England - the solution

Originally posted by phil3000
Any decent player can control and pass the ball !!
I was doing that at 13 yrs old playing for my School team .,if you can't control and pass the ball you dont become a proffessional footballer ,simple as that !! A coach will coach you in the art of positioning ,build up your strengh and endurance . Technical skills ,stamina ,set pieces etc ,etc .
The Eng ...[text shortened]... emaining life time ( i am now 49 ) any cup coming to any Uk team ,definitly not England !!!

and why are they not good enough? you can't blame the coach because no english team has performed in a major competition since euro '96 in england and from '96 to today the pl had been one of the 3 tops leagues in europe, with very, very few english players playing abroad you'd expect better. in fact you could argue that england haven't had a good major tournament performance outside of england other than italia '90. why? germany has reached he last 8 of every world cup since 1954, why? what do they do differently?

you could blame the money and the egos but 30 years ago they weren't getting paid anywhere near as much by proportion to today and they still sucked monkey balls. and i'm sure most of the top countries have a team full of huge egos. So that one doesn’t fly either.

you say the 'home nations' could pass the ball round like spain if they wanted to, why don’t they? you say it's easy to pass the ball around and control it. for the uk and irish players it's clearly isn't and nowhere near possible to play like spain do. they just don't have the technical ability of the spainish or the germans. in england rio is considered to have the best on the ball skills for an english centre half, compare him with carvalho's technical ability for example and he looks like a donkey.

to get a true reflection of how players are going to develop you have to watch them as young teenagers, next time an under 17 tournament is on watch it and look at the way the spainish, german and brazilian players for example, pass the ball around. even at that age they’re taught to keep control of the ball, little simple passes, no long balls in hope or just kicking out of the defence that you'll see from any 'home nations' country, just watch. it does depend on the quality of the crop of players each country has that year but i assure you a few countries will show an under 17 master class of how to play the game, none of them will be a 'home nations' country if they even qualified, i guarantee it.

the uk and ireland has the money to produce the players but they have a serious lack of quality coaches and that's why they never produce the players to perform on a world stage.

Originally posted by trev33
and why are they not good enough? you can't blame the coach because no english team has performed in a major competition since euro '96 in england and from '96 to today the pl had been one of the 3 tops leagues in europe, with very, very few english players playing abroad you'd expect better. in fact you could argue that england haven't had a good major tourn ...[text shortened]... and that's why they never produce the players to perform on a world stage.

Look at Scotland in the 70's and 80's their side was on equal terms with England and made it to world cup final's .
The old first div was packed with class Scottish players and it reflected on to their national side .
Now ,with hardly any players of merit in the pl just look at the state of the Scottish side ,England are heading in the same direction .
Maybe wales under Toshack might shine the brightest ,as for Ireland they where just plain unlucky to have not made the final's !! .
Spain ,Holland ,Uraguay and Germany i dont think thay have the equivelance of cash bloated ego mad players like Rooney ,Terry ,Ashly Cole ,Gerrard ,Lampard . As i said before ,if they had kept their shape and positions like they were supposed to against Germany it would of been a different out come !. look at the way England ,only 2-1 down chased the game . Plenty of time to keep in the game ! Ended up playing like a pub team ..And you know why ? because they started to play as individuals to a man ! so full of their self importance they disregarded all of the basic principals of defence !!! You can't blame Coppello or his coaching staff for that sorry display !!
I blame the pl , and all the stupid money players receive .
2 hours after the game thay were all laughing and joking ,downing pints and smoking cigars (not all ,i might add ) Look at Ashley Cole's attitude and behaviour ! Thats what's rotten in our game and untill we weed out players like them, England will remain a laughing stock !! That means less money from the pl to the players ,and its not going to happen .
Hand on heart i dont think i will bother watching England again ,and beleive you me thats painfull ....

Originally posted by phil3000
Look at Scotland in the 70's and 80's their side was on equal terms with England and made it to world cup final's .
The old first div was packed with class Scottish players and it reflected on to their national side .
Now ,with hardly any players of merit in the pl just look at the state of the Scottish side ,England are heading in the same direction . ...[text shortened]... i dont think i will bother watching England again ,and beleive you me thats painfull ....

Very well said, phil3000. You are absolutely right!

Originally posted by phil3000
Look at Scotland in the 70's and 80's their side was on equal terms with England and made it to world cup final's .
The old first div was packed with class Scottish players and it reflected on to their national side .
Now ,with hardly any players of merit in the pl just look at the state of the Scottish side ,England are heading in the same direction . ...[text shortened]... i dont think i will bother watching England again ,and beleive you me thats painfull ....

did you even read what i wrote?

Originally posted by scacchipazzo
Here's my reasoning. Too many foreigners means fewer English playing and gaining experience. Look at how it has affected Italy's side. England has great players who do not seem to gel as a national side. It is a true enigma. Reform is needed. Perhaps a sports college like Germany has where fundamentals are taught. In my home town in Texas we have a spri ...[text shortened]... tudy how Spain does it and Brazil. I agree the talent is there, just needs to be exploited.

"England has great players who do not seem to gel as a national side."
------------------------SCACCHIPAZZO--------------------

This has been my point all along. This is what I have been saying here. The players are almost recognisable from when they are playing in their clubs. It can't be down to being surrounded by foreign players because the same phenomena seemed to be around in the 80's , before the influx of foreign players.

People seem to be saying that Gerrard et al are made to look good by the foreigners in their club teams , but I just don't buy it. Football doesn't work like that. If you are playing in a good team (which English PL clubs obviously are) then if you are not good enough you get found out.

When Ronaldo and Tevez etc were playing with Rooney in attack , did Rooney look out of place ? Did he look out of his depth? Did Tevez and Ronaldo (and Berbatov) put together these sweeping moves only to be let down by a clumsy first touch by Rooney or a bad finish or poor pass? NO. Emphatically NO.

