Abolish Women's Chess Titles

The post that was quoted here has been removed

As far as I know, the United Negro College is not acting to exclude students of other nationalities from attending college. I have no issue with them.

HBCUs no longer are allowed to be segregated, or exclude students on the basis of race. Brown vs. the Board of Education put a stop to that. As long as they abide by this ruling, I have no problem with HBCUs.

http://www.ed.gov/about/inits/list/whhbcu/edlite-index.html

HBCUs offer all students, regardless of race, an opportunity to develop their skills and talents.
(emphasis added)

Neither of these institutions are doing what Ashley was doing at those tournaments - excluding members of other races from participating.

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If, by "all-Jewish", you mean ethnically Jewish, then yes, I am opposed in principle to such a tournament.

Originally posted by Wulebgr
I'm sorry, but FOX is not news, and on this point, as with most, they are wrong.

sorry, don't watch Fox.

And as for talking about the "How can I know if they deserve it think" I was actually quoting one of the Female-Asians from my ethics class at UW. SHE felt that affirmative action DIMINISHED her accomplishments, that SHE would never know if she truly deserved to get where she was because of affirmative action.

The funniest part is, despite how this may rub off the wrong way, I actually do see women as equal. In my local chess district we had a few women play, and they did well. Not "well for a girl," they legitimately did well. And not surprisingly: they were smart, they focused, and they studied just as much as everyone else.

I personally feel that people fall behind the "I am disadvantaged" flag MUCH too easily, when they are capable of so much more.

Originally posted by Wulebgr
When my ten year old niece told me a racist joke at Easter 2009 I knew that racism is alive and well even among my relatives.

I hate referencing movies, but have you seen Gran Torino? Perhaps, in terms of language, one of the most racially appalling movies produced recently. However, notice how the "racist" lays down his life for someone he spent the whole movie insulting. Notice how despite what he did, it was his actions that showed true character.

Personally, I look forward to the day where we can cut all this "politically correct" B.S. and be judged by what we do rather than what we say.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
....the measly money that ladies earn in tournaments, would be all but gone if ladies tournaments were abolished, providing even less incentive for young women to take up the sport.....

Until this can be fixed. Women's chess, and women's titles must remain.

From Robbie Corrobie: "but that besides, isn't she adorable?"

Forget that she is a world chess champ, forget she has an opinion on a subject to do with womens chess...just notice how she looks.

From c guy1"cut all this "politically correct" B.S. and be judged by what we do rather than what we say."

What we say is an important part of what we do....although I agree we can go overboard with being PC and miss the point.

[From Wulbgr: "Not so. In fact, women's titles are roughly similar to affirmative action as it
is designed to work in the US to assist historically and systemically disadvantaged
groups--women and racial minorities."

They may be similar to affirmative action but I'm wary of lumping different issues together. We
run the risk of obfuscating the issue about the WGM title and trivializing racism. As I said
- "in this instance" - it doesn't work for me. There are of course parallels to be drawn
especially if you consider the history. So although the WGM title may be a finer point in the
wider scheme of gender equality considerations - what harm does it do and who has a problem
with it (the WGM title)...very different to racism.

Originally posted by Mahout
[b]From Robbie Corrobie: "but that besides, isn't she adorable?"

Forget that she is a world chess champ, forget she has an opinion on a subject to do with womens chess...just notice how she looks.

From c guy1"cut all this "politically correct" B.S. and be judged by what we do rather than what we say."

What we say is an important part of wh s it do and who has a problem
with it (the WGM title)...very different to racism.[/b]

actually the post was meant to add some weight to the argument on the basis of the fact that she is women's world chess champion, but perhaps in your ardour to incriminate me in some sexist plot, you failed to notice that. Secondly, i like the sound of her voice, which to me is the most appealing part of her persona! such a lyrical, softly spoken, beautiful Russian lilt, has nothing to do with how she looks, but you didn't know that, right.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
actually the post was meant to add some weight to the argument on the basis of the fact that she is women's world chess champion, but perhaps in your ardour to incriminate me in some sexist plot, you failed to notice that. Secondly, i like the sound of her voice, which to me is the most appealing part of her persona! such a lyrical, softly spoken, beautiful Russian lilt, has nothing to do with how she looks, but you didn't know that, right.

It started out as a weighty bit of single malt support then you threw in your saccharin, coco cola,
adorable comment and spoiled it. A full stop between the two topics wouldn't have gone
amiss.

Sexist? Nothing wrong with finding someone attractive for how they look - or sound. Dream on.

Originally posted by Mahout
It started out as a weighty bit of single malt support then you threw in your saccharin, coco cola,
adorable comment and spoiled it. A full stop between the two topics wouldn't have gone
amiss.

Sexist? Nothing wrong with finding someone attractive for how they look - or sound. Dream on.

i drink my single malt with an ice cube, preferably from distilled or natural spring water so that its flavour may permeate the palate unhindered from contaminations and the heavy metals found in tap water 🙂 never the less, i shall refrain from spamming the forum with my desires forever more!

The post that was quoted here has been removed

Please read more carefully (although I fully respect that you may be multilingual and that English may be a second language for you).

My objection was to the word "likely", not to the claim that racism exists anywhere. I define "likely" as "more often than not". Of course racism exists everywhere, and in a free society where free speech is protected, people will say stupid things, as is their right. There will also always be racist imagery, under the aegis of free expression, but that hardly serves as in indication of degree.

When you and I share the observations of our friends, what we share says as much (and probably more) about our friends and their particular environments than it does about the topic. There are approximately 250 million+ people in the US, and the use of the word "likely" groups more than half of them on the ugly side of the issue.

That's pretty inaccurate. It is a mistake to make aggregate assumptions about a large group of people like that based on "reported observations" of a tiny fraction of those millions. It would be just as bad as me saying that "Palestinians are likely to (insert some silly claim here)". Racism exists because we have a human tendency to generalize beyond the individual to groups of people, and I would just encourage you to visit and make your own decision on the matter.

Unless your reported observations included the vast majority of the US population, you are making assumptions about most of them.

I am certain you will feel compelled to disagree with me, and post as such, which is perfectly fine in my book. I will let it stand, and go back to posting on chess, and I apologize for this parenthetic posting to all my friends who just want to play and talk chess.

Paul

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Originally posted by Duchess64
Unfortunately, ... [1049 words later] ... civility.

Does anyone read posts that long? My eyes tend to glaze over after the first couple of paragraphs.

Originally posted by greenpawn34
Still not enough women actually taking part in this debate.

Perhaps we should have separate forums for women posters? 😉