Originally posted by TeinosukeI think the reasons may be many. Not just existential questions, but
Wealth gives us the leisure to ponder questions like "Why am I here?" and "What is the point of living?". These are the sort of questions that provoke suicidal thoughts.
sorrow. Perhaps you thought that this person on whom you hung your
entire happiness wouldn't shag your worst enemy? Perhaps you thought
there's like a law in nature to guarantee that your beloved child outlives
you? Perhaps you thought that you were supposed to be somebody, but
then at the age of 40 you realise that all you've become and all you can
ever hope to be is the unappreciated janitor, disrespected by snotty little
teenagers even? Perhaps you've been diagnosed for terminal cancer and
you just don't want to go through all that? Maybe you've been abused
throughout your crappy, fragile childhood and the memories still haunt
you? Maybe you're just an ungrateful puts who can't appreciate the
number of hours your mother suffered to squeeze out your sorry behind
into this mean old world? Maybe you can't appreciate the bad sex she
had to endure in order to have you conceived?
I don't think suicide is class related. I think it's a certain kind of person
who can't take being beaten up by life itself day after day, year after
year. I think the suicidal are people who deluded themselves into
thinking life was supposed to be more than this, and whom are too
proud to just shake the disappointment off and accept that life sucks. It
sucks for all of us, and the best we can do is to hang in there and enjoy
those few and far in between moments where we can actually like
ourselves and the world we live in.
Those who think life is more and whom hopes for better things to
happen all the time are the ones in danger of giving up on the one thing
they have that doesn't suck. The joy of self-satisfaction. Ones you give
up on the meaningless joy of self-satisfaction, you're a gonner.
That's all I have to say about that. 😏
Many suicides are the result of brain disorders or biochemical illnesses such as clinical depression. But the stigma associated with suicide often forces family members to choose between secrecy about the death and social isolation.
Their hesitancy to seek the support of the community increases their pain and makes their healing more difficult. Families who have had a child die by
suicide are helped in their grief by the use of non-judgmental language.
Originally posted by shavixmirhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bath_School_disaster
I'd say driving a flaming car into a horde of school kids and then blowing it up, is a pretty glamorous way...
In 1927 Andrew Kehoe did just that. He blew up the schoolhouse in Bath County, Michigan, and then blew his car up among the crowd of people who gathered by.
Originally posted by JigtieThose who think life is more and whom hopes for better things to
I think the reasons may be many. Not just existential questions, but
sorrow. Perhaps you thought that this person on whom you hung your
entire happiness wouldn't shag your worst enemy? Perhaps you thought
there's like a law in nature to guarantee that your beloved child outlives
you? Perhaps you thought that you were supposed to be somebody, but
the ...[text shortened]... of self-satisfaction, you're a gonner.
That's all I have to say about that. 😏
happen all the time are the ones in danger of giving up on the one thing
they have that doesn't suck. The joy of self-satisfaction. Ones you give
up on the meaningless joy of self-satisfaction, you're a gonner.
I disagree with your conclusion.
No matter how bad things get, no one is ever without the freedom to choose what he or she will live for. Once a person gives up on "the meaningless joy of self-satisfaction," then a choice can be made to live for others instead of for oneself exclusively, i.e., making others happy, helping the helpless, being a force for good in the world, etc.
For some the end of hedonism may be the end of the line, but for others it may be the beginning of a new life altogether.
Everyone has a choice, IMHO.
Originally posted by epiphinehasYou do realise that the last part you decided to quote was a joke? I feel
[b]Those who think life is more and whom hopes for better things to
happen all the time are the ones in danger of giving up on the one thing
they have that doesn't suck. The joy of self-satisfaction. Ones you give
up on the meaningless joy of self-satisfaction, you're a gonner.
I disagree with your conclusion.
No matter how bad things get ...[text shortened]... for others it may be the beginning of a new life altogether.
Everyone has a choice, IMHO.[/b]
so bloody serious in here sometimes, I need to do that sort of thing.
Now, it's a choice, yes, but the reasons for that choice varies widely from
case to case. I am of the firm belief that in every single case of suicide
there ever was (yes, I'm this bold) there is a sense of failure in the
suicidal that (s)he just can't live with. And the only way you can fail in
life is if you sincerely believe you're supposed to do something that is
beyond your capabilities or you're hoping for something better that just
never happens. And once it dawns on you, the realisation that life's
basically just fornicating with you, you get depressed to such an extent
that you're willing to commit suicide.
