Lula proves once again that he is indeed a fool.

Originally posted by generalissimo
Im not sure what point you're trying to make.

I never denied there was abuse, nor did I say the dictatorship was right all along, all my posts regarding the subject remain with consistent with the view that it was the lesser of two evils. I think there should be no hypocrisy, if there are going to be prosecutions they should target people on both si ...[text shortened]... all it is, there's no evidence torture and murder happened to the majority of the population.

The majority of the German people weren't victims of the Holocaust, but that didn't prevent the perpetrators of that crime from winding up on the business end of a hangman's knot.

I have a suggestion for you: since you've never met anyone who was a relative of the victims of your country's dictator, why don't you head down to Goias, find Waldomiro Batista and tell him what you told us on this forum i.e. "the only people who died or were imprisoned were the small minority of communists who fought to install their own dictatorship" or that murdering his sister was the "lesser of two evils". I'm sure that would make for an informative debate.

Originally posted by generalissimo
Unlike you I actually lived in the country, and let me tell you, I never came across anyone who felt they were directly harmed by the dicatorship, they complained the system was undemocratic (which I find perfectly reasonable) , but I never met anyone who had relatives imprisoned or killed by the authorities.

How nice. Let's also remember that you would have no problem with the state you were living in if it executed homosexuals because - as you said - it wouldn't affect you personally. So there is the measure of you when it comes to supporting/opposing repression and human rights atrocities. You personify the I'm Alright Jack principle.

Originally posted by no1marauder
I have a suggestion for you [generalissimo]: since you've never met anyone who was a relative of the victims of your country's dictator, why don't you head down to Goias, find Waldomiro Batista and tell him what you told us on this forum i.e. "the only people who died or were imprisoned were the small minority of communists who fought to install their ow ...[text shortened]... ister was the "lesser of two evils". I'm sure that would make for an informative debate.

Tell him to bring TWO pairs of his plastic debating pants.

Originally posted by no1marauder
The majority of the German people weren't victims of the Holocaust, but that didn't prevent the perpetrators of that crime from winding up on the business end of a hangman's knot.

I have a suggestion for you: since you've never met anyone who was a relative of the victims of your country's dictator, why don't you head down to Goias, fi ...[text shortened]... er was the "lesser of two evils". I'm sure that would make for an informative debate.

The majority of the German people weren't victims of the Holocaust...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reductio_ad_Hitlerum

have a suggestion for you: since you've never met anyone who was a relative of the victims of your country's dictator, why don't you head down to Goias, find Waldomiro Batista and tell him what you told us on this forum i.e. "the only people who died or were imprisoned were the small minority of communists who fought to install their own dictatorship" or that murdering his sister was the "lesser of two evils". I'm sure that would make for an informative debate.

Again, no point made.

Pointing out some extreme example doesn't change facts.

Originally posted by generalissimo
[/b]The majority of the German people weren't victims of the Holocaust...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reductio_ad_Hitlerum

have a suggestion for you: since you've never met anyone who was a relative of the victims of your country's dictator, why don't you head down to Goias, find Waldomiro Batista and tell him what you told us on this for b]

Again, no point made.

Pointing out some extreme example doesn't change facts.

The fact is you're an ignorant little fascist who is an apologist for a bunch of murderous thugs.

Originally posted by FMF
How nice. Let's also remember that you would have no problem with the state you were living in if it executed homosexuals because - as you said - it wouldn't affect you personally. So there is the measure of you when it comes to supporting/opposing repression and human rights atrocities. You personify the I'm Alright Jack principle.

I really wish you stopped being so pathetic, but you just can't help making ridiculous comments like this, its really unnecessary, if you don't have anything thoughtful to say don't bother posting.

you would have no problem with the state you were living in if it executed homosexuals

I see, you're losing the grip on reality. what are you going to say next? that I approve the killing of jews? or that I kill babies?

