21 Feb 23
Quite often, on this forum, we get stuck in debates which rely on definitions of what socialism, social democracy, communism, nazism, etc. Actually are.
And more often than not, a lot of people don’t seem to grasp what they are or what they mean. For example, people call the nazis socialist… but they also call Obama socialist.
I stumbled across an 11 minute video which explains the differences very clearly.
No debate, just basic information:
@shavixmir saidThankyou Shav, you and the professor have done a most thorough job, I am sure. I watched the entire clip with baited breath, trying to find clarity of definition. Now I dont feel so bad when y'all tell me I don't understand socialism.
Quite often, on this forum, we get stuck in debates which rely on definitions of what socialism, social democracy, communism, nazism, etc. Actually are.
And more often than not, a lot of people don’t seem to grasp what they are or what they mean. For example, people call the nazis socialist… but they also call Obama socialist.
I stumbled across an 11 minute video whic ...[text shortened]... the differences very clearly.
No debate, just basic information:
https://youtu.be/vyl2DeKT-Vs
Ironic that he makes this statement at then end.....
"Are janitors going to paid the same as doctors?"
He says that, but his treatise did not explain this very concept. It waxed on about all the differences, but did not zero on any justification whatsoever of all citizens being paid the same, no matter what they do.
I wish he would have done that. I wish ANYBODY would do that.
21 Feb 23
@averagejoe1 saidUnder socialism not everyone is paid the same.
Thankyou Shav, you and the professor have done a most thorough job, I am sure. I watched the entire clip with bated breath, trying to find clarity of definition. Now I dont feel so bad when y'all tell me I don't understand socialism.
Ironic that he makes this statement at then end.....
"Are janitors going to paid the same as doctors?"
He says that, but his t ...[text shortened]... e same, no matter what they do.
I wish he would have done that. I wish ANYBODY would do that.
Education and your parents aren’t whT determines your wage though (not neccesarily anyways).
@shavixmir saidStay with me, please.
Under socialism not everyone is paid the same.
Education and your parents aren’t whT determines your wage though (not neccesarily anyways).
But WHY did he make this statement, that all be paid the same? He discusses four concepts, and then at the very end, as an afterthought, just casually puts this in there, like it is the end game? Or why did he?
For the record, you can imagine for the entire 4 minutes that I was waiting for comments on the disparity of income or whatever you want to call it, yet he makes no mention of that.
Curious indeed, then casually says That?
21 Feb 23
@averagejoe1 saidThe video is about the differences between socialism, national socialism, etc.
Stay with me, please.
But WHY did he make this statement, that all be paid the same? He discusses four concepts, and then at the very end, as an afterthought, just casually puts this in there, like it is the end game? Or why did he?
For the record, you can imagine for the entire 4 minutes that I was waiting for comments on the disparity of income or whatever you want to call it, yet he makes no mention of that.
Curious indeed, then casually says That?
He didn't mention UFO's either. Or revolutionary means vs. parliamentary means.
Basically, one hour of one person is worth the same as one hour of any other person. That's the basis.
However, if a person is picking their nose for an hour, obviously that hour becomes worth less than an hour of a nurse who is busy.
Why do you have such a hang up about this issue?
You just can't imagine that there are other ways to judge a man's worth than a capitalist context.
21 Feb 23
@shavixmir saidNo, quite contrare’. You have confirmed, finally, what I have been preaching, a person who works harder should make more. Great, that is settled.
The video is about the differences between socialism, national socialism, etc.
He didn't mention UFO's either. Or revolutionary means vs. parliamentary means.
Basically, one hour of one person is worth the same as one hour of any other person. That's the basis.
However, if a person is picking their nose for an hour, obviously that hour becomes worth less than an h ...[text shortened]...
You just can't imagine that there are other ways to judge a man's worth than a capitalist context.
But I still wonder why he said doctors and janitors should make the same thing.
Help. Conflicting statements. How can I learn anything, it makes no sense.
As to my hang up, a man’s worth, the economy, are all the basis of these 4 concepts. That is all I am writing about.
21 Feb 23
It should also be mentioned that under Communism, authorities banned religion.
That has got to get under the skin of Evangelical voter bases everywhere.
What qualifies what people get paid for what they do is not always relevant when market forces kick in.
Basketball players getting $50 million per year is not just based on ability.
