04 Nov 09
Big wins in VA and NJ could be the start of a resurgence of common sense Republican policies.
Hoffman's loss in NY-23 shows that ideologues and extremists continue to generally lose and hopefully this discourages the GOP from backing far right conservatives and may help secure the nomination of Crist over Rubio in Florida, which will most likely mean a moderate GOP pickup in the Senate.
Bloomberg wins in NY (which is good because he's a competent mayor); but the margin is kept low enough so that the people can express contempt for politicians who try to grab too much power.
Not sure what to make about gay rights. WA voted to expand domestic partnerships to basically the same level as marriage while just not calling it "marriage," while ME voters overturn state law allowing gay marriage. I personally don't have strong feelings on this issue (though I hate when judges try to make the decision for the state), but I think it's pretty clear which way the wind is blowing on this issue.
All in all, a great night last night. Now all we need is a Yankee win tonight and all will be right with the World.
04 Nov 09
Originally posted by sh76The gay marriage issue is disappointing to me. Like you say though it's clear which way the wind is blowing. The repeal vote got only 53%, while in Washington the "all but marriage" bill barely passed. From what I've seen it's just an issue of waiting for the old (who vote) to die, and the current young to age.
Big wins in VA and NJ could be the start of a resurgence of common sense Republican policies.
Hoffman's loss in NY-23 shows that ideologues and extremists continue to generally lose and hopefully this discourages the GOP from backing far right conservatives and may help secure the nomination of Crist over Rubio in Florida, which will most likely mean a moder ...[text shortened]... last night. Now all we need is a Yankee win tonight and all will be right with the World.
04 Nov 09
1 edit
Originally posted by sh76Christie has a great opportunity to put himself in play as a future presidential candidate - IF:
Big wins in VA and NJ could be the start of a resurgence of common sense Republican policies.
Hoffman's loss in NY-23 shows that ideologues and extremists continue to generally lose and hopefully this discourages the GOP from backing far right conservatives and may help secure the nomination of Crist over Rubio in Florida, which will most likely mean a moder last night. Now all we need is a Yankee win tonight and all will be right with the World.
IF he can provide a compelling example of how a moderate Republican can take charge and find solutions to vexing problems. IF he can come up with a plan that effectively deals with the property tax and budget issues that have been plaguing the state for many years. IF he can come up with novel ways to reform the education system. IF he can crack down on "pay to play" and other forms of corruption. IF he does these things, he will have an actual record to run on instead of the usual empty rah rah rhetoric - and he'd be an example of a Republican who can appeal to blue state voters, and not have to rely so heavily on rural voters from the South and West.
IF.
04 Nov 09
1 edit
Originally posted by sh76I have a different take on this. Hoffman had what, about 30 days to take his shot? In that time he destroyed the RINO candidate through what turned into a national grassroots effort, even though the GOP spent about a million bucks on Scozzafava's campaign. That's pretty impressive for a no name, rather uninspiring, goofy looking candidate. I think the lesson for the GOP here is that the conservative base is willing and quite able to torpedo RINO candidates if the GOP chooses to back them. Also, none of the people pulling for Hoffman nation wide are going to give a dime to the GOP over this. Crist and Fiorina are going to get the same treatment as Scozzafava.
Hoffman's loss in NY-23 shows that ideologues and extremists continue to generally lose and hopefully this discourages the GOP from backing far right conservatives and may help secure the nomination of Crist over Rubio in Florida, which will most likely mean a moderate GOP pickup in the Senate.
Also, I'm curious what positions taken by Hoffman and Rubio you find extremist.
04 Nov 09
2 edits
Originally posted by SleepyguyHeck, I would like to know what is even considered extermist on the conservative side in general. Is it being fiscally responsible? Is it being opposed to abortion?
Also, I'm curious what positions taken by Hoffman and Rubio you find extremist.[/b]
As for the public at large, I get the sense that they are outraged by a deteriorating economy and standard of living in combination with ever increasing taxes and increased government spending and control. Am I wrong here or are these the key issues?
04 Nov 09
1 edit
Originally posted by SleepyguyAs a threshold matter, I don't like the term RINO. Republicans chose to become Republicans and that alone means something. Just because someone is moderate doesn't mean they can't be a Republican.
I have a different take on this. Hoffman had what, about 30 days to take his shot? In that time he destroyed the RINO candidate through what turned into a national grassroots effort, even though the GOP spent about a million bucks on Scozzafava's campaign. That's pretty impressive for a no name, rather uninspiring, goofy looking candidate. I think the ...[text shortened]... cozzafava.
Also, I'm curious what positions taken by Hoffman and Rubio you find extremist.
As for Hoffman and Rubio, I call them extremist candidates only because they've been described as far right candidates by all media sources, including conservative ones.
04 Nov 09
Originally posted by MelanerpesHe also has to lose 100 pounds before he can think of running for President.
