Though criticizing Obama is fair, is he to indecisive?

On review, US Army Paratrooper and Generalissimo raised a point requesting specifics.

1) Obama does a good job of attempting moderation in pushing his legislation, namely willingness to drop the public option. Is this too much for his party to swallow? Will they accuse him of changing his positions depending on which way the political wind is blowing? Are they right?

2) What happened to promised troop-withdrawals? Still waiting, and it seems instead there are net troop increases. What about letting Iraq chart its own course as he implied he would do? Should we have withdrawn by now (and maybe kept a presense in Afghanistan that could reach Iraq)? Why his change of course, was it due to generals, due to polls, what?

3) What about immigration reform, will he only push it if it's the popular thing to do next year? Next year is an election year, will he actually keep an important campaign promise when he's trying to keep support for democrats during mid-term elections? If he does not, is that not proof that he changes and delays decisions?

4) His poll numbers are down and he is becoming even more populist in his rhetoric. Is this for the polls? Grandstanding and attacking executive pay for the sake of the polls? It is a tough position for him to be in, but he is certainly not taking the high road in leaving the companies to do what they know how to do (as with the generals in war), and it is likely because of the polls...

Anyone but trolls and seitses:
Opinions? Arguments?

Originally posted by eljefejesus
What happened to promised troop-withdrawals? Still waiting, and it seems instead there are net troop increases. What about letting Iraq chart its own course as he implied he would do? Should we have withdrawn by now (and maybe kept a presense in Afghanistan that could reach Iraq)? Why his change of course, was it due to generals, due to polls, what?

Obama disappoints his own supporters by holding off on troop withdrawals. He has no chance whatsoever of gaining the support of the kind of people who were incensed by his talk of troop withdrawals. So to interpret his deliberations as poll driven seems rather shallow. One can see that these are momentous decisions about virtually intractable situations, and decisions that ought not to be rushed or botched. Again, interpreting his deliberations as indecisive seems rather shallow. One could say that your four points above seem to smack of facile armchairism.

Originally posted by FMF
Obama disappoints his own supporters by holding off on troop withdrawals. He has no chance whatsoever of gaining the support of the kind of people who were incensed by his talk of troop withdrawals. So to interpret his deliberations as poll driven seems rather shallow. One can see that these are momentous decisions about virtually intractable situations, and dec ...[text shortened]... s rather shallow. One could say that your four points above seem to smack of facile armchairism.

I disagree. So long as Obama has the troops withdrawn before the 2012 election, all is well with his supporters on the left. However, in the interim he can seem to be "tough" by sending more troops in the short term which may appeal to some conservatives and or independents. In fact, I believe he plans to have the troops out of Afghanistan by the 2010 elections. If so, how convenient is that?

Originally posted by eljefejesus
On review, US Army Paratrooper and Generalissimo raised a point requesting specifics.

1) Obama does a good job of attempting moderation in pushing his legislation, namely willingness to drop the public option. Is this too much for his party to swallow? Will they accuse him of changing his positions depending on which way the political wind is blowin d it is likely because of the polls...

Anyone but trolls and seitses:
Opinions? Arguments?

1: Can you link which major polling agency you're citing? Because the latest Gallup poll (albeit almost two months old) states more Americans in favor of a public option.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/123782/In-U.S.-39-Say-View-Healthcare-Depends-Details.aspx
With respect to one of the more contentious issues being debated -- whether the plan should include a government-run insurance plan to compete with private providers (a so-called public option) -- Americans are about evenly split, with 50% in favor and 46% opposed.

Going softer on the public option is NOT following political winds, but rather, getting legislation pushed through. Remember, the militant Republicans are almost always in lockstep and they're all about filibustering anything. So it only takes about ONE Democratic retracter to kill a bill. The President doesn't write laws. One must be written and passed through congress for him to sign.

2: Obama was for troop withdraw from Iraq and troop INCREASE in Afghanistan. Both were campaign promises. Without question the announced increase in Afghanistan is keeping his promise, is it not? And base closings are already taking place in Iraq.

3: Immigration reform wasn't a huge campaign issue, was it? Obama has kept many promises in a wide range of areas.

4: His "rhettoric" has always been populist. Can you name a specific General he's not listening to?

Originally posted by eljefejesus
[Obama] is becoming even more populist in his rhetoric.

You either didn't keep an eye on his election campaign and on the thrust of his oration throught the 12 months since he won the 2008 election, or you are fibbing for shabby partisan reasons. I say you... you... and you. But I suppose I am really talking about the blog from which you all but lifted these unconvincing, gaseous talking points aimed at what some people call "dittoheads", although I myself refrain from doing so.

Originally posted by FMF
What's Quintus Fabius Maximus' screen name at www.freerepublic.com ?

Lulz!! 😵

You know the little spammer so well, FMF.

Originally posted by FMF
You either didn't keep an eye on his election campaign and on the thrust of his oration throught the 12 months since he won the 2008 election, or you are fibbing for shabby partisan reasons. I say you... you... and you. But I suppose I am really talking about the blog from which you all but lifted these unconvincing, gaseous talking points aimed at what some people call "dittoheads", although I myself refrain from doing so.

There is a wonderful marketing opportunity to create a series of bobbleheads for car and home display called Dittoheads.

Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
There is a wonderful marketing opportunity to create a series of bobbleheads for car and home display called Dittoheads.

The eyes boggle. The chin juts. Eyes, two piercing dot points. The fingers locked in an eternal Ctrl-C & Ctrl-V pattern.

Originally posted by FMF
The eyes boggle. The chin juts. Eyes, two piercing dot points. The fingers locked in an eternal Ctrl-C & Ctrl-V pattern.