Rooney (and with this you can include gerrard , lampard and others) looked totally on a par with the foreigners around him and not at all out of his depth. It's as simple as this - if you are not good enough you don't play for the likes of Liver, Man U or Chelsea. If you are not good enough you get found out and you look out of place. Period

The "our players are not as good as the foreign players" argument just cannot be backed up by evidence at club level.

The problem comes when they pull on that England shirt. That's the problem. All this c==p about not have the skills or being paid too much just deflects from the real problem. -> No Confidence and No teamwork.

Originally posted by trev33
and why are they not good enough? you can't blame the coach because no english team has performed in a major competition since euro '96 in england and from '96 to today the pl had been one of the 3 tops leagues in europe, with very, very few english players playing abroad you'd expect better. in fact you could argue that england haven't had a good major tourn ...[text shortened]... and that's why they never produce the players to perform on a world stage.

to get a true reflection of how players are going to develop you have to watch them as young teenagers, next time an under 17 tournament is on watch it and look at the way the spainish, german and brazilian players for example, pass the ball around.
-------trev---------------------

Correct me if I am wrong but didn't England win the U17'S this year beating Spain in the final?

Originally posted by trev33
and why are they not good enough? you can't blame the coach because no english team has performed in a major competition since euro '96 in england and from '96 to today the pl had been one of the 3 tops leagues in europe, with very, very few english players playing abroad you'd expect better. in fact you could argue that england haven't had a good major tourn ...[text shortened]... and that's why they never produce the players to perform on a world stage.

you say the 'home nations' could pass the ball round like spain if they wanted to, why don’t they? you say it's easy to pass the ball around and control it. for the uk and irish players it's clearly isn't and nowhere near possible to play like spain do. they just don't have the technical ability of the spainish or the germans.

-----------trev------------------

Correction - the germans do not pass the ball around the same way the spanish do. If you watch what the germans do it's all based around tactical knowledge and organisation , but there's no much technical trickery that our players couldn't do. Are you seriously saying that Gerrard hasn't got the touch or skill to do what Schwiensteiger does?

Originally posted by phil3000
Look at Scotland in the 70's and 80's their side was on equal terms with England and made it to world cup final's .
The old first div was packed with class Scottish players and it reflected on to their national side .
Now ,with hardly any players of merit in the pl just look at the state of the Scottish side ,England are heading in the same direction . i dont think i will bother watching England again ,and beleive you me thats painfull ....

what are you talking about , no players in th EPL, are you unaware of Darren Fletcher? James MacFadden (liberator and folk hero), hardly any players of merit, there's just two worth at least five of Englands motley crew. The only reason that England have qualified for anything is that they are a seeded team, ironic i know, had they been given the same standing as Scotland, they also would find it hard to qualify against teams like Holland, France, Italy etc.

I cannot believe there are so many threads about England in this forum, there were also other teams knocked out, why is there no Mexico threads, or Italy threads, or Japan threads, or USA threads?

Originally posted by scacchipazzo
Very well said, phil3000. You are absolutely right!

no hes not, hes talking nonsense, AGAIN

Originally posted by knightmeister
you say the 'home nations' could pass the ball round like spain if they wanted to, why don’t they? you say it's easy to pass the ball around and control it. for the uk and irish players it's clearly isn't and nowhere near possible to play like spain do. they just don't have the technical ability of the spainish or the germans.

-----------trev------- ...[text shortened]... usly saying that Gerrard hasn't got the touch or skill to do what Schwiensteiger does?

i didn't say the germans pass the ball around like the spainish, i said they have the same technical ability due to good coaching at a very young age. unlike the british and irish players.

schwiensteiger is technically a better player than gerrard yes, gerrard is a better player on certain other aspects but if i was looking for one player to play the play maker role, the one that requires the most technical ability, like alonso did for liverpoo or fabregas does for arsenal i'd be looking at schwiensteiger before gerrard. to be fair though as far as technical ability goes in english players gerrards is quite high. much better that lampard. and i'm not saying that schwiensteiger is an all round better player than gerrard, well he probably is now but at his peck i'd say gerrard was just as good if not better, it's hard to compare people of different positions.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
no hes not, hes talking nonsense, AGAIN

Listen Blobbie ,have you ever wondered why England are seeded and Scotland are not ?🙄🙄

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
what are you talking about , no players in th EPL, are you unaware of Darren Fletcher? James MacFadden (liberator and folk hero), hardly any players of merit, there's just two worth at least five of Englands motley crew. The only reason that England have qualified for anything is that they are a seeded team, ironic i know, had they been given the s ...[text shortened]... nocked out, why is there no Mexico threads, or Italy threads, or Japan threads, or USA threads?

Have you seen the title of this forum ?
It's called.... "England the solution ".. Maybe that might give you a clue to why there are so many threads about England !!!

Originally posted by phil3000
Listen Blobbie ,have you ever wondered why England are seeded and Scotland are not ?🙄🙄

it was you who made the comparison, i am only pointing out the flaw in it. hopefully you shall slip down the ranks and have to play some decent teams to qualify for a change.

Originally posted by phil3000
Have you seen the title of this forum ?
It's called.... "England the solution ".. Maybe that might give you a clue to why there are so many threads about England !!!

it was made with reference to the entire forum, not this pathetic thread. why are not the brothas from the USA also whining, USA - the solution, or Mexico - the solution, or Japan - the solution?? do you really think that England are so important? get over it Phil.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
it was made with reference to the entire forum, not this pathetic thread. why are not the brothas from the USA also whining, USA - the solution, or Mexico - the solution, or Japan - the solution?? do you really think that England are so important? get over it Phil.

I didn't start the forum robbie ..