For those people who claim that Hamas does not represent the wishes of the Palestinian people and therefore Israel should not retaliate when Hamas bombs Israel, read this.
AL-AMARI REFUGEE CAMP, West Bank — The tattered walls of this camp turned city for Palestinian refugees in the West Bank tell a story about the political loyalties of those who live here.
The smiling visage of a keffiyeh-clad Yasser Arafat. The yellow, rifle-bedecked flags of his movement. The names, etched in black, of those who died in its service.
For decades, al-Amari has been a stronghold of Fatah, the secular and nationalist party that emphasizes diplomacy as its answer to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. But in recent days, the tableau in the camp has shifted: Green flags mark the entrance and graffiti to match emblazons the walls with a single word: Hamas.
“They’ve given strength to the whole Palestinian cause,” said Mohammed Khadier, 16, as friends nodded in enthusiastic agreement. “We consider Hamas our leader now.”
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/middle_east/hamas-israel-west-bank-abbas/2021/06/03/cf19f2cc-c275-11eb-89a4-b7ae22aa193e_story.html
@rajk999 saidWar generally increases support for the most radical and nationalist groups as it has in Israel. That Hamas physically resists oppression while Fatah has zero chance of obtaining a Palestinian State given Israeli intransigence makes this result inevitable.
For those people who claim that Hamas does not represent the wishes of the Palestinian people and therefore Israel should not retaliate when Hamas bombs Israel, read this.
[i]AL-AMARI REFUGEE CAMP, West Bank — The tattered walls of this camp turned city for Palestinian refugees in the West Bank tell a story about the political loyalties of those who live here.
The smili ...[text shortened]... /middle_east/hamas-israel-west-bank-abbas/2021/06/03/cf19f2cc-c275-11eb-89a4-b7ae22aa193e_story.html
@no1marauder saidYes I agree. So the question is how accurate is the statement that Hamas does not represent the wishes of the Palestinian people?
War generally increases support for the most radical and nationalist groups as it has in Israel. That Hamas physically resists oppression while Fatah has zero chance of obtaining a Palestinian State given Israeli intransigence makes this result inevitable.
@rajk999 saidIt's hard to say , but as you pointed out, Hamas hasn't allowed an election in Gaza for 15 years. That doesn't speak to a high level of confidence in their popularity.
Yes I agree. So the question is how accurate is the statement that Hamas does not represent the wishes of the Palestinian people?
I suspect their appeal wanes when there aren't large flare ups of violence like recently.
@rajk999 saidvery accurate if we define represent the people means the whole populace
Yes I agree. So the question is how accurate is the statement that Hamas does not represent the wishes of the Palestinian people?
very inaccurate idf we define it as part of
Not to be easily decided if we try to go for the majority
@ponderable saidWell that is obvious, that there is never anything called 100% support from any electorate, but I would think it means significant, or majority support. It wa the contention of many here before the hostilities that Hamas did not have majority support especially in Gaza
very accurate if we define represent the people means the whole populace
very inaccurate idf we define it as part of
Not to be easily decided if we try to go for the majority
@no1marauder saidSo if a flare up increases support [it seems], then one has to conclude that the people generally want these flare ups. As for the lack of elections one can also conclude that people are contented with the status quo, otherwise they would be clamouring for change, which they are not doing.
It's hard to say , but as you pointed out, Hamas hasn't allowed an election in Gaza for 15 years. That doesn't speak to a high level of confidence in their popularity.
I suspect their appeal wanes when there aren't large flare ups of violence like recently.
@rajk999 said"The enemy of my enemy is my friend". Of course the Palestinians support Hamas, at least emotionally.
Yes I agree. So the question is how accurate is the statement that Hamas does not represent the wishes of the Palestinian people?
@rajk999 saidThose are both incorrect, or at the very least, dubious assertions.
So if a flare up increases support [it seems], then one has to conclude that the people generally want these flare ups. As for the lack of elections one can also conclude that people are contented with the status quo, otherwise they would be clamouring for change, which they are not doing.
He (and that crappy washington post article) quoted a 16 year old kid as proof support for hamas increases.
It got me curious what else did that article say.
"For 11 days last month, Israel unleashed a punishing barrage on Hamas targets in the Gaza Strip, collapsing tunnels, exploding arsenals and killing fighters"
Also that AP building they exploded. Also hospitals. But it's ok because hamas was definitely hiding there. Israel said so. And israel never targets civilians.
"But through it all, Hamas continued to arc more than 4,000 rockets into Israel, terrorizing residents of Tel Aviv and other cities."
Conveniently left out was just how many of those rockets were shot down by the multi billion dollar missile defense system.
"232 Palestinians dead, including at least 65 children, officials said. A dozen people died in Israel, two of them children."
Proportional. But it's the residents of Tel Aviv who were terrorized. Doesn't say anything about the residents of Gaza Strip. But who cares about them, right? They are terrorists supporting terrorists.
It's ok though, the bible says this is justified (according to the right people declaring that's what it says) so we don't need to worry.
@Rajk999 - said
So if a flare up increases support [it seems], then one has to conclude that the people generally want these flare ups.
And your point is...? Israel is conducting an unwanted occupation all throughout Palestine. Don't you get this?
I know when Germany occupied France, the people cheered when Resistance fighters "flared up".
It's only natural.
@earl-of-trumps saidNo. You are not being clear. Is it your point that Israel should not be in any of Palestine?
And your point is...? Israel is conducting an unwanted occupation all throughout Palestine. Don't you get this?
@earl-of-trumps saidYou did not answer the question. So clearly you avoided a direct answer because you think [like all the other Palestinians], that the British were wrong to partition the land. All should be given to the Palestinians. I got it.
That would be a good cause of war, yes. Especially the way the Israelis treat their captors.
@no1marauder saidMy conclusions are absolutely spot on.
Those are both incorrect, or at the very least, dubious assertions.
Lack of protest against Hamas + No elections. = Support.