Part of a range, also including 'Obama's Magic 8-Ball'. Just give it a shake and it will reveal all... 'death camps for granny', 'show me the long-form', 'best friends with terrorists'...

Originally posted by DrKF
Part of a range, also including 'Obama's Magic 8-Ball'. Just give it a shake and it will reveal all... 'death camps for granny', 'show me the long-form', 'best friends with terrorists'...

Not forgetting the popular children's range 'Secret Muslims', produced by the people that brought you 'Forest Friends'.

Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
Not forgetting the popular children's range 'Secret Muslims', produced by the people that brought you 'Forest Friends'.

......then there's that Obama Globe-Birth Certificate & Hide and Seek plus World Atlas- where one person plants some evidence and the rest of the players deduce where he was actually born.

Originally posted by eljefejesus
On review, US Army Paratrooper and Generalissimo raised a point requesting specifics.

1) Obama does a good job of attempting moderation in pushing his legislation, namely willingness to drop the public option. Is this too much for his party to swallow? Will they accuse him of changing his positions depending on which way the political wind is blowin d it is likely because of the polls...

Anyone but trolls and seitses:
Opinions? Arguments?

A major problem for any new president is that the job is an incredibly difficult one with many unique challenges to master for which no past experience can prepare you for. You have to effectively implement legions of existing and often incomprehensible laws, you have to find a way to guide significant legislation through the 3,452,879 rules that govern the legislative process. And you have to be the commander and diplomat in chief in charge of maintaining peace and prosperity all around the world. And you must do this while 300million+ armchair presidents think they can do a better job than you are doing - and half of them have blogs.

They say it takes 10,000 hours to truly master a complex set of skills. Which means that even the most diligent of presidents is probably not going to really find his or her groove until near the end of their first term.

With this in mind, this past year has probably got to be one of the most challenging first years for any US president (perhaps surpassed only by what was on the plate for Lincoln and FDR). You have an economy and financial system that was on the brink of collapse. You have a Democrat Party waiting 40 years to finally get something done on healthcare reform. You have a boatload of environmental issues (climate change only scratches the surface). You have two "wars" in the MidEast that are unlike any wars we've had in the past. And you had a fiscal outlook that was not looking good even before all the stimulus spending. And you have a nation of people thinking that the president should be able to perform miracles if only he's true to some set of principles found in someone's coloring book.

So has Obama been too "indecisive". Who wouldn't be? Anyone new president at this point who wasn't would be like one of those tone-deaf people from the early American Idol rounds who really think they're extremely talented.

Originally posted by eljefejesus
On review, US Army Paratrooper and Generalissimo raised a point requesting specifics.

1) Obama does a good job of attempting moderation in pushing his legislation, namely willingness to drop the public option. Is this too much for his party to swallow? Will they accuse him of changing his positions depending on which way the political wind is blowin ...[text shortened]... d it is likely because of the polls...

Anyone but trolls and seitses:
Opinions? Arguments?

1) Obama does a good job of attempting moderation in pushing his legislation, namely willingness to drop the public option. Is this too much for his party to swallow? Will they accuse him of changing his positions depending on which way the political wind is blowing? Are they right?

I don't think it is a matter of changing his position "depending on which way the political wind is blowing", it is a matter of compromise, there is no way a bill is going to get passed without the support of republicans and conservative democrats, not without a compromise. Not to mention of course the fact that opponents of the bill are still worried about the bill's length.
Has anyone accused Obama of such thing?

2) What happened to promised troop-withdrawals? Still waiting, and it seems instead there are net troop increases. What about letting Iraq chart its own course as he implied he would do? Should we have withdrawn by now (and maybe kept a presense in Afghanistan that could reach Iraq)? Why his change of course, was it due to generals, due to polls, what?

Obama realized it was easy to tell his supporters what they wanted to hear, but it was hard to actually accomplish what he said he'd. But it makes sense, a retreat would be pointless at this moment, and even if his original supporters don't agree with this it is the best thing to do. As for Iraq, letting it "chart its own course" could backfire, it could lead to anarchy or more conflict.
No, they should there until the place is stable, but if it doesn't work out then what can you do?

Originally posted by eljefejesus
On review, US Army Paratrooper and Generalissimo raised a point requesting specifics.

1) Obama does a good job of attempting moderation in pushing his legislation, namely willingness to drop the public option. Is this too much for his party to swallow? Will they accuse him of changing his positions depending on which way the political wind is blowin ...[text shortened]... d it is likely because of the polls...

Anyone but trolls and seitses:
Opinions? Arguments?

4) His poll numbers are down and he is becoming even more populist in his rhetoric. Is this for the polls? Grandstanding and attacking executive pay for the sake of the polls? It is a tough position for him to be in, but he is certainly not taking the high road in leaving the companies to do what they know how to do (as with the generals in war), and it is likely because of the polls...

Yes, that is correct.
"leaving the companies to do what they know how to do"? you mean being greedy? is that what you're reffering to?

Originally posted by FMF
You either didn't keep an eye on his election campaign and on the thrust of his oration throught the 12 months since he won the 2008 election, or you are fibbing for shabby partisan reasons. I say you... you... and you. But I suppose I am really talking about the blog from which you all but lifted these unconvincing, gaseous talking points aimed at what some people call "dittoheads", although I myself refrain from doing so.

But I suppose I am really talking about the blog from which you all but lifted these unconvincing, gaseous talking points

is there any actual evidence of this? or is your wild imagination and immature behavior getting in the way of good debate without childish accusations?