did registered the domain name anonymously. The website associated with this server appears to be a group in France promoting the TOR router. They became an association in May 2013 – 5 months after getting the domain name. The group currently has 5 members and it costs one Euro to join this group. Their website was reported 9 days ago as having been infected with the Zues virus. This infection does not leave tracks on server logs. So it is difficult to tell where it came from. Removal of this virus requires a complete rebuild of the server. In short, some agency decided to take out this server and then use it to make a cyber attack on some US government agency and thus have the IP address listed on the DHS-FBI list as one of 895 indicators of Russian hacking.

    Actually, there were two Russian servers located on lines 259 and 261. Here are the IP addresses.

    93.171.203.244
    95.105.72.78
    Here is more information about each of these:

    93.171.203.244 This is a clean broadband server located near Ufa which is a city in Russia with one million people. It is associated with an organization called Miragroup Ltd. The website is rxbrothers.ru. Naturally, this is a fake domain name which is available to be purchased. Miragroup is actually a corporation located in Great Britain.

    95.105.72.78 is another clean broadband server located near Ufa. The organization is JSC Ufanet and the website is ufanet.ru which is a public broadband service started in 1997. Someone apparently is using this broadband service to hack the US government. Could this be the smoking gun that the Russian government is attacking the US? Think about it. If you were a Russian hacker, would you really use a public server located in some Russian town? I don’t think so. This is more like evidence that some hacker was using the local public library.

    Real Russian Hackers do not use Windows Servers

    It is hard to say what the real purpose of this fake DHS-FBI report is. But the fact that this silly list of IP addresses was the best evidence they could provide should be a strong indication that there really is no evidence of Russian hacking. Instead, it is more likely that Wikileaks is telling the truth in stating that they got the emails from a disgruntled Democratic Party insider.

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-01-01/if-there-really-was-evidence-russian-hacking-nsa-would-have-it
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    17 Feb '17 15:22
    Somebody shout Robbie down, this is a safe zone.

    Where did my vagina hat go?

    I'm scared, help me Barry!! 😞
  8. Account suspended
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    17 Feb '17 15:49
    Originally posted by whodey
    Somebody shout Robbie down, this is a safe zone.

    Where did my vagina hat go?

    I'm scared, help me Barry!! 😞
    LOL pussy hats on, we must be allowed to kill our babies, its our right! march! march! march!
  9. Standard memberDeepThought
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    17 Feb '17 15:55
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    As a web developer i am sure you know how networking functions. Shall we consider the technical evidence for these unfounded and unsubstantiated allegations?

    To see the evidence of Russian hacking first hand, I downloaded the CSV file and converted it into a spreadsheet. The CSV file and the XML file both contained the same data. Here is the XML ...[text shortened]... www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-01-01/if-there-really-was-evidence-russian-hacking-nsa-would-have-it
    Is this a cut & paste from zerohedge.com or did you personally actually go through all these steps? I find the claims that Russians would not use "publicly listed server X" because it is publicly listed unconvincing. There is such a thing as a bot net and well, one wouldn't use one's own machine for this kind of operation.
  10. Account suspended
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    17 Feb '17 16:052 edits
    Originally posted by DeepThought
    Is this a cut & paste from zerohedge.com or did you personally actually go through all these steps? I find the claims that Russians would not use "publicly listed server X" because it is publicly listed unconvincing. There is such a thing as a bot net and well, one wouldn't use one's own machine for this kind of operation.
    Of course its a cut and paste. Fine you find it unconvincing, never the less the evidence that the DNC was hacked by Russian state sponsored hackers is non existent in the FBI's ludicrous intelligence release. I suspect they thought they could foist it on the public in the hope that its technical details would carry it. Its amazing how may people still don't know how the internet works.
  11. Standard membervivify
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    17 Feb '17 16:27
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    As a web developer i am sure you know how networking functions. Shall we consider the technical evidence for these unfounded and unsubstantiated allegations?

    To see the evidence of Russian hacking first hand, I downloaded the CSV file and converted it into a spreadsheet. The CSV file and the XML file both contained the same data. Here is the XML ...[text shortened]... www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-01-01/if-there-really-was-evidence-russian-hacking-nsa-would-have-it
    Regarding websites, you do not need to be in the country where it's IP is located. You can log into a website from anywhere in the world. Having an IP that's German proves nothing.

    Whoever you copied your "refutation" from seems to rely on ignorant readers who don't realize you can access a domain from anywhere in the world.
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    17 Feb '17 16:383 edits
    Originally posted by vivify
    Regarding websites, you do not need to be in the country where it's IP is located. You can log into a website from anywhere in the world. Having an IP that's German proves nothing.

    Whoever you copied your "refutation" from seems to rely on ignorant readers who don't realize you can access a domain from anywhere in the world.
    Regarding websites, you do not need to be in the country where it's IP is located. You can log into a website from anywhere in the world - You don't say.

    Who don't realize you can access a domain from anywhere in the world

    On the contrary that's exactly the point the article was making, how you could have failed to understand this begs belief. Let me put it in perspective for you.

    The FBI's list of IP addresses was MEANINGLESS and did not demonstrate any correlation to the claims that they made. I suspect that you had not even looked at their report, how could you and still parrot the same claims. NO EVIDENCE of Russian state sponsored hacking of the DNC. I am not saying that the Russkies never did it, all I am saying is that neither you nor the FBI nor anyone else who has parroted the claim has produced any credible evidence for it.
  13. Standard memberHandyAndy
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    17 Feb '17 16:55
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-01-01/if-there-really-was-evidence-russian-hacking-nsa-would-have-it
    Your credibility is intact, zeroboy.

    It's still zero.
  14. Standard memberDeepThought
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    17 Feb '17 17:28
    Originally posted by vivify
    Regarding websites, you do not need to be in the country where it's IP is located. You can log into a website from anywhere in the world. Having an IP that's German proves nothing.

    Whoever you copied your "refutation" from seems to rely on ignorant readers who don't realize you can access a domain from anywhere in the world.
    It was zerohedge.com which is to all intents and purposes a Russian propaganda site. Also it relies on the user not copy and pasting the first URL [1] given into their browser. The file exists, but doing that leaves out the style file. After a little investigation I found the parent directory [2]. The purpose of the release is not to provide evidence of Russian hacking. It is a list of IP addresses for system administrators to take note of and block. In other words the original author of the cut and paste has published a file in the knowledge that most people who check it will not be able to access the document and check his claims or to try to find the real purpose of the document. So the accusation is false. The intelligence community were simply providing network admins with information to protect their systems.

    [1] https://www.us-cert.gov/sites/default/files/publications/JAR-16-20296A.xml
    [2] https://www.us-cert.gov/security-publications/GRIZZLY-STEPPE-Russian-Malicious-Cyber-Activity
  15. Account suspended
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    17 Feb '17 17:37
    Originally posted by HandyAndy
    Your credibility is intact, zeroboy.

    It's still zero.
    You mean like your evidence, agreed Randolph Gandolph!
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