2 edits
One and all must watch this video. It is a requirement.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2798679275960015727&hl=en
____________________
Discuss.
____________________
Conservatives: Does it shock you how dependent upon manufactured threats the modern conservative movement is? Do you ever question your allegiance to the rationale and idealism which you have been religiously fed over the years? Doesn't it disturb you how many churches have been hijacked by these deceptions? -- and from the pulpit no less? Do you sense the intellectual kinship which you share with radical Islam? Does it bother you that your beloved Reagan was a kindly old fool who could not discern the lies of his own advisers, and therefore became the smiling tool of their perverted ideology? Isn't your intellectual pride the least bit pricked by the knowledge that your ideology is based squarely upon the escape from reality? And that liberalism among your ranks is categorically feared and demonized precisely because liberalism embraces reality, a reality which those who've originally developed your ideology wished to condition you against?
____________________
My question to everyone else: Isn't there a potentially more successful unifying factor able to bring selfish people like us together in order to accomplish our collective goals besides manufactured threats? Perhaps something hidden in our Constitution? Or in our shared humanity? Something based in *gasp* REALITY?
4 edits
Originally posted by epiphinehasI could not view the site you provided. Could you give a quick overveiw of the content?
One and all must watch this video. It is a requirement.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2798679275960015727&hl=en
____________________
Discuss.
____________________
Conservatives: Does it shock you how dependent upon manufactured threats the modern conservative movement is? Do you ever question your allegiance to the rationale an hidden in our Constitution? Or in our shared humanity? Something based in *gasp* REALITY?
Although I consider myself conservative leaning, I in no way defend all conservative thought. Just as with anything else, there is the good, the bad, and the ugly.
There are many reasons for my leaning towards conservatism. Here are but a few off the top of my head.
1. People should be held accountable for their actions. No one is entitled to anything. Nothing is owed to anyone. We have no rights except the ones given to us. Everything in life is but a gift.
2. Personal freedoms should be protected as much as possible so long as you are not infriging upon the freedoms of others. After all, God gave us free will so who is man to say otherwise?
3. The abortion issue. Granted, you may say it violates #2 in that government should not tell us what to do. However, I would argue that you are infringing upon the freedoms of another. Of course, this is the issue that is the poster child of the religious right and it seems odd to me that despite their efforts no strides have been taken to overturn this decision. Therefore, from all outward appearances it looks as if the religious right have been used by the Republican party in that they continue to dangle the anti-abortion bait in front of them without ever giving them what they are after. Therefore, I think it is high time the religious right takes its eyes off the bait and begins to look the author and finisher of their respective faiths rather than only focusing on the abortion issue. There are other ways of tackling such issues as abortion without selling their souls to a secular political party.
Originally posted by epiphinehasThis is a fantastic set of documentaries that MUST be watched by one and all as you say.
One and all must watch this video. It is a requirement.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2798679275960015727&hl=en
____________________
Discuss.
____________________
Conservatives: Does it shock you how dependent upon manufactured threats the modern conservative movement is? Do you ever question your allegiance to the rationale an ...[text shortened]... hidden in our Constitution? Or in our shared humanity? Something based in *gasp* REALITY?
The documentaries were shown in the UK about a year or so ago and are a great piece of journalism.
Its shows clearly the power of the neo-conservatives in the US political system over the last 10 years and how they are trying to change the world for their own gains.
It is sad that this great work has received such low publicity, but can be understood as only one or two people own about 99% of the world’s media and they would not want the masses to see these documentaries.
Originally posted by epiphinehasI've always suspected that the roots of international terrorism could be found in the over-manicured lawns of Greeley, Colorado.
One and all must watch this video. It is a requirement.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2798679275960015727&hl=en
____________________
Discuss.
____________________
Conservatives: Does it shock you how dependent upon manufactured threats the modern conservative movement is? Do you ever question your allegiance to the rationale an ...[text shortened]... hidden in our Constitution? Or in our shared humanity? Something based in *gasp* REALITY?
Now here is the proof.
Originally posted by epiphinehasBrilliant documentaries.
My question to everyone else: Isn't there a potentially more successful unifying factor able to bring selfish people like us together in order to accomplish our collective goals besides manufactured threats? Perhaps something hidden in our Constitution? Or in our shared humanity? Something based in *gasp* REALITY?
I think that the question you ask falls into the same mistake that led to the birth of Straussianism and Radical Islamism depicted in the video. The downfall of the society they criticized was not an inevitability, nor would it lead to nihilism and self-destruction.
Examples of functioning free societies that are unified by simply the will to live peacefully already exist. Without any demons or major collective goals beyond providing a better life for its citizens. There are several examples in Europe, but for a closer one you just need to look North.
Originally posted by spurs73Darn those one or two people who own 99% of the world's media (Talk about a conspiracy theory right there, no proof , just a theory)
This is a fantastic set of documentaries that MUST be watched by one and all as you say.
The documentaries were shown in the UK about a year or so ago and are a great piece of journalism.
Its shows clearly the power of the neo-conservatives in the US political system over the last 10 years and how they are trying to change the world for their own gains ...[text shortened]... wn about 99% of the world’s media and they would not want the masses to see these documentaries.
I watched 10 minutes of this and frankly I was bored, I'm sure my progressive 'friends' will point out that its because conservatives are intellectually backward, and because we are being brainwashed to think that individualism and self reliance and personal responsibility are a bad thing.
After all, how can society continue to go on without progressives (the new moniker for liberals) and government telling us what to do and care about and how to act. People always tried to convince me that Orwell's classic 1984 was bout conservatives and Republicans and their minions trying to control the rest of society .... I tend to think these days he had some other group in mind.
