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  1. 08 Dec '17 13:34
    http://www.tmz.com/2017/12/07/mesa-police-involved-shooting-bodycam-philip-brailsford-not-guilty-daniel-shaver/
  2. Subscriber kmax87
    You've got Kevin
    08 Dec '17 15:20
    Originally posted by @bobla45
    http://www.tmz.com/2017/12/07/mesa-police-involved-shooting-bodycam-philip-brailsford-not-guilty-daniel-shaver/
    And they found the shooter not guilty! This is absolutely insane.
  3. Standard member sonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    08 Dec '17 15:37 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by @kmax87
    And they found the shooter not guilty! This is absolutely insane.
    What is really sad is the body cam was not allowed into evidence. A travesty of so-called justice. One thing not mentioned: They were in a hotel and firing a weapon ANYWHERE at ANY angle could have hit someone else in the building. I bet THAT was never even brought up in the trial.
  4. Standard member vivify
    rain
    08 Dec '17 16:16
    I just saw the video.

    That was so brutal. To demean someone who poses no threat, and follow it up with cold-blooded murder. And this officer gets to walk, scot-free.
  5. 08 Dec '17 17:05
    Originally posted by @kmax87
    And they found the shooter not guilty! This is absolutely insane.
    Another San Fran judge and jury I assume.
  6. 08 Dec '17 19:44
    Originally posted by @whodey
    Another San Fran judge and jury I assume.
    No, this was some of Arizonas' finest.....
  7. 08 Dec '17 20:03 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by @bobla45
    No, this was some of Arizonas' finest.....
    This brings to question, is there anything that should be done to outrageous judges like this that is not being done, or do we have no recourse?

    Say, any complaints by women regarding the judge?
  8. 08 Dec '17 20:27
    Originally posted by @bobla45
    http://www.tmz.com/2017/12/07/mesa-police-involved-shooting-bodycam-philip-brailsford-not-guilty-daniel-shaver/
    That is so messed up on so many levels. That cop needs to die.
  9. Subscriber Suzianne
    Misfit Queen
    10 Dec '17 11:55
    Originally posted by @whodey
    This brings to question, is there anything that should be done to outrageous judges like this that is not being done, or do we have no recourse?

    Say, any complaints by women regarding the judge?
    Are you stupid, whodey?

    Do you really expect anyone reading this to think that you think the judge or jury did anything wrong? They are just more of your Republican heroes.
  10. Subscriber Suzianne
    Misfit Queen
    10 Dec '17 12:03
    Originally posted by @vivify
    I just saw the video.

    That was so brutal. To demean someone who poses no threat, and follow it up with cold-blooded murder. And this officer gets to walk, scot-free.
    The officer involved says that he was in fear for his life after he saw the man reaching for his waist, presumably reaching for a weapon. Experts testified that they thought what he was actually doing was reaching for his waistband, to pull up his pants, as he had been crawling along the floor at the officer's instruction. The only guns found at the scene were in the room, not in the hallway.
  11. Standard member vivify
    rain
    10 Dec '17 13:40 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by @suzianne
    The officer involved says that he was in fear for his life after he saw the man reaching for his waist, presumably reaching for a weapon. Experts testified that they thought what he was actually doing was reaching for his waistband, to pull up his pants, as he had been crawling along the floor at the officer's instruction. The only guns found at the scene were in the room, not in the hallway.
    The officer has an AR-15, with the words "you're fcked" etched into it. That gives a clear indication of the personality of this officer.

    With that in mind, look at the box the officer put Shaver in:
    ---The cop makes it quit clear that if makes one "mistake", he will be shot
    ---The other officer then yells at Shaver to "shut up".
    ---"Shut up" is followed by "we're not going to be diplomatic with you. You obey. You listen."

    Shaver:
    a) Can't speak, or he dies
    b) Must obey exactly or he dies

    The officer unnecessarily tells Shaver to start crawling. In the video, the woman with him was put in cuffs just fine. There was no reason to tell the man to start crawling. He was subdued and obedient, and officer's partner could've easily cuffed him.

    So shaver's pants apparently need to be pulled up as a result of his crawling. Shaver can't communicate this, because the officers shouted at him to "shut up". He's not allowed to communicate this. The man has an AR-15 pointed at him, and officers making it clear that his life hangs by a thread. Now, his pants need to be pulled up,and is making it difficult for him to crawl.

    What should he do?

    In that tight box created by the officers, where if he speaks, he dies, if doesn't comply exactly, he dies, and he starts having trouble moving: what does he do?

    The officer not only created an impossible situation for Shaver, but added a needless command to crawl, when Shaver was already compliant and subdued. Keep in mind that "you're fcked" is carved into the officer's semi-automatic rifle.

    The officer seems like a hot-head with a chip on his shoulder, who created an impossible and needlessly complex situation for Shaver, with needless demands that only increased the likelihood of Shaver's death.