EDIT: LOL, this coming from the guy who lives in Indonesia
see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_Indonesia

So there is the measure of you when it comes to supporting/opposing repression and human rights atrocities

yes, by selectively reading my posts and then misrepresenting them you have a measure of me when it comes to supporting repression and human rights atrocities.

Originally posted by generalissimo
by selectively reading my posts and then misrepresenting them you have a measure of me when it comes to supporting repression and human rights atrocities.

In open debate you said you would have no problem if the country in which you were living executed homosexuals for being homosexual because - as you put it - it wouldn't affect you personally. This is closely related to your assertions about how most people are not personally affected by the repression carried out by a murderous military disctatorship.

Originally posted by generalissimo
LOL, this coming from the guy who lives in Indonesia
see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_Indonesia

You think I bear some responsibility for the human rights situation in Indonesia? When have ever endorsed the perpetration of a human rights atrocity here?

Originally posted by no1marauder
The fact is you're an ignorant little fascist who is an apologist for a bunch of murderous thugs.

your debating skills are impressive, ad hominem attacks, inappropriate generalizations, infantile remarks, etc.

Originally posted by FMF
You think I bear some responsibility for the human rights situation in Indonesia? When have ever endorsed the perpetration of a human rights atrocity here?

You think I bear some responsibility for the murder of innocent people in Brazil?
When have I ever endorsed the killings of homosexuals?

Originally posted by generalissimo
You think I bear some responsibility for the murder of innocent people in Brazil?

You bear responsibility for your inarticulate smokescreens and instinctive apologism when it comes to the murder of innocent people in Brazil, as is made apparent by things you have said on this thread.

Originally posted by FMF
In open debate you said you would have no problem if the country in which you were living executed homosexuals for being homosexual because - as you put it - it wouldn't affect you personally. This is closely related to your assertions about how most people are not personally affected by the repression carried out by a murderous military disctatorship.

you said

show me the quote where I said I'd have no problem with the killings of homosexuals.

This is closely related to your assertions about how most people are not personally affected by the repression carried out by a murderous military disctatorship.

Well, Im correct, most people were not affected by the military regime in brazil. But thats all I said, it is very dishonest of you to conclude "...therefore generalissimo supports dictatorships..." or any anything similar.

Originally posted by generalissimo
When have I ever endorsed the killings of homosexuals?

In open debate you stated that you would have no objection if the government, of the country in which you lived, executed homosexuals for being homosexuals. As you put it - it wouldn't affect you personally. In the world of life and death for innocent people and in discussions about justice and human rights, THAT is an endorsement of the killing of homosexuals.

Originally posted by generalissimo
your debating skills are impressive, ad hominem attacks, inappropriate generalizations, infantile remarks, etc.

And your "debating skills" are non-existent. You ignore other people's points and refuse to respond in any meaningful way.

You've been exposed as an apologist and defender of murderers and torturers. You've either lied or are profoundly ignorant of the types of people who were victims of your country's brutal military dictatorship. When faced with that fact, you've changed the subject and even more absurdly, tried to claim that examples of said murder and torture are "extreme" when, in fact, the evidence is that they were widespread (as established by the Archdiocese of Sao Paulo).

You should be deeply ashamed of your claim that the only people were victims of the brutality of the Brazilian dictatorship were "communists who were trying to establish a dictatorship". If you had a tiny shred of decency, you'd retract that ridiculous claim. Has for your implied claim that everything was hunky dory for the average Brazilian (except for the ones getting tortured and/or killed) under the military dictatorship, such an assertion deserves only contempt.

Originally posted by FMF
You bear responsibility for your inarticulate smokescreens and instinctive apologism when it comes to the murder of innocent people in Brazil, as is made apparent by things you have said on this thread.

I don't know what you're talking about, I was only putting things into context, I wasn't saying I approve of those murders or that they were justified.

None of my statements have been incorrect, Brazil was not chile, we didn't have a Pinochet or a Videla.