And.if you want to venture into the ridiculous, I won't bother trying to figure out why Sean Hannity gets $40M per year from FOX.
@mghrn55 saidThis is quite informative, and will answer your question. All of these FOX celebs draw a LOT of people, it having the top 9 viewerships.
It should also be mentioned that under Communism, authorities banned religion.
That has got to get under the skin of Evangelical voter bases everywhere.
What qualifies what people get paid for what they do is not always relevant when market forces kick in.
Basketball players getting $50 million per year is not just based on ability.
And.if you want to venture into the ridiculous, I won't bother trying to figure out why Sean Hannity gets $40M per year from FOX.
So, they ALL make a lot money. The money makes them keep coming back, to keep the top 9 shows on top, which is what their shareholders are paying them to do. The shareholders vote on how much to pay.
https://www.adweek.com/tvnewser/these-are-the-top-rated-cable-news-shows-of-2022/521247/
22 Feb 23
@averagejoe1 saidCan a janitor work harder than a surgeon?
No, quite contrare’. You have confirmed, finally, what I have been preaching, a person who works harder should make more. Great, that is settled.
But I still wonder why he said doctors and janitors should make the same thing.
Help. Conflicting statements. How can I learn anything, it makes no sense.
As to my hang up, a man’s worth, the economy, are all the basis of these 4 concepts. That is all I am writing about.
@shavixmir saidNo, but a regular doctor? Yes.
Can a janitor work harder than a surgeon?
I tried to explain to old Joe about physical labor being harder than high paying jobs before...
He hasn't worked a hard physical job before so obviously he is obtuse.
22 Feb 23
@endlame saidI’m pretty sure there are some janitors working harder than some surgeons.
No, but a regular doctor? Yes.
I tried to explain to old Joe about physical labor being harder than high paying jobs before...
He hasn't worked a hard physical job before so obviously he is obtuse.
Very difficult to measure, though.
Some time ago, in the 90’s (or that’s when I read it) a research paper of sorts worked out what a world without surgeons would be like, compared to a world without nurses.
A nurse saves more lives than a surgeon; dressing wounds, cleaning wounds, cleaning faeces, giving medication, caring, etc.
Add to that the fact that nurses, in Western countries, do 3-4 years of higher education.
And there are many more nurses.
Society survives without surgeons, it collapses without nurses.
So, 1 nurse saves more lives than 1 surgeon.
Why would a nurse earn less per hour than a surgeon?
And I agree with you on physical labour.
Especially when it’s about infrastructure, housing, etc. Esential for existence.
Take garbage collectors.
7 days of non-collection and the streets become a hazard (rats, for example). 14 days of non-collection and typhoid and dysentry read their ugly heads.
14 days no government? Belgium went years without a government.
14 days no bank managers? No one cares.
14 days no share holders… happy times!
A re-evaluation of what one man’s hour is worth is what’s needed.
And what socialism, according to Joe, says is that even though a company CEO is completely useless to society, he should still be given a living wage.
@shavixmir saidFree market is the only way.
A re-evaluation of what one man’s hour is worth is what’s needed.
BTW, made it about a minute into your vid and the bot said "...all paid for by the goobermint." that was as much BS as I could take. Paid for by the taxpayer ijit, money taken from taxpayers under threat of force that's who's paying for all the 'free' stuff.
22 Feb 23
@averagejoe1 saidYou cannot reverse the metric, however, and say that those who get paid more necessarily work harder, because, in most cases, that is demonstrably untrue.
No, quite contrare’. You have confirmed, finally, what I have been preaching, a person who works harder should make more. Great, that is settled.
But I still wonder why he said doctors and janitors should make the same thing.
Help. Conflicting statements. How can I learn anything, it makes no sense.
As to my hang up, a man’s worth, the economy, are all the basis of these 4 concepts. That is all I am writing about.
22 Feb 23
@suzianne saidThis is some deep thought from suzi bamboozle. Some people work hard and make a lot of money, some people work hard and don't make a lot of money. Did you get this from zahlooney bamboozles economics source 'Cracked Magazine" where do you find such insightful stuff, bet you had to have a lie down when all the cogs meshed in your head on that one, just wowwwwww
You cannot reverse the metric, however, and say that those who get paid more necessarily work harder, because, in most cases, that is demonstrably untrue.