Ah yes.
The English hordes thought they were hot favourites for Euro 08 even after their dismal performance at WC 06, and now it seems they face a huge task just to qualify, which in itself is not entirely surprising.
Even Scotland has a better chance of qualifying and I'm much more weary of playing against Scotland than I would be if Italy had to play dreary, pathetic England.
Where are all those idiots who said England is the best team in the world?
Crash and burn three lions.
Come down to Earth.
Oh yes...
WE WOZ ROBBED... REMEMBER '66
Originally posted by ASROMAThen why are England still odds on to qualify! so you can lay them on betfair if you want at odds on, or you could back Scotland at over 4/1 to qualify of course. Let me know which way you go.
Ah yes.
The English hordes thought they were hot favourites for Euro 08 even after their dismal performance at WC 06, and now it seems they face a huge task just to qualify, which in itself is not entirely surprising.
Even Scotland has a better chance of qualifying and I'm much more weary of playing against Scotland than I would be if Italy had to play ...[text shortened]... ash and burn three lions.
Come down to Earth.
Oh yes...
WE WOZ ROBBED... REMEMBER '66
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Originally posted by stevetoddWhy in the hell was England second favourites and with some bookies favourites to win the WC?
Then why are England still odds on to qualify! so you can lay them on betfair if you want at odds on, or you could back Scotland at over 4/1 to qualify of course. Let me know which way you go.
Why in God's name was England favourites to win Euro 08 AFTER the WC?
I'll tell you why...
OVERRATED.
I'm not going to bet on either Scotland or England, but I'd rather take Scotland at 4 / 1 than England at evens.
Seems like more value for money to me.
And be thankful you have such an easy group.
If you had Italy's group you would finish 4th.
As it is you guys will need the playoffs if you are to qualify.
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Originally posted by ASROMAYes I am thankful we have an 'easy group' as you phrase it although I wouldn't quite put it that way as it seems to be a bit disrespectful to the other teams to say that. We have played awfully so far, so the fact that the 'stronger teams' are absent from our group is a relief to be sure. However I would never call a player that plays for his country pathetic, have you represented your country at any sport? I personally would never be good enough at anything, through in chess I play for my town and have just been asked to play for my county (although it would involve a lot more travel and I have to discuss it with my partner, who is already negative about the time I spend on chess). I would never get anywhere near good enough to play for the national team. I'm not even sure how good the England team is at chess, I'm sure they can't be any higher in the world rankings than England is at football. Would you also call the England chess team pathetic? if so which players on the team do you reckon you could beat?
Why in the hell was England second favourites and with some bookies favourites to win the WC?
Why in God's name was England favourites to win Euro 08 AFTER the WC?
I'll tell you why...
OVERRATED.
I'm not going to bet on either Scotland or England, but I'd rather take Scotland at 4 / 1 than England at evens.
Seems like more value for money to me up you would finish 4th.
As it is you guys will need the playoffs if you are to qualify.
Originally posted by stevetoddThe difference is, I never claimed to be a God of football, whereas Steven Gerard, Frank Lampard, et al including the English public claimed they are the best and will 'bring home the cup'... Just like all the English teams before them.
Yes I am thankful we have an 'easy group' as you phrase it although I wouldn't quite put it that way as it seems to be a bit disrespectful to the other teams to say that. We have played awfully so far, so the fact that the 'sronger teams' are absent from our group is a relief to be sure. However I would never call a player that plays for his country pathet ...[text shortened]... gland chess team pathetic? if so which players on the team do you reckon you could beat?
So what's pathetic is their exaggerated sense of self-perception.
Didn't mean to offend you... Just trying to rile the die hard English supporters.
It's always fun mocking people when their team loses and I can take it as well as I give, but again didn't mean to offend.
Originally posted by ASROMAI'm sure England have had many bad results and will again, but that doesn't make them pathetic, neither does their self belief. do you imagine that you can get to the fantastic position of playing for your country without believing in yourself (this applies to all teams of all countries). I am sure Italy must have had a few bad results in their football history,maybe not recently but I'm sure you wouldn't say the whole team were pathetic (period) if they did, maybe pathetic on the night but then that actually highlights what great levels they have got to, upsets will always happen, that is the nature of sport and in fact what makes it even more interesting for me. I know it sounds strange, but I will now enjoy the England games even more because qualifying isn't guaranteed (although in my opinion still achievable)
The difference is, I never claimed to be a God of football, whereas Steven Gerard, Frank Lampard, et al including the English public claimed they are the best and will 'bring home the cup'... Just like all the English teams before them.
So what's pathetic is their exaggerated sense of self-perception.
Didn't mean to offend you... Just trying to rile the ...[text shortened]... hen their team loses and I can take it as well as I give, but again didn't mean to offend.
Originally posted by stevetoddThis isn't the reaction I anticipated or hoped for.
I'm sure England have had many bad results and will again, but that doesn't make them pathetic, neither does their self belief. do you imagine that you can get to the fantastic position of playing for your country without believing in yourself (this applies to all teams of all countries). I am sure Italy must have had a few bad results in their football hi ...[text shortened]... mes even more because qualifying isn't guaranteed (although in my opinion still achievable)
I agree with everything you say, looking at it from that angle.
In that sense they are not pathetic because of the level they (the players) have achieved .
However, I am trying to rile the die hards that posted all over these forums that England would win the WC and then even after their dismal performance, claimed they would have a big chance of winning the Euro.
