Originally posted by SleepyguyActually, it's interesting to note that G.W.Bush has already pardoned 157 people since he cam to office.
Clinton pardoned 140 people on his last day in office.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_pardoned_by_George_W._Bush
Some of them are listed there. Interesting bunch.
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Originally posted by Sam The ShamYou didn't quote it. Quote it... or just admit you misrepresented the OP to try to cover up the fact that you didn't know about the pardons power. The latter is crystal clear from your first three posts, unfortunately for you.
I did quote the text, the implication is obvious.
Originally posted by FMFIt makes you wonder just what the hell is going on, doesn't it? I mean why waste all the time and resources required to try and sentence these people just so the president can come along and undo it all?
Actually, it's interesting to note that G.W.Bush has already pardoned 157 people since he cam to office.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_pardoned_by_George_W._Bush
Some of them are listed there. Interesting bunch.
Clinton had 395 total of which 140 came on the last day. His pardons are here...
http://jurist.law.pitt.edu/pardons6a.htm
And his commutations are here ...
http://jurist.law.pitt.edu/pardons6b.htm
Also an interesting bunch.
Originally posted by SleepyguyGood grief. I've just been looking into it too. 465 is the figure I see for Clinton - but might include certain catagories not found in your 395. G.H.W.Bush pardoned 75 and only 12 on the last day. Presumably they were not all 'political cases' like Wienberger, McFarlane and Rich (assuming the political donation thing is true)? Presumably a lot of these cases were perceived miscarriages of justice or cases in which there were extenuating circumstances, surely? Why else? It all seems odd. As you say, It makes you wonder just what the hell is going on! As far as I know we don't have anything like that in the U.K. for an outgoing Prime Minister. As for Indonesia, there is a traditional amnesty for certain convicts granted around the time of Idul Fitri every year.
It makes you wonder just what the hell is going on, doesn't it? [...]
Clinton had 395 total of which 140 came on the last day.
Originally posted by SleepyguyIt would be interesting to do some follow up and see what these folks do after they are released.
It makes you wonder just what the hell is going on, doesn't it? I mean why waste all the time and resources required to try and sentence these people just so the president can come along and undo it all?
Clinton had 395 total of which 140 came on the last day. His pardons are here...
http://jurist.law.pitt.edu/pardons6a.htm
And his commutations are here ...
http://jurist.law.pitt.edu/pardons6b.htm
Also an interesting bunch.
Originally posted by FMFHere's a Feb 2001 NYT article on House investigations into the Clinton pardons.
Good grief. I've just been looking into it too. 465 is the figure I see for Clinton - but might include certain catagories not found in your 395. G.H.W.Bush pardoned 75 and only 12 on the last day. Presumably they were not all 'political cases' like Wienberger, McFarlane and Rich (assuming the political donation thing is true)? Presumably a lot of these cases w ...[text shortened]... a traditional amnesty for certain convicts granted around the time of Idul Fitri every year.
http://www.nytimes.com/2001/02/26/politics/26PARD.html?ex=1226552400&en=6214618226008374&ei=5070
WASHINGTON, Feb. 25 — The chairman of the House committee investigating former President Bill Clinton's pardons said today that he suspected that some of the people pardoned had used "straw donors" to make contributions to the foundation building Mr. Clinton's presidential library. He promised legal action to force release of the library's list of contributors.
The congressman, Representative Dan Burton, Republican of Indiana and chairman of the House Committee on Government Reform, stopped short of explicitly charging that anybody had broken the law, but added, "If we find that there was any quid pro quo, money for pardons, then of course that's a criminal activity and we'll pursue that."
Mr. Burton spoke in appearances on ABC's "This Week" and on "Fox News Sunday."
Of the most widely criticized pardon, that of Marc Rich, the fugitive financier, Mr. Burton told Fox News, "Well, we think there's a possibility that Marc Rich may have used conduit payments of some kind to get money into the Clinton library."
And then later in the article is this little gem.
On "This Week," former Senator Bob Kerrey, Democrat of Nebraska, criticized Mr. Burton's approach.
"He is on a very slippery slope there," Mr. Kerrey said. "Is he going to investigate every apparent quid pro quo as it comes in campaign financing? Is he going to investigate anything that doesn't pass his smell test? I mean, that is a most remarkable use of Congressional power, it seems to me."
Yeah, we can't have anyone looking into political quid pro quo for money now can we? We can't have THAT! Gimme a break. And then a few months later it all goes away, and there's Bush and Ted Kennedy shaking hands over No Child Left Behind. Bush gets his first big success in office, and the nation (and the democrats) are spared another Bill Clinton fiasco. Aaaah the spirit of bipartisanship. Our politicians suck.
Originally posted by Sam The ShamHe said no such thing. Learn how to read.
Yes thank you for the civics lesson we all know about the power of the president to pardon people but the boy was claiming that every president goes on a pardon spree at the end of their last term and lets scads of people free which is nonsense.
Try to keep up with what's being discussed.
Originally posted by steve645Yes they do, Sam. It's odd that you didn't know that. (Or maybe it's not... Sarah Palin thought Africa was a country, even while she was standing for VP, and 45% of Americans think the earth is 6,000 years old). In fact, Article II, Section 2 of the U.S. Constitution gives the president "Power to grant reprieves and pardons for offenses against the United States, except in cases of impeachment." A reprieve reduces the severity of a punishment without removing the guilt of the person reprieved. A pardon removes both punishment and guilt.
Every outgoing president usually gives presidential pardons to free criminal that were found guilty of crimes.
Originally posted by Sam The Sham
No they don't
So steve645 is right and you are wrong, Sam. But now you have just found out about this Presidential power, so it's ok.