Originally posted by amannionAll I know is that the people I know who weren't smacked as kids tend to have poor social skills, they expect too much for too little. Those I know who are hard workers and decent people tended to have been smacked and to boot hold no hard feelings about it.
Sorry, that sounds too much like training a pet.
I'm all for training pets but I prefer to treat my kids a little differently.
Obviously I would tailor what I do to their age, but I much prefer working with the child and treating them - at least in some simple way - as if they're the equal of me.
So far it's worked pretty well for me.
The times when I h ...[text shortened]... No kid's too young to develop something similar - or at least that's been my experience.
Originally posted by agrysonHmmm. I'm wondering how reliable your sample is there.
All I know is that the people I know who weren't smacked as kids tend to have poor social skills, they expect too much for too little. Those I know who are hard workers and decent people tended to have been smacked and to boot hold no hard feelings about it.
I should out myself as someone who wasn't smacked as a child. My mum was a kindergarten teacher and wouldn't allow that sort of discipline - she relied on her skills in working with preschoolers to teach myself and my two sisters discipline.
I'm embarrassed to admit my own smacking incidents with my kids, given my own upbringing ...
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amannion, agryson -- you are both making good points.
Kids are resilient. They have to be. New, young, first-time, overworked, stressed-out parents make a lot of mistakes. But a normal kid's psychology won't be damaged by the odd smack dealt out early in life.
Yelling can be just as damaging as smacking -- it can destroy a kid's self-esteem -- so a litmus of test of "did you hit" is not enough.
A home needs order or it can't function, anymore than a country can function without a government. Kids have to accept whatever level of order the parents have agreed upon. Later, when they are in charge of their own house they can try anarchy (good luck). Let's not forget that an orderly house is a refuge for everyone -- kids and adults alike. The world imposes enough troubles of it's own. Once established, even if not perfectly (i.e. with complete reasonableness and 'smack-less' negotiations from both sides), that shelter pays a lot of dividends down the road in peace of mind.
Originally posted by spruce112358Yeah, I'd agree there, no matter how one chooses to raise their children, the one most important thing IMO is that whatever method they use doesn't get abused. Even if a person doesn't smack their child, getting frustrated and screaming at them can do just as much harm, no matter how unintentional. Likewise, a parent who does smack their kids but doesn't do it in a controlled and measured fashion will, it goes without saying cause not only physical harm, but mental. In both cases, it is the psychological suffering which lasts longest and has the most effect on the adult the child is to become.
amannion, agryson -- you are both making good points.
Kids are resilient. They have to be. New, young, first-time, overworked, stressed-out parents make a lot of mistakes. But a normal kid's psychology won't be damaged by the odd smack dealt out early in life.
Yelling can be just as damaging as smacking -- it can destroy a kid's self-esteem -- so ...[text shortened]... from both sides), that shelter pays a lot of dividends down the road in peace of mind.
Whichever method is chosen must be carefully tempered by reasonableness on the parents part, but which method is something I maintain is a choice to be left with parents.
Originally posted by PinkFloydI contest this analogy for two reasons:
Yeah it;s abuse. And until policemen start yanking speeders out of their cars and beating them for their infractions, it should be illegal.
1. Parents are not like cops. Cops are there to enforce the law. The punish you according the rules that the law has already set out and that the perpetraitor is expected to already know. Parents are there to teach their children how to be good people. The Cops don't care if you mind your manners at the dinner table, and parents don't have to read you your miranda rights.
2. Children aren't like adult criminals. Criminals are expected to know the law. If you drive drunk, the police aren't there to pull you over and teach you that driving drunk is wrong. You already know that, and you are in violation of an agreement that you've already made by being a motorist in the first place. Children don't know the rules yet. And when they're really little, they don't even know what rules are and how to obey them. It is the job of the parents to raise them to be good little people.
As for spanking: I'm ok with it to a very limited extent, but it goes without saying that discipline must be exercized with great deal of care. I also like what Zadadka said alot:
"...[text shortened]... If you smack a child and don't feel guilt, then may bad things happen to you...preferably before you have another opportunity. ...[text shortened]..."