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Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. Standard member bill718
    Enigma
    26 May '14 14:39
    It's easy to blame others such as presidents, those in congress (or parliament) for our present situation, but in looking back over the last 30 years I've noticed that 90% of the time I have been to blame for the less than desirable things that have come my way. When my bank balance is lower than I wished, it's because I overspent, when my income was less than I wanted, it's because I didn't work very hard over the last quarter, when my relationships suffered, it's normally becaude I'd been neglectful and/or rude to my friends and relatives. I've noticed this through right and left wing administrations, and regardless of who controls congress. Politicians are a pretty corrupt lot, and I don't think highly of most of them, but lost in our heated debates, is the fact that the person most responsible for our present situation is staring at us when we look in the mirror.
  2. 26 May '14 14:44
    Originally posted by bill718
    It's easy to blame others such as presidents, those in congress (or parliament) for our present situation, but in looking back over the last 30 years I've noticed that 90% of the time I have been to blame for the less than desirable things that have come my way. When my bank balance is lower than I wished, it's because I overspent, when my income was less th ...[text shortened]... erson most responsible for our present situation is staring at us when we look in the mirror.
    Gosh darn bill. You may have hope yet. Who'lda thunk it? An advocate of personal responsibility.
  3. 26 May '14 15:40
    Originally posted by normbenign
    Gosh darn bill. You may have hope yet. Who'lda thunk it? An advocate of personal responsibility.
    We're just full of surprises.
  4. 27 May '14 01:06
    Originally posted by JS357
    We're just full of surprises.
    If we are all mostly responsible for our successes and failures, then isn't it axiomatic that we are also capable of solving our own problems, and responsible for doing so.
  5. 27 May '14 01:21
    Originally posted by normbenign
    If we are all mostly responsible for our successes and failures, then isn't it axiomatic that we are also capable of solving our own problems, and responsible for doing so.
    We are each completely responsible for our lives, but we are not each entirely and equally capable of autonomous control of it. So we must engage the cooperation of others. There are various ways to do this. What we argue about is, which ways are legitimate?
  6. 27 May '14 12:14
    Originally posted by JS357
    We are each completely responsible for our lives, but we are not each entirely and equally capable of autonomous control of it. So we must engage the cooperation of others. There are various ways to do this. What we argue about is, which ways are legitimate?
    No we aren't all equal. Results may differ. I'm Ok with that.
  7. Standard member finnegan
    GENS UNA SUMUS
    27 May '14 12:41
    My personal position is fine at present. This is not thanks to my personal efforts alone or even primarily but to the incredible support I have received from unexpected and strong friends at times of crisis. from a National Health Service at a time of illness, of my wife and children at times of depression and I think you get the picture. Too many people take a smug satisfaction in their own personal good fortune, which they attribute to a combination of divine favour and personal excellence, and display a cold disregard for the impact of their own decisions on the lives of others, whose misfortunes they attribute to personal failings, a lack of divine favour and inherent deficiencies.

    The personal responsibility theme has a place - if nothing is my fault then I can only be passive in the face of life's complexity. Sure, whatever life throws at me, I take responsibility for facing that and handling it as best I can. But my ability to influence the major factors which dramatically shape my life chances is vanishingly small. Left to my own resources and without support, I would not be here today - period.

    Narcissism rules on this forum.
  8. Subscriber Wajoma
    Die Cheeseburger
    27 May '14 13:45
    Originally posted by finnegan
    My personal position is fine at present. This is not thanks to my personal efforts alone or even primarily but to the incredible support I have received from unexpected and strong friends at times of crisis. from a National Health Service at a time of illness, of my wife and children at times of depression and I think you get the picture. Too many people ta ...[text shortened]... ces and without support, I would not be here today - period.

    Narcissism rules on this forum.
    Taking your rather persoanl example of your depression and your families support. Could it be that they're getting something out of the relationship, surely it's not all one way, in effect an exchange of value for value, a voluntary exchange.
  9. 27 May '14 15:14
    Originally posted by Wajoma
    Taking your rather persoanl example of your depression and your families support. Could it be that they're getting something out of the relationship, surely it's not all one way, in effect an exchange of value for value, a voluntary exchange.
    Personal relationships are "an exchange of value for value"?

    Wow.
  10. Standard member finnegan
    GENS UNA SUMUS
    27 May '14 15:16
    Originally posted by Wajoma
    Taking your rather persoanl example of your depression and your families support. Could it be that they're getting something out of the relationship, surely it's not all one way, in effect an exchange of value for value, a voluntary exchange.
    Not one way - of course. We are social beings, not individuals, we live together and not on desert islands, we depend on each other, not on some impossible ideal of self sufficiency, we are all flawed, not models of perfection. we achieve things collectively and not alone.
  11. 27 May '14 15:58
    Originally posted by bill718
    It's easy to blame others such as presidents, those in congress (or parliament) for our present situation, but in looking back over the last 30 years I've noticed that 90% of the time I have been to blame for the less than desirable things that have come my way. When my bank balance is lower than I wished, it's because I overspent, when my income was less th ...[text shortened]... erson most responsible for our present situation is staring at us when we look in the mirror.
    It is easy to be a moron and believe that you actually have a choice when it comes to national representation. Either party you vote for is bought and paid for by the same group.

    Of course this has to do with national policy, not any individual's screwed up life.
  12. 27 May '14 16:06
    Originally posted by normbenign
    No we aren't all equal. Results may differ. I'm Ok with that.
    So am I (OK with unequal results.) A healthy society has opportunities for success and failure. Some of the greatest successes have followed failure. The process keeps us resilient and ready for challenges, as long as we stay open to innovation.

    The question is, will we as a society have a safety net that is blind to blame?
  13. 27 May '14 16:29
    Originally posted by JS357
    So am I (OK with unequal results.) A healthy society has opportunities for success and failure. Some of the greatest successes have followed failure. The process keeps us resilient and ready for challenges, as long as we stay open to innovation.

    The question is, will we as a society have a safety net that is blind to blame?
    Perhaps the irony is that the same people who keep talking about "personal responsibility" are the same people who favour an aristocratic society where failure and success are decided at birth.
  14. 27 May '14 19:17
    Originally posted by bill718
    It's easy to blame others such as presidents, those in congress (or parliament) for our present situation, but in looking back over the last 30 years I've noticed that 90% of the time I have been to blame for the less than desirable things that have come my way. When my bank balance is lower than I wished, it's because I overspent, when my income was less th ...[text shortened]... erson most responsible for our present situation is staring at us when we look in the mirror.
    Nope, it's Bush's fault.

    ....and the Kock brothers.

    We must always have a scap goat to blame don't ya know.
  15. Subscriber AThousandYoung
    Poor Filipov :,(
    27 May '14 19:20
    Originally posted by bill718
    It's easy to blame others such as presidents, those in congress (or parliament) for our present situation, but in looking back over the last 30 years I've noticed that 90% of the time I have been to blame for the less than desirable things that have come my way. When my bank balance is lower than I wished, it's because I overspent, when my income was less th ...[text shortened]... erson most responsible for our present situation is staring at us when we look in the mirror.
    So its all YOUR fault!