But I must be wrong because I'm just a dull, witless , uneducated , red neck conservative (and worst of all I believe in God)who needs to be told how to act and behave by the intellectually advanced
progressives
Somebody please help me, when will the government get here to help me?
1 edit
Originally posted by whodeyThe documentary has to do with the rise of neo-conservativism in the US and radical Islam in the Middle East, both of which are reactionary stances against individualism and liberalism. The neo-cons expressly condone fabricating national threats in order to unite the country in a common cause, which they believe is impossible in a society where people are inherently selfish and nihilistic (due to the 'American dream', i.e. the pursuit of happiness). Individualism and liberalism, they believe, leads to national complacency and rot. Part of their rise to power includes turning the American church-going public into a political tool by calling them to political action from the pulpit, and uniting their votes for neo-conservative candidates through the use of moral 'wedge issues'.
I could not view the site you provided. Could you give a quick overveiw of the content?
Although I consider myself conservative leaning, I in no way defend all conservative thought. Just as with anything else, there is the good, the bad, and the ugly.
There are many reasons for my leaning towards conservatism. Here are but a few off the top of my h ...[text shortened]... ys of tackling such issues as abortion without selling their souls to a secular political party.
______________________
As an aside, there is an interesting tid-bit in this BBC doc which has me doing some research. Apparently, before the neo-cons invaded the US churches in the late seventies and eighties, the hard-line stance of the majority of congregations was decidedly anti-political. Church members were encouraged not to vote, because doing so is tantamount to compromising with a corrupt world. The belief was, God is in control and it is not proper for a Christian to take part in the political process in any way. Interesting, eh?
I've been paging through my Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs, and I found evidence that the early Church was also decidedly anti-political as a rule. Let me share some quotes:
"In us, all ardor in the pursuit of glory and honor is dead. So we have no pressing inducement to take part in your public meetings. Nor is there anything more entirely foreign to us than affairs of state."
~ Tertullian (c. 195)
"Celsus also urges us to "take office in the government of the country, if that is necessary for the maintainance of the laws and the support of religion." However, we recognize in each state the existence of another national organization that was founded by the Word of God. And we exhort those who are mighty in word and of blameless life to rule over churches... It is not for the purpose of escaping public duties that Christians decline public offices. Rather, it is so they may reserve themselves for a more divine and necessary service in the church of God - for the salvation of men."
~ Origen (c. 248)
"Religion is to be defended - not by putting to death - but by dying. Not by cruelty, but by patient endurance. Not by guilt, but by good faith. For the former belongs to evil, but the latter to good... For if you wish to defend religion by bloodshed, tortures, and guilt, it will no longer be defended. Rather, it will be polluted and profaned... And, therefore, when we suffer such impious things, we do not resist even in word. Rather, we leave vengeance to God. We do not act as those persons who would have it appear that they are defenders of their gods, who rage without restraint against those who do not worship them."
~ Lactantius (c.302-313)
___________________
I want to do some more research on the modern political uprising of the Christian masses in the US. Right now, it seems to me that the neo-conservatives, and the Christian leaders they enticed to do their bidding, are the ones responsible for the great error which is the "Religious Right."
I agree with you on the abortion issue.
1 edit
Originally posted by PalynkaI agree wholeheartedly: nihilism and self-destruction were never inevitable. I'm thinking more along the lines of ideals such as being your "brother's keeper," and of uniting as a nation for the cause of addressing problems which affect everyone (poverty, lack of jobs, injustice, etc.). Societies do need rallying points, just not make-believe ones.
Brilliant documentaries.
I think that the question you ask falls into the same mistake that led to the birth of Straussianism and Radical Islamism depicted in the video. The downfall of the society they criticized was not an inevitability, nor would it lead to nihilism and self-destruction.
Examples of functioning free societies that are unified by sim ...[text shortened]... itizens. There are several examples in Europe, but for a closer one you just need to look North.
Originally posted by SMSBear716It is not a conspiracy theory: neo-conservatives do strive to control how you think and act. Do some research on Leo Strauss. It is no secret. They do so by inventing enemies for us to rally against (it does not matter if these 'enemies' are fictional, so long as their myth is sustained in the public imagination).
Darn those one or two people who own 99% of the world's media (Talk about a conspiracy theory right there, no proof , just a theory)
I watched 10 minutes of this and frankly I was bored, I'm sure my progressive 'friends' will point out that its because conservatives are intellectually backward, and because we are being brainwashed to think that individ ...[text shortened]...
progressives
Somebody please help me, when will the government get here to help me?
True conservatism, in my mind, believes in self-reliance, personal responsibility, individualism, and small government. While neo-conservatism (or should I say, "faux conservatism" ) injects religious wedge-issues and fabricated foreign threats into the mix in order to undermine personal freedom and promote big government.
Don't be too hard on yourself.
Originally posted by SMSBear716Bear- just do some research... see who controls the majority of the Tv and newspapers we read.
[b]Darn those one or two people who own 99% of the world's media (Talk about a conspiracy theory right there, no proof , just a theory)
You will see two or three names, who are in total control of all the media, not just in the west but the whole world.
Originally posted by epiphinehasThanks for highlighting this great set of documentries.
Thanks for the replies.
In the UK it was shown just once on BBC2 which is not the most watched channel here.
The film makers put over some excellant points which really needed to have a bigger audiance and should have been bedated more then the usual rubbish about the 'mad mullers of Islam' which most of the Press is pre-occupied with everyday.