    So while it is an understandable defense, that an officer called to arrest a man pointing a gun out of window, felt threatened that Shaver may have been reaching for a gun, this officer is still at fault for the killing of an unarmed and compliant man.
  12. Standard member vivify
    rain
    10 Dec '17 13:49 / 1 edit
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2017/12/08/graphic-video-shows-daniel-shaver-sobbing-and-begging-officer-for-his-life-before-2016-shooting/?utm_term=.c3c8843ca3f6

    The graphic video, recorded by Brailsford’s body camera, shows Shaver and the woman exiting the hotel room and immediately complying with commands from multiple officers.

    After entering the hallway, Shaver immediately puts his hands in the air and lies down on the ground while informing the officer that no one else was in the hotel room.

    “If you make a mistake, another mistake, there is a very severe possibility that you’re both going to get shot. Do you understand?” Sgt. Charles Langley yells before telling Shaver to “shut up.”

    “I’m not here to be tactical and diplomatic with you. You listen. You obey,” the officer says.

    For the next five minutes, officers give Shaver a series of instructions.

    “If you move, we’re going to consider that a threat and we are going to deal with it and you may not survive it,” Langley said.

    Shaver remains on the ground in the hallway, his hands on his head.

    Langley tells Shaver to keep his legs crossed and push himself up into a kneeling position. As Shaver pushes himself up, his legs come uncrossed, prompting the officer to scream at him.

    “I’m sorry,” Shaver says, placing his hands near his waist, prompting another round of screaming.

    “You do that again, we’re shooting you, do you understand?” Langley yells.

    “Please do not shoot me,” Shaver begs, his hands up straight in the air.

    At the officer’s command, Shaver then crawls down the hallway, sobbing. At one point, he reaches back — possibly to pull up his shorts — and Brailsford opens fire, striking Shaver five times.

    According to the police report, Brailsford was carrying an AR-15 rifle with the phrase “You’re F—ed” etched into the weapon.
  13. 11 Dec '17 00:18
    Originally posted by @vivify to Suzianne
    The officer has an AR-15, with the words "you're fcked" etched into it. That gives a clear indication of the personality of this officer.

    With that in mind, look at the box the officer put Shaver in:
    ---The cop makes it quit clear that if makes one "mistake", he will be shot
    ---The other officer then yells at Shaver to "shut up".
    ---"Shut ...[text shortened]... ching for a gun, this officer is still at fault for the killing of an unarmed and compliant man.
    "The officer has an AR-15, with the words "you're fcked" etched into it.
    That gives a clear indication of the personality of this officer."
    --Vivify

    I have seen American soldiers wearing shirts with this message:
    "Kill 'em all! Let God sort 'em out."

    Does this mean that they approve of the indiscriminate killing of civilians?
  14. Subscriber AThousandYoung
    It's only business
    14 Dec '17 15:38
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    "The officer has an AR-15, with the words "you're fcked" etched into it.
    That gives a clear indication of the personality of this officer."
    --Vivify

    I have seen American soldiers wearing shirts with this message:
    "Kill 'em all! Let God sort 'em out."

    Does this mean that they approve of the indiscriminate killing of civilians?
    Another unsourced anti American comment...
  15. 14 Dec '17 20:32 / 4 edits
    Originally posted by @athousandyoung
    Another unsourced anti American comment...
    The ignorant (at best) US 'flag-waving' AThousandYoung has a record of FALSELY
    ACCUSING me by implication of fabricating FACTS that he regards as 'anti-American'.

    Recently, AThousandYoung apparently refused to believe that there could have been a
    video game in which the player's goal was to rape (simulated on the screen) an 'Indian' woman.
    AThousandYoung wrongly insinuated that I had fabricated it.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Custer%27s_Revenge
    "His goal is to rape a naked Native American woman tied to a pole."

    "I have seen American soldiers wearing shirts with this message:
    "Kill 'em all! Let God sort 'em out." "
    --Duchess64

    Now AThousandYoung wrongly insinuates that I have fabricated the existence of
    American shirts with the slogan "Kill 'em all; Let God sort 'em out!"

    Here's one example from MilitaryClothing.com
    http://www.militaryclothing.com/ProductZoom.aspx?zpid=23456&prdImgName=

    Here's another example from Walmart:
    https://www.walmart.com/ip/Kill-Em-All-Let-God-Sort-Em-Out-Black-Ink-T-shirt/40823691

    I could easily add more examples of these shirts from other American stores.
    Contrary to AThousandYoung's attempted denial, it's easy for any interested American
    to find and purchase shirts with this slogan from many retailers in the USA.

    AThousandYoung has again FALSELY ACCUSED me by implication of fabricating FACTS
    that he regards as 'anti-American'. AThousandYoung acts like a jingoistic American troll.

    Here's some background behind the slogan "Kill 'em all; let God sort 'em out."
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caedite_eos._Novit_enim_Dominus_qui_sunt_eius.

    "Less formal English translations have given rise to variants such as "Kill them all; let God sort them out." "

    "The phrase has been adopted by members of the US military in various conflicts, such
    as the Vietnam War,[8] and is used as an UNOFFICIAL SLOGAN by certain units. In parts
    of the War on Terror, the variant "Kill them all. Let Allah sort them out," has been used."

    That confirms that this slogan is used (as I noticed) by members of the US military.