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Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. Standard member finnegan
    GENS UNA SUMUS
    24 Dec '14 00:13
    I've been asked to vote which is the worst and most evil corporation in the world. The choice is unavoidably debatable - but I still have trouble selecting from the short-list.

    http://paov.ca/mediamenu/alternative-news/2793-2014-award-for-worst-corporation-goes-to1419368403.html



    Chevron's three decades of oil drilling in the Ecuadorian Amazon saw the oil giant dump over 18 billion gallons of toxic wastewater into pristine rainforest -- but the company refuses to pay up the $9.5 billion it owes affected communities.

    Nestlé is stealing communities' water all over the planet for profit. Nestlé has done everything from draining drinking water in Pakistani villages to using child slavery to make chocolate. Then its CEO had the gall to claim water was not a human right.

    Sumatran orangutans are critically endangered because PepsiCo is bulldozing their homes to build massive palm oil plantations. Palm oil is also releasing billions of of tonnes of greenhouse gases into the atmosphere, fuelling climate change.

    Does Bayer hate bees? The massive chemical giant is fighting laws to ban pesticides responsible for millions of global bee deaths. If Bayer doesn’t buzz off, our tiny little pollinators could die for good -- putting the global food supply in danger.

    Monsanto is terrorizing farmers across the planet. Monsanto and its allies sued Vermont for trying to stop a new law that required genetically engineered foods be labeled, and then tried to put Guatemalan farmers behind bars for saving seeds.

    Amazon could kill small business everywhere. Amazon uses a web of shell companies to avoid paying taxes, undercuts independent retailers to drive them out of business, and uses creepy monitoring technologies to track employees’ moves.

    Suncor is the most profitable company in Canada’s tar sands, the largest industrial project on the planet. The company is wreaking havoc on First Nations communities, causing rare cancers and making animals sick.

    I want to vote against one of these. I am aware that the problem we face is not one corporation or even a list of naughty ones, but capitalism and the inherent conflict of interest between those who pursue profit and those who would like to retain a planet fit to live in. But on this forum I feel it is necessary to limit my ambitions to very immediate and obvious topics. Like some examples of corporate evil. For the more advanced of us, however, the following link is to the point.

    http://wrongkindofgreen.org/2012/03/28/sumofus-are-corporate-whores-some-of-us-are-not/
  2. Subscriber AThousandYoung
    Poor Filipov :,(
    24 Dec '14 00:59
    De Beers and Goldman Sachs are evil
  3. Subscriber Wajoma
    Die Cheeseburger
    24 Dec '14 01:18
    Originally posted by finnegan

    Then its CEO had the gall to claim water was not a human right.

    [/b]
    Might come back to the list but then might not either.

    First point. Water is not a 'right', it is a transparent fluid, a chemical compound, hydrogen and oxygen.

    A right is the sovereignty to act without the permission of others.

    So there is such a thing as water rights, and there may be some debate as to the who, when, how and why of water rights, but water itself can never be said to be a right.
  4. 24 Dec '14 01:46
    I know of the worst corporation of all, the United States Federal government.

    Without them, corporations would not even exist.......
  5. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    24 Dec '14 01:52
    Originally posted by finnegan
    I've been asked to vote which is the worst and most evil corporation in the world. The choice is unavoidably debatable - but I still have trouble selecting from the short-list.

    http://paov.ca/mediamenu/alternative-news/2793-2014-award-for-worst-corporation-goes-to1419368403.html



    [b]Chevron's
    three decades of oil drilling in the Ecuadorian Ama ...[text shortened]... int.

    http://wrongkindofgreen.org/2012/03/28/sumofus-are-corporate-whores-some-of-us-are-not/[/b]
    A corporation is a human tool; it can be no more "evil" than a hammer.
  6. Donation rwingett
    Ming the Merciless
    24 Dec '14 02:17
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    A corporation is a human tool; it can be no more "evil" than a hammer.
    It compels evil behavior and is therefore evil in its own right.
  7. 24 Dec '14 02:23
    Originally posted by finnegan
    I've been asked to vote which is the worst and most evil corporation in the world. The choice is unavoidably debatable - but I still have trouble selecting from the short-list.

    http://paov.ca/mediamenu/alternative-news/2793-2014-award-for-worst-corporation-goes-to1419368403.html



    [b]Chevron's
    three decades of oil drilling in the Ecuadorian Ama ...[text shortened]... int.

    http://wrongkindofgreen.org/2012/03/28/sumofus-are-corporate-whores-some-of-us-are-not/[/b]
    Have you ever considered that like humans corporations tend to do good and bad things?

    Even you have to admit that the worst people and corporations have some redeeming facets.
  8. 24 Dec '14 02:24
    Originally posted by rwingett
    It compels evil behavior and is therefore evil in its own right.
    Corporations compel nothing. As no1 rightly points out they are merely a tool of humans, who decide on good or evil.
  9. Donation rwingett
    Ming the Merciless
    24 Dec '14 02:46 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by normbenign
    Corporations compel nothing. As no1 rightly points out they are merely a tool of humans, who decide on good or evil.
    Corporations are not neutral instruments. They have values embedded within them that compel anti-social behavior. They are legally obligated to maximize profits of their shareholders over and above any other consideration. The values that compel profit maximization are therefore embedded within their very structure.
  10. 24 Dec '14 03:43
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    A corporation is a human tool; it can be no more "evil" than a hammer.
    Indeed, and sometimes that hammer needs to be applied to taxpayers to the tune of trillions cause they just to big to fail.

    Thanks US federal government.
  11. 24 Dec '14 03:44 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by normbenign
    Corporations compel nothing. As no1 rightly points out they are merely a tool of humans, who decide on good or evil.
    They are more tools of government....or is it vice versa?

    I guess it depends on which side of the partisan hacks you hide behind.
  12. Donation rwingett
    Ming the Merciless
    24 Dec '14 19:03
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    A corporation is a human tool; it can be no more "evil" than a hammer.
    And to pick up on the "hammer" example, technology is not neutral either. It also comes embedded with a host of values.
  13. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    24 Dec '14 19:37 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by rwingett
    Corporations are not neutral instruments. They have values embedded within them that compel anti-social behavior. They are legally obligated to maximize profits of their shareholders over and above any other consideration. The values that compel profit maximization are therefore embedded within their very structure.
    There is no such legal obligation. Corporate executives and boards of directors have wide latitude in how they conduct the business of the corporation. If they choose to do "evil" things, it is not because of the corporate form of doing business but because individuals have chosen to do "evil" things because of their own self-interest.

    EDIT: This article is helpful: http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/harold-meyerson-the-myth-of-maximizing-shareholder-value/2014/02/11/00cdfb14-9336-11e3-84e1-27626c5ef5fb_story.html
  14. Standard member finnegan
    GENS UNA SUMUS
    24 Dec '14 21:15
    You are such a philosophical bunch. Given an empirical, practical topic you immediately seek first principles, fundamental concepts, deep abstractions.

    I think Chevron are an evil bunch for spoiling an amazing environment in the selfish pursuit of profit. I think Amazon are an utterly anti social anti competitive bunch, seeking to abuse monopoly powers in an inadequately regulated marketplace. I despise Monsanto.

    Those are emotional responses not ideological, principled, theoretical abstractions. if you cannot see why these organisations are corrupted and beyond the pale then you are lost in ideology and beyond the reach of common humanity.
  15. 24 Dec '14 23:11
    GE has to be at the top of the list. These folks sold out to Obama and now pay zero federal income tax. That's right, GE is getting a free ride and all for lining the pockets of Obama.

    Oh, and did I mention they make crap?