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Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. Standard member Fleabitten
    Love thy bobblehead
    25 Oct '09 22:54
    Isn't it about time that all professional sports were banned? How is it that a concientious society can allow a certain segment of its members to be exposed to serious and unnecessary risk, all in the name of entertainment for that society? The Romans did this very thing in the form of the gladiatorial games. Wouldn't it be nice to think that modern societies have evolved beyond the point of the more savage traits of a culture whose heyday was two milennia ago?
  2. Donation rwingett
    Ming the Merciless
    25 Oct '09 23:03
    Originally posted by Fleabitten
    Isn't it about time that all professional sports were banned? How is it that a concientious society can allow a certain segment of its members to be exposed to serious and unnecessary risk, all in the name of entertainment for that society? The Romans did this very thing in the form of the gladiatorial games. Wouldn't it be nice to think that modern s ...[text shortened]... ved beyond the point of the more savage traits of a culture whose heyday was two milennia ago?
    I think a higher priority would be to provide safe conditions for regular workers. Nobody seems to call for coal mining to be banned because it's dangerous. An athlete needing to get Tommy John surgery seems pretty minor in comparison.
  3. Standard member Fleabitten
    Love thy bobblehead
    25 Oct '09 23:06
    Originally posted by rwingett
    I think a higher priority would be to provide safe conditions for regular workers. Nobody seems to call for coal mining to be banned because it's dangerous. An athlete needing to get Tommy John surgery seems pretty minor in comparison.
    Coal miners provide an essential function to a society. Yes, we should ensure that their working conditions are as safe as possible. However, professional athletes are superfluous. They serve to entertain the masses and nothing more (in fact, a portion of those masses watch certain sports just in the hopes of seeing someone get hurt). How can a civilized society justify exposing members to the threat of serious injury and death in the name of entertainment only?
  4. Donation rwingett
    Ming the Merciless
    25 Oct '09 23:13
    Originally posted by Fleabitten
    Coal miners provide an essential function to a society. Yes, we should ensure that their working conditions are as safe as possible. However, professional athletes are superfluous. They serve to entertain the masses and nothing more (in fact, a portion of those masses watch certain sports just in the hopes of seeing someone get hurt). How can a civili ...[text shortened]... fy exposing members to the threat of serious injury and death in the name of entertainment only?
    In the 134 year history of major league baseball there has been one fatality due to on field activity. In 1920 Cleveland Indian shortstop Ray Chapman was hit in the head with the pitch and died the next day. One fatality in 134 years. That's hardly on par with gladiator sports.
  5. Standard member Fleabitten
    Love thy bobblehead
    25 Oct '09 23:22 / 1 edit
    Donnie Moore commited suicide because he never got over serving up a playoff losing home run to Dave Henderson. And we still have yet to see the toll that rampant steroid use will cause to today's generation of athletes. How many drivers have been killed in auto racing? How many ex-football players (American variety football) are left to live out their lives after their careers in crippling pain? I could go on and on.

    So to say that one sport (baseball) has only suffered one on-field fatality as a justification for allowing fellow members of a society to place themselves in harm's way just to satisfy a society's need to be entertained (a need which, by the way, can also be satisfied by non-violent pursuits such as movies and concerts) is nothing more than shallow rationalization for the sake of remaining entertained.
  6. Subscriber Proper Knob
    Cornovii
    25 Oct '09 23:22
    Originally posted by Fleabitten
    Coal miners provide an essential function to a society. Yes, we should ensure that their working conditions are as safe as possible. However, professional athletes are superfluous. They serve to entertain the masses and nothing more (in fact, a portion of those masses watch certain sports just in the hopes of seeing someone get hurt). How can a civili ...[text shortened]... fy exposing members to the threat of serious injury and death in the name of entertainment only?
    Should we also ban all recreational sports activities that are a danger to the person taking part in them? Better safe than sorry.
  7. Standard member Fleabitten
    Love thy bobblehead
    25 Oct '09 23:24
    Originally posted by Proper Knob
    Should we also ban all recreational sports activities that are a danger to the person taking part in them? Better safe than sorry.
    If they are being pursued in the name of entertainment for society as a whole, yes.
  8. Subscriber Proper Knob
    Cornovii
    25 Oct '09 23:28
    Originally posted by Fleabitten
    If they are being pursued in the name of entertainment for society as a whole, yes.
    What about if they are for my sole entertainment?
  9. Donation rwingett
    Ming the Merciless
    26 Oct '09 00:01
    Originally posted by Fleabitten
    Donnie Moore commited suicide because he never got over serving up a playoff losing home run to Dave Henderson. And we still have yet to see the toll that rampant steroid use will cause to today's generation of athletes. How many drivers have been killed in auto racing? How many ex-football players (American variety football) are left to live out their ...[text shortened]... concerts) is nothing more than shallow rationalization for the sake of remaining entertained.
    You weren't attacking specific sports. You were attacking ALL professional sports. I provided an example of one that was not dangerous. Or at least not life threatening. If you want to attack auto racing, then I won't stand in your way, but to attack professional sports as a whole is just asinine.

