Originally posted by epiphinehasAnd perhaps have a read of '1984'.
It is not a conspiracy theory: neo-conservatives do strive to control how you think and act. Do some research on Leo Strauss. It is no secret. They do so by inventing enemies for us to rally against (it does not matter if these 'enemies' are fictional, so long as their myth is sustained in the public imagination).
True conservatism, in my mi ...[text shortened]... to undermine personal freedom and promote big government.
Don't be too hard on yourself.
1 edit
Originally posted by epiphinehasI just would like to follow up on the bit about Christians not being involved in political affairs. Do you believe that Christians should not be involved or even vote?
As an aside, there is an interesting tid-bit in this BBC doc which has me doing some research. Apparently, before the neo-cons invaded the US churches in the late seventies and eighties, the hard-line stance of the majority of congregations was decidedly anti-political. Church members were encouraged not to vote, because doing so is tantamount to compromi ...[text shortened]... it is not proper for a Christian to take part in the political process in any way. Interesting, eh?
Just as a bit of trivia, do you know what the first Christian nation in the world was? It was Armenia which was the nation two of the apostles of Christ went to evangalize. I believe it was Thaddeus and Barthalamew. Don't get me wrong, I don't think the two apostles actively lobbied to change the government into a Christian friendly one, however, through their work to change individual lives for Christ in Armenia, they helped change the society in which they lived that gave birth to a Christian nation.
As for what type of government Christians should favor, Biblically Christians are shown a governmnet that was supposidly set up by God in the OT. Basically there was no king, there was no parliment, there was no authority figures other than judges set up to help keep law and order within society. However, as the people began to look around at the other nations around them they began to desire to be like them and asked for similar governments. They then asked God for a king to reign over them. God speaks through one of his prophets and he tells the prophet that it greives him because he considered the request an affront to them rejecting him as their king. God then gives the prophet a stern warning about the dangers of doing so and tells the prophet to warn the people as well. Despite the warning, however, the people opt for a king and God obliges them as Saul becomes the first king of Israel. You can read this warning in 1 Samuel chapter 8. It is an interesting read. Basically it is a warning of what happens when sinful men are placed in positions of authority and power over other men as we see happening today. I guess that is another reason why I favor conservatism because conservatism screams for less governmental power and greater freedoms for the common man.
As for myself, I am torn as to how politically active a Christian should be. Should there not be Christians politics just because politicians are corrupt for the most part? For me, it is kind of like saying that because there are corrupt policemen that Christians should never get into law enforcement. If we do not provide individuals who represent Christ and try to provide a little light in a very dark world, then those areas of darkness will never know the light of day. Conversely, I am also cognizant of the fact that politics has a tendency to tant those who associate themselves with it. What often then happens is that people then point to them and say that, as a result of them being tanted periodically, those of faith have no business being in politics because it provides a poor testimony to the world.
Having said all that, I lean towards the opinion that Christians should be involved in politics. The reason why is that I believe that a government should reflect those who are being governed over as well as the fact that Christians are commanded to be lights in the world. I say this with the trepidation that Christians may get tanted in the process and dragged into the mire of the ugliness of politics.
Lastly, I take issue with the notion that our laws should not be influenced by those of faith. What people argue is that Christians should have no say because they are attempting to legeislate morality and you cannot legislate morality. However, what law is there that is devoid of morality? What they are really saying is that you have no right to dictate your morality based upon your faith, however, your opponents have the right to dictate to you morality that is devoid of any faith. Somehow Godless morality is seen as a more noble stand. What exactly their morality is based upon, however, varies depending who you ask.
However, to cloud my position even further, I am not in favor of a theocracy. I do not think that man should get in the business of speaking for God, however, I do think that Christians have the obligation to lobby for the morality that God lays upon our hearts. In effect, we should all speak up for what is laid upon our hearts and thus be judged according to the condition of our hearts as will all be judged in the end.
If I have not already bored you to tears I would like to say one more thing in regards to the fight against abortion. I have noticed that the morality of a society is heavily influenced by the percieved authority of that society. For example, when slavery was legalized hundreds of years ago, the prevailing moral opinion was that slavery was "OK". However, now that it has been made illegal for hundreds of years the very idea of slavery seems repugnant to us now. Conversly, when abortion was illegal many decades ago the prevailing moral opinion was that abortion was immoral. However, now that it has been legalized for the last 30+ years the prevailing moral opinion seems to be that it too is "OK". For me, this is the perhaps the greatest motivation for fighting for what I believe to be right. The moral compass of society for generations will be effected by these decisions no matter whether we like it or not.
Originally posted by whodeyDo you believe that Christians should not be involved or even vote?
I just would like to follow up on the bit about Christians not being involved in political affairs. Do you believe that Christians should not be involved or even vote?
Just as a bit of trivia, do you know what the first Christian nation in the world was? It was Armenia which was the nation two of the apostles of Christ went to evangalize. I believe it w ...[text shortened]... y for generations will be effected by these decisions no matter whether we like it or not.
I don't believe God ever called anybody to hold political office, and anybody claiming as much has deluded themselves. It's unwise for a Christian to be involved in politics. Doing so necessarily involves compromising with a corrupt system and demands the obligatory enforcement of immoral laws (abortion, the death penalty, etc.). Christians should not place themselves in a position where they may have to enforce the will of the state rather than the will of God.
There's nothing wrong with a Christian voting for a candidate he or she trusts and likes, but I'm a firm believer in the separation of church and state. Not a single solitary peep should be heard in a church concerning politics. Neither should the congregation be encouraged by church leaders to vote. Matters of state should be left in the hands of God, at least on Sundays. Christians are supposed to be strangers in this world, keeping there eyes on heavenly things. I think that radical aspect of faith is missing nowadays.
If we do not provide individuals who represent Christ and try to provide a little light in a very dark world, then those areas of darkness will never know the light of day.
Christians, of course, don't have a monopoly on morality. There are plenty of good, honest, courageous, law-abiding, even heroic citizens who don't believe in Jesus Christ as their Savior. These types of people aren't in short supply; if bringing light into a dark world means being a just person, the world has more than enough of these.
But the light which Christians are called to bring into this world, on the contrary, is the Gospel of Jesus Christ. The Christians utmost concern should be the salvation of souls rather than the affairs of state, i.e., "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you" (Mat. 28:19-20).
I don't think it was Christ's intention to evangelize the world in order to affect government.