Life's crap. That's the basic cause for all the reasons to commit suicide.
That and all the other possible causes. 😏
Originally posted by epiphinehashuman beings are selfish by nature. They are selfish good, or selfish bad, living for others is selfish good. They do what they they do, because it makes them feel good...it still boils down to self.
[b]Those who think life is more and whom hopes for better things to
happen all the time are the ones in danger of giving up on the one thing
they have that doesn't suck. The joy of self-satisfaction. Ones you give
up on the meaningless joy of self-satisfaction, you're a gonner.
I disagree with your conclusion.
No matter how bad things get ...[text shortened]... for others it may be the beginning of a new life altogether.
Everyone has a choice, IMHO.[/b]
Originally posted by Thequ1ckfor the same reasons that you don't find people in Africa scarfing evrything in sight, and then throwing it back up. Life is a daily struggle to survive, and foolish notions like body image, unrequited love, etc... are pushed aside for the more pressing concerns of daily survival.
Why do a higher percentage of 'privileged' people commit suicide?
What is it about our society that drives people to commit such an act?
Originally posted by Thequ1ckMaybe it is because poor people cant afford shotguns.
Why do a higher percentage of 'privileged' people commit suicide?
What is it about our society that drives people to commit such an act?
Do you have any actual stats to back up your claim?
The suicides I have personally heard about were all related to mental illness to some degree. I have heard poor friends mention suicidal thoughts, but not to the extent of going through with it.
It would be interesting to know what the correlation is between suicide and the availability of guns. The suicides I know of were mostly jumping off buildings or over the Victoria falls.
Originally posted by der schwarze RitterThat's a weird question. How can one group of people commit more suicides
Do you have a study with the numbers that show the "privileged" commit suicide in higher numbers than the "wretched of the earth" do?
than that very group of people? It doesn't add up. 😕
Using the dictionary...
Oh, you mean wretched as in poor? Oh, right. Sorry. 🙂
Originally posted by der schwarze Ritterhttp://www.bmj.com/cgi/content/full/322/7282/334
Do you have a study with the numbers that show the "privileged" commit suicide in higher numbers than the "wretched of the earth" do?
This one concentrates on people who have been admitted to a psychiatric hospital, but one of the controls is "never admitted". That control shows an inverse relationship between income and suicide. That is, poor people kill themselves more - if they don't get admitted to a hospital. Of course people admitted to a hospital have their own statistics, so who knows what the combined stats are?
Originally posted by duecerI disagree. Human beings are capable of making genuinely altruistic choices. Choices which contain no selfish benefits, but which benefit others, e.g., jumping on a grenade to save others, burning yourself alive for the sake of a cause, etc. How do these actions make a person "feel good"? They don't, judging all actions as selfish actions is therefore an insufficient explanation for human behavior.
human beings are selfish by nature. They are selfish good, or selfish bad, living for others is selfish good. They do what they they do, because it makes them feel good...it still boils down to self.
Freud's "pleasure principle", which you are basically advocating, is defunct, due to the fact that it is self-defeating, i.e., the pursuit of happiness, pleasure, or "feeling good" in itself does not yield happiness or pleasure. That which is truly fulfilling, rather, is the discovery of meaning. A meaningful existence such as living for others doesn't necessarily make one "feel good" and may even put one at risk of harm or death, yet it may be meaningful work, and in fact would not be fulfilling were it not genuinely altruistic.
Let me disclose the gifts reserved for age
To set a crown upon your lifetime's effort.
First, the cold friction of expiring sense
Without enchantment, offering no promise
But bitter tastelessness of shadow fruit
As body and soul begin to fall asunder.
Second, the conscious impotence of rage
At human folly, and the laceration
Of laughter at what ceases to amuse.
And last, the rending pain of re-enactment
Of all that you have done, and been; the shame
Of motives late revealed, and the awareness
Of things ill done and done to others' harm
Which once you took for exercise of virtue.
Then fools' approval stings, and honour stains.
From wrong to wrong the exasperated spirit
Proceeds, unless restored by that refining fire
Where you must move in measure, like a dancer.'
The day was breaking. In the disfigured street
He left me, with a kind of valediction,
And faded on the blowing of the horn.
T.S. Eliot