Christie has a great opportunity to put himself in play as a future presidential candidate - IF:
IF he can provide a compelling example of how a moderate Republican can take charge and find solutions to vexing problems. IF he can come up with a plan that effectively deals with the property tax and budget issues that have been plaguing the state for man ...[text shortened]... state voters, and not have to rely so heavily on rural voters from the South and West.
IF.
Huckabee did it. I guess he can too.
04 Nov 09
Originally posted by sh76I don't think the term RINO is interchangeable with "moderate". It's more indicative of a Republican that can't be trusted when it really counts (Snowe), or that uses the party platform merely to gain power (Specter).
As a threshold matter, I don't like the term RINO. Republicans chose to become Republicans and that alone means something. Just because someone is moderate doesn't mean they can't be a Republican.
Would you say choosing to become a Republican "meant something" to Dede Scozzafava, who quickly endorsed the Democrat as soon as it became obvious she couldn't win as a Republican? Would you say choosing to become a Republican meant something to Arlen Specter? What loyalty do conservatives owe these people simply because they have the (R) behind their name? Zero, in my opinion.
04 Nov 09
2 edits
Originally posted by SleepyguyBut Snowe is a Republican. She caucuses with the republicans and generally votes with them. The fact that she considers breaking from them on occasion doesn't make her not a Republican.
I don't think the term RINO is interchangeable with "moderate". It's more indicative of a Republican that can't be trusted when it really counts (Snowe), or that uses the party platform merely to gain power (Specter).
Would you say choosing to become a Republican "meant something" to Dede Scozzafava, who quickly endorsed the Democrat as soon as it beca e these people simply because they have the (R) behind their name? Zero, in my opinion.
I'm basically pro-choice on abortion (to a limited extent). I support same sex unions and I don't really have a major problem with same sex marriage. I am in favor of Clinton-level federal taxation (though no higher), I support more corporate regulation and I'd like to see Medicare expanded to optionally cover all Americans. I'd like to see a pull out of Afghanistan and in retrospect, the Iraq war wasn't such a hot idea either. I support the legalization of marijuana and perhaps harder drugs as well.
Am I a RINO? I GUARANTEE you that Rush Limbaugh would say that I am.
But I'm not.
Why not?
I support strong law and order policies, including most provisions in the Patriot Act. I support school choice rather than enormous school taxes for publicly run schools. I support the free market, limited only by what's necessary to prevent predatory practices. I support a strong foreign policy that protects US interests abroad whether or not the UN or EU agrees with them (though coalition building where possible is a good idea). I support individual choice and individual responsibility. I support workfare over welfare. I support balanced budgets (I know, Bush didn't; but the Republican position is still to support them). I don't like judicial activism and prefer the likes of John Roberts on the Supreme Court to the likes of Sonia Sotomayor.
Yes, I have positions from both parties; but on the whole, I lean right. Therefore, I'm a Republican. I am a member of the Republican party and more often than not, I vote Republican at the ballot. As an example, yesterday, in 7 races, I voted for 5 Republicans and 2 Democrats (all local races).
Being a Republican doesn't mean always toeing the line and supporting the party no matter what.
04 Nov 09
Originally posted by sh76Exactly. Then you should have no problem with the Republicans who abandoned Scozzafava for Hoffman, nor those who will abandon Crist for Rubio. Like you, they are just trying to get someone in office to represent their views. I don't think you get to be offended by the term RINO as long as you're throwing the term "extremist" around. Fair enough?
Being a Republican doesn't mean always toeing the line and supporting the party no matter what.
04 Nov 09
Originally posted by SleepyguyI don't have any problem at all with the Hoffman voters. I just don't agree with them politically.
Exactly. Then you should have no problem with the Republicans who abandoned Scozzafava for Hoffman, nor those who will abandon Crist for Rubio. Like you, they are just trying to get someone in office to represent their views. I don't think you get to be offended by the term RINO as long as you're throwing the term "extremist" around. Fair enough?
As far as RINO vs. extremist, I can agree to drop the latter term.
04 Nov 09
1 edit
BTW, the effects of NY-23 are already visible. Cornyn is backpedaling from the NRSC's endorsement of Crist (which was probably calculated to discourage contributions to Rubio). Now he's refusing to spend money on Crist in the primary, and saying it's up to Floridians to figure out who the Republican candidate is going to be. It's working.
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National Republican Senatorial Committee Chairman John Cornyn (R-Tex.) says he won't channel cash into any primary pitting Republican vs. Republican -- including the heated Florida Senate primary between Marco Rubio and Gov. Charlie Crist.
"As far as what's happening in specifically Florida -- we made a decision to endorse Gov. Crist at his request. But we'e really not involved in the primary," Cornyn told Manu. "That's up to the voters in Florida."
When he asked Cornyn, "But you are at least raising and spending money for Crist?" Cornyn shot back --
"No, we won't be doing any of that until after the nomination. Our job is to elect Republicans so voters in Florida will have a chance to sort that out."
http://www.politico.com/blogs/glennthrush/1109/Cornyn_NRSC_wont_play_in_primaries.html
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