Their expectations are pathetic.
However, I am trying to rile the die hards that posted all over these forums that England would win the WC and then even after their dismal performance, claimed they would have a big chance of winning the Euro.And from what I heard England wasn´t even close yesterday. Apparently they were defending themselves pretty much all the game, espceially the first half.
Their expectations are pathetic.[/b]
Originally posted by marinvilleThey were largely impotent.
And from what I heard England wasn´t even close yesterday. Apparently they were defending themselves pretty much all the game, espceially the first half.
You heard correct.
And Paul Robinson had a great game save his horrendous blunders that led both goals!
Originally posted by marinvilleNo they were awful, they were clearly second best, it certainly wasn't the case of being better but unlucky. Their was an awful lot of discussion about the manager's choice of formation before the game, saying it was a big mistake, and obvioulsy even more (and harsher afterwards). I'm just hoping that this will be a wake up call for them, as there is no margin for error now, I would have been content with a draw but drawing with Macadonia was a big disaster too, so it's 3 points dropped and also an extra 2 points to Croatia. We don't want to be hoping that Croatia beat Russia etc. it would be better to keep our destiny in our own hands, so the games against Russia have now become huge
And from what I heard England wasn´t even close yesterday. Apparently they were defending themselves pretty much all the game, espceially the first half.
Originally posted by stevetoddAn example of what I was saying:
No they were awful, they were clearly second best, it certainly wasn't the case of being better but unlucky. Their was an awful lot of discussion about the manager's choice of formation before the game, saying it was a big mistake, and obvioulsy even more (and harsher afterwards). I'm just hoping that this will be a wake up call for them, as there is no ma ...[text shortened]... tter to keep our destiny in our own hands, so the games against Russia have now become huge
SHAMBOLIC ENGLAND PAY THE PRICE
By Frank Malley, PA Chief Sports Writer
Embarrassing is not the word for England's 2-0 defeat against Croatia.
Humiliating is nearer. But perhaps shambolic sums it up best of all.
And not just because goalkeeper Paul Robinson made a complete hash of a back pass from Gary Neville to gift Croatia their second goal with a right-foot slash which was not unlike the air shot of a hacker on the first tee on a Saturday morning.
England fans squirmed at that catastrophe. But that was a fluke, the ball taking a dreadful bobble over Robinson's foot as he attempted to clear.
It was manager Steve McClaren, however, who deserved to be squirming as he sat in the England dug-out and watched his 3-5-2 gamble backfire in front of his eyes.
European Championship qualifiers are no place to experiment. That was something even Sven-Goran Eriksson understood.
It is something McClaren, whose tinkering has been not dissimilar to a schoolboy with a new chemistry set in the past few weeks, has learned to his cost.
Welcome to the real world, Steve. The world where the England manager is responsible for results and in which he has to be able to justify his selections.
It will take all his powers of public relation to explain away this defeat.
'Stand up and be counted', had been the rallying call from England captain John Terry following the disappointment of the goalless draw against Macedonia at Old Trafford.
'Pride, passion, attitude, character', had been the demand from McClaren.
The fact is this defeat had nothing to do with work ethic. Everything to do with McClaren's meddling.
McClaren had insisted the 3-5-2 formation would allow his team to move the ball with more fluidity from back to front.
The need for that was understandable after his team had squandered possession so readily at Old Trafford on Saturday.
But football systems only work if they create balance and confidence. And that could not be said for England's performance against Croatia.
Instead, McClaren's 3-5-2 created uncertainty and, at times, downright panic at the back.
Gary Neville, so accustomed to the favoured back four at Manchester United and a defender renowned for his composure, looked like a man not entirely at ease with the wing back role.
Jamie Carragher too often demonstrated why he is not the most precise distributor in the world.
Even the normally rock-solid Terry struggled, exposed too often out wide on the edge of the central three when his worth to England is surely as a guardian of the six-yard box.
Defensively the new system was a hotch-potch. And ultimately that is down to the manager.
McClaren had insisted it was not a gamble. He maintained it had been practised sufficiently and that world-class players should be able to slot into any formation.
Essentially that is right. But even top professionals have comfort zones and too many of McClaren's team looked distinctly uncomfortable.
It should be said that Croatia are a fine side, a step up in class from Macedonia.
But when their opening goal came it was again down to confusion in England's defence, the cross coming over and Eduardo da Silva getting between Ashley Cole and Terry to loop the header over Robinson.
And, if we are honest, Croatia could have scored four or five as the England belief evaporated.
There is the rub. England were well beaten. Dumped by a side to whom they should have paid more respect than arrive in experimental mode.
McClaren must take a huge share of the blame for that and now has five months to fret before the next competitive fixture.
Come to think, embarrassing does sum it up after all.
Originally posted by ASROMADon't worry, England are just toying with you foreign gits - when they start you better look out.
Ah yes.
The English hordes thought they were hot favourites for Euro 08 even after their dismal performance at WC 06, and now it seems they face a huge task just to qualify, which in itself is not entirely surprising.
Even Scotland has a better chance of qualifying and I'm much more weary of playing against Scotland than I would be if Italy had to play ...[text shortened]... ash and burn three lions.
Come down to Earth.
Oh yes...
WE WOZ ROBBED... REMEMBER '66
INGERLUND FOR THE CUP
JOCKLAND TO FAIL MISERABLY haha.
ITALY - hah forget it.