    As for your allegedly non-violent pursuits, there have been more fatalities for movie stuntmen than for baseball, football, basketball and hockey players combined. How's that for being entertained?
  10. Standard member Fleabitten
    Love thy bobblehead
    26 Oct '09 00:26 / 2 edits
    Originally posted by rwingett
    You weren't attacking specific sports. You were attacking ALL professional sports. I provided an example of one that was not dangerous. Or at least not life threatening. If you want to attack auto racing, then I won't stand in your way, but to attack professional sports as a whole is just asinine.

    As for your allegedly non-violent pursuits, there have be ...[text shortened]... baseball, football, basketball and hockey players combined. How's that for being entertained?
    I'm sure that the relatives that Donnie Moore and Ray Chapman left behind would disagree with your assessment that baseball isn't dangerous. I care about the welfare of ALL professional athletes, so why attack individual sports? If you're okay with baseball players playing Russian roulette with steroids or endangering themselves in other ways just so you can enjoy nine innings, that's your perogative. But until we eliminate all professional sports, we are fundamentally no more evolved as a society than the Romans.

    Edit: If you could provide a link to a credible source backing up your claim regarding stuntmen, that would be great.
  11. Donation rwingett
    Ming the Merciless
    26 Oct '09 01:27
    Originally posted by Fleabitten
    I'm sure that the relatives that Donnie Moore and Ray Chapman left behind would disagree with your assessment that baseball isn't dangerous. I care about the welfare of ALL professional athletes, so why attack individual sports? If you're okay with baseball players playing Russian roulette with steroids or endangering themselves in other ways just so yo ...[text shortened]... e a link to a credible source backing up your claim regarding stuntmen, that would be great.
    http://www.chicagoartistsresource.org/node/9510

    What about curling? It's impossible to be injured playing it. Would you ban it as well? What about tennis? Or bowling? Does watching golf make one the moral equivalent of Emperor Nero?
  12. 26 Oct '09 02:11
    Originally posted by Fleabitten
    Isn't it about time that all professional sports were banned? How is it that a concientious society can allow a certain segment of its members to be exposed to serious and unnecessary risk, all in the name of entertainment for that society? The Romans did this very thing in the form of the gladiatorial games. Wouldn't it be nice to think that modern s ...[text shortened]... ved beyond the point of the more savage traits of a culture whose heyday was two milennia ago?
    Keep it up and the government will impose special "danger taxes" assoctiated with professional sports. Yea, all we need is an ever increasing nanny state to dictate to us what our entertainment should become. Of course, perhaps your utopia would exclude entertainment, but I think it a hard sell with all the statists in Hollywood.
  13. 26 Oct '09 02:13
    Originally posted by rwingett
    In the 134 year history of major league baseball there has been one fatality due to on field activity. In 1920 Cleveland Indian shortstop Ray Chapman was hit in the head with the pitch and died the next day. One fatality in 134 years. That's hardly on par with gladiator sports.
    You forgot that poor chap in Chicago who caught that fly foul ball that cost the Cubs the chance to go to the World Series, I think his name was Bartman or something. Anyhew, I believe he had to go into the witness relocation program after a myriad of threats on his life. LOL.

    Yes, the Cubs are truly cursed.
  14. 26 Oct '09 14:41
    Originally posted by Fleabitten
    I'm sure that the relatives that Donnie Moore and Ray Chapman left behind would disagree with your assessment that baseball isn't dangerous. I care about the welfare of ALL professional athletes, so why attack individual sports? If you're okay with baseball players playing Russian roulette with steroids or endangering themselves in other ways just so yo ...[text shortened]... e a link to a credible source backing up your claim regarding stuntmen, that would be great.
    I think if you stretch your argument to cover Donnie Moore and Ray Chapman then you can actually ban EVERYTHING because everything is potentially dangerous. Donnie Moore after a bad performance in 1986 became a drug user and ended up dying. You can ban all sports (because there are loser) or all evaluations (college admissions, job interviews, country club applications, asking someone out on a date etc because you could fail, be disappointed and die. Ray Chapman died after being hit by a spit ball. Subsequent to that baseball has banned the spitball, and has rotated in new baseballs believing that cut ball are more difficult to control and safer. Since then no one has died on a baseball field. We allow cars in our country there are traffic accidents every day' there are repair shop every where. Driving to the ball park is far more dangerous than playing at the ball park. Perhaps you advocate banning the wrong thing.
  15. 26 Oct '09 15:40
    Originally posted by Fleabitten
    Isn't it about time that all professional sports were banned? How is it that a concientious society can allow a certain segment of its members to be exposed to serious and unnecessary risk, all in the name of entertainment for that society? The Romans did this very thing in the form of the gladiatorial games. Wouldn't it be nice to think that modern s ...[text shortened]... ved beyond the point of the more savage traits of a culture whose heyday was two milennia ago?
    You do not go far enough in your proposal. Even a person working all day in an office can develop serious back injuries or carpal tunnel syndrome, or might get seriously injured by a fall down the stairs or an elevator accident.

    Every occupation has a certain degree of hazard. Therefore, we should ban all occupations that do not provide a product or service that is absolutely essential for survival. Everything else is needlessly exposing workers to some degree of injury that would be avoided if those jobs didn't exist.