Castling

Originally posted by tomtom232
Oh yes of course! you didn't know?

You can castle *any* piece standing on e1 and {h1 or a1} (or for black e8 and {h8 or a8}) if neither has been moved in the game.

Originally posted by greenpawn34
[b]The Korchnoi story.
Originally posted by DawgHaus on the 26th June 2009

In the 21st game of the 1974 Karpov-Korchnoi match,
Karpov's 17th move Bxd5 attacked Korchnoi's R on h1.
If he moved the Rook that allowed Nf3+ winning the Q
(as would recapturing the B).

Korchnoi asked the arbiter if it was legal to castle with the Rook ...[text shortened]... 16. Bxg5 Qxg5 17. Qxg5 Bxd5 18. O-O Bxc4 19. f4 1-0 [/pgn]
The End[/b]

Presumably Korchnoi didn't actually approach the arbiter before his 18th move though? I'm guessing it was before he played Nxh7 forseeing the line and wanting to make sure he wasn't about to play a losing combo

You will find the official FIDE wording of the laws in their website : -
http://www.fide.com/component/handbook/?id=32&view=category:

Then Left-Click on 'E.1.01A Laws of Chess'

I have Robert Byrne's book on the 1974 match.
He makes no mention of the Korchnoi incident.
But it did happen, Korchnoi admits it

http://chessvault.com/tags/players/korchnoi/

On the castling question I find it amazing that so many beginner books
do not state all the caslting and uncastling options.

You rarely see this one mentioned.

White to play



1.e8=Rook



The King has not moved, the Rook has not moved. so....



White can castle

Originally posted by greenpawn34
I have Robert Byrne's book on the 1974 match.
He makes no mention of the Korchnoi incident.
But it did happen, Korchnoi admits it

http://chessvault.com/tags/players/korchnoi/

On the castling question I find it amazing that so many beginner books
do not state all the caslting and uncastling options.

You rarely see this one mentioned.

White ...[text shortened]... the Rook has not moved. so....

[fen]8/8/8/8/8/4K3/4R3/8 w - - 0 1[/fen]

White can castle

Not anymore. FIDE laws of chess 3.8 read now as follows:

... or by ‘castling’. This is a move of the king and either rook of the same colour along the player’s first rank

But FIDE laws are for FIDE tournaments only.

The Rotherham Rules and laws of chess drawn up by Staunton,
(the day after he designed the chess pieces we all use).
The laws were sanctioned by Morphy, Steinitz and Griswald and are
infact the true rules of the game of chess.

FIDE do not recognise,

Huffing (if a piece is attacked and your opponent does not take
it then you can insist that they do. known in other circles as
The Morphy clause).

Castling with anything except pawns and uncaslting.

The ancient rule of 'QUITS' is no longer applied.

QUITS: If a pawn reached the 8th rank then the game was stopped
and is then replayed without Rooks. (a silly rule, glad they got rid of it).

Originally posted by greenpawn34
I have Robert Byrne's book on the 1974 match.
He makes no mention of the Korchnoi incident.
But it did happen, Korchnoi admits it

I know it happened GP but the question is when? It seems unlikely to me that Korchnoi would have gone in for the combination without knowing he could castle at the end of it. Maybe not but I still think it's more likely he asked the arbiter about the castleing move much earlier in the game - having foreseen he would need to castle to win/not lose.

JB that is a good question.

Actually at what point in the game did Korchnoi ask about castling?

A Google search reveals all kinds of nonsense.

Some state Korchnoi was caslting Queenside.

Most of the other leads take you too forums like this and they
drift all over the place without anyone even asking when.

Sure Winter would know but could not see anything but have only
scanned for a few minutes.

There is an interersting side story which may back up Korchnoi's
point about the rules being unclear in Russia

Purdy v Averbach

(Joke there - she has gone - will you Averbach?)

Purdy Castled....

Black castled queenside, and Averbakh pointed out that the rook
passed over a square controlled by White, so it was illegal.

Purdy proved that the castling was legal since this applies only to the king,

to which Averbakh replied "Only the king? Not the rook?"

and here is the game in question.

Averbach fixes Purdy's pawn on the same colour as his Bishop
thus making it a good Bishop v Bad Bishop endgame. (and the extra Pawn).

It would have been good if Averbach had lost basing his strategy
on Black not being able to 0-0-0.


Averbach - Purdy Adelaide, 1960

Originally posted by greenpawn34
But FIDE laws are for FIDE tournaments only.

The Rotherham Rules and laws of chess drawn up by Staunton,
(the day after he designed the chess pieces we all use).
The laws were sanctioned by Morphy, Steinitz and Griswald and are
infact the true rules of the game of chess.

FIDE do not recognise,

[b]Huffing (if a piece is attacked and your ...[text shortened]... game was stopped
and is then replayed without Rooks. (a silly rule, glad they got rid of it).[/b]

I don't know of any chess club in my country that would accept exceptions to the FIDE laws for rated games. Perhaps we are not as nostalgic as you are 😉

when Korchnoi asked the arbiter about whether O-O with rook under attack was legal, shouldn't the arbiter have said "It's your responsibility to know the rules. Make the move and then I'll let you know if it was illegal".?

Korchnoi would then have "risked" being forced to move his king (and lose his rook) if he was "wrong" about the rule.

That is plenty stupid to tell him he should know the rules, just explain the rules and answer the question...
We can't be always sure.

Originally posted by AudreyxSophie
That is plenty stupid to tell him he should know the rules, just explain the rules and answer the question...
We can't be always sure.

what do you mean we can't always be sure? -- there's an official set of rules - if you enter a tournament, it is your responsibility to know them.

It's kind of funny that someone of Korchnoi's level didn't know them.

As has been point out - it seems the Russian version of the
rules were not clear. Both Korchnoi and Averbach were caught out.

edit: damn you greenpawn for being quicker

Originally posted by pijun
edit: damn you greenpawn for being quicker

A whole 26 hours 53 mins quicker.