How sad, whodey, that your parochial manichaeism means you haven't a single word to say about an apparent conspiracy within the Catholic church to cover up paedophilia on a massive scale. Not a word of condemnation, not a word of protest, not a word of sympathy for the victims.
("Ow-ah, ow-ah, not fayur - you haven't said anything about my examples. nyaaaa nyaaa" )
Originally posted by generalissimo Its obvious the church needs urgent reform and change in the way it treats criminals. The pope has to resign, there is no other way.
Its shameful that the church has covered up years of abuse, it is simply inexcusable. But I have hope that justice will ultimately prevail.
Have the Pope resign? There is as much chance of that as there is someone like Michael Jackson turning himself in or the President of the United States resigning. Why on earth would they give up all that power and wealth?
You are right about one thing, justice will eventually prevail. God help these guys who do these things in the name of God. In this respect, they are the worst of the worst and will have to answer for it someday before God.
Originally posted by whodey You are right about one thing, justice will eventually prevail. God help these guys who do these things in the name of God. In this respect, they are the worst of the worst and will have to answer for it someday before God.
In this context, talk of 'justice before God' is surely a vapid platitude. What about justice in the here and now? Any thoughts? Saying that "justice will eventually prevail" and then indicating that it will happen in the 'afterlife' is a completely irrelevant kind of alleged justice - and that's even assuming it is any kind of "justice" at all.
Originally posted by whodey Have the Pope resign? [...] Why on earth would they give up all that power and wealth?
Well, it could be argued that the Catholic Church's power and wealth is under threat. A lot of it could be taken away. Would the Pope resigning serve to head this off at the pass to any extent, I wonder.
Originally posted by FMF In this context, talk of 'justice before God' is surely a vapid platitude. What about justice in the here and now? Any thoughts? Saying that "justice will eventually prevail" and then indicating that it will happen in the 'afterlife' is a completely irrelevant kind of alleged justice - and that's even assuming it is any kind of "justice" at all.
Justice in this life is a noble effort, but is often lacking when it comes to the rich and powerful. So tell me, what justice did Michael Jackson recieve? What justice will Obama's czar recieve etc.? In fact, what good is vengence on these twisted souls other than to preven them from doing it again? How will it make up for what they have done?
I don't make the rules FMF, I just observe and that is what I observe.
Originally posted by FMF Well, it could be argued that the Catholic Church's power and wealth is under threat. A lot of it could be taken away. Would the Pope resigning serve to head this off at the pass to any extent, I wonder.
Originally posted by whodey Have the Pope resign? There is as much chance of that as there is someone like Michael Jackson turning himself in or the President of the United States resigning. Why on earth would they give up all that power and wealth?
You are right about one thing, justice will eventually prevail. God help these guys who do these things in the name of God. In this respect, they are the worst of the worst and will have to answer for it someday before God.
I find it very unlikely too, but considering he was directly involved in the cover-ups, resignation is only the right thing to do, furthermore, if he does not resign that will ony do further damage to the church.
Originally posted by FMF That's right. He wanted to spend more time with his family, as I recall.
Actually, Pope Celestine V, an octogenarian former hermit, resigned on realising he was too old, naive and saintly for the job. But his abdication led to the election of Boniface VIII (who may have talked Celestine into resignation, and indeed imprisoned his predecessor on succeeding to the Papacy). Along with the corruption and worldliness not untypical of medieval popes, Boniface was responsible for the violent sack of Palestrina, and for sending the poet Dante into exile. Dante got his revenge in the Divine Comedy by finding a space for Boniface in hell even though he hadn't died yet; and he also damned Celestine for allowing Boniface to take power, referring to the hapless old Pope as "he who through cowardice made the great refusal", and leaving him in the vestibule of hell, along with the rest of the "uncommitted": those who did nothing either for good or evil.
I wonder where Dante would find space for Ratzinger.
His Pedophile-Covering Holiness Benedict XVI
28 Mar '10 13:08
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