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  1. 01 Oct '09 13:33
    What would you class as cheating & how would you know if someone was cheating you? I've read a few of the other threads & judging by some of the comments it seems that some people use books & anlaysis programs whilst playing!! Is this not classed as cheating because its what I would class it as really! I'm not pointing the finger at anyone in particular but I'm just curious to know what is acceptable & what is not? I personally wouldn't use a book or anything else to help me in a game as I dont think its in the spirit of the game & I wouldn't class it as win for me if it ended up so!

    Cheers Jay
  2. Standard member gambit05
    Mad Murdock
    01 Oct '09 13:45
    From Terms of Service

    3b) While a game is in progress you may not refer to chess engines, chess computers or be assisted by a third party. Endgame tablebases may not be consulted during play but you may reference books, databases consisting of previously played games between human players, and other pre-existing research materials.
  3. 01 Oct '09 13:45 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by JayDoherty
    What would you class as cheating & how would you know if someone was cheating you? I've read a few of the other threads & judging by some of the comments it seems that some people use books & anlaysis programs whilst playing!! Is this not classed as cheating because its what I would class it as really! I'm not pointing the finger at anyone in particular b he spirit of the game & I wouldn't class it as win for me if it ended up so!

    Cheers Jay
    Always start with the basics. Item 3(b) of the Terms Of Service states:

    (b) While a game is in progress you may not refer to chess engines, chess computers or be assisted by a third party. Endgame tablebases may not be consulted during play but you may reference books, databases consisting of previously played games between human players, and other pre-existing research materials.

    Edit: There's always someone faster.
  4. 01 Oct '09 13:52
    Allowed to consult:
    Books, magazines, opening databases, pets, household plants, babies.

    Not allowed to consult:
    Computer engines, endgame tablebases, Internet message boards, your roommate, Toddlers with FIDE ratings, college athletes, space aliens, that guy who plays chess in the park, people in general

    Gray areas:
    Toddlers without FIDE ratings, members of congress, Koko the sign-language-using gorilla, hosts of The View, people who plays the Grob.
  5. Standard member wormwood
    If Theres Hell Below
    01 Oct '09 13:56
    Originally posted by JayDoherty
    What would you class as cheating & how would you know if someone was cheating you? I've read a few of the other threads & judging by some of the comments it seems that some people use books & anlaysis programs whilst playing!! Is this not classed as cheating because its what I would class it as really! I'm not pointing the finger at anyone in particular b ...[text shortened]... he spirit of the game & I wouldn't class it as win for me if it ended up so!

    Cheers Jay
    in the words of the long gone bowmann: "learn the rules."
  6. 01 Oct '09 14:12
    Thanks for that guys. I obviously haven't read the rules!!
    Just as an aside, why is consulting books & databases deemed acceptable?
  7. Standard member wormwood
    If Theres Hell Below
    01 Oct '09 14:36
    Originally posted by JayDoherty
    Thanks for that guys. I obviously haven't read the rules!!
    Just as an aside, why is consulting books & databases deemed acceptable?
    because it's correspondence chess we play here. a single game can last years, not to mention that everybody has numerous games going on at any given moment. it wouldn't be very reasonable to require people not to study chess for as long as they play chess.
  8. 01 Oct '09 17:21
    Fair enough Wormwood, I know its a big ask for folk not to read any chess books at all whilst playing CC, its not quite what I meant though. I just got the impression that people look into database programes & books for the games they are involved in whilst playing them, which doesn't sit quite right with me as far as my game goes. Thats just my personal opinion.
    I think calling it cheating was perhaps rather a strong way to put it accross & I appologise to anyone that has took offence.
  9. Standard member Phlabibit
    Mystic Meg
    01 Oct '09 19:12
    Originally posted by JayDoherty
    Fair enough Wormwood, I know its a big ask for folk not to read any chess books at all whilst playing CC, its not quite what I meant though. I just got the impression that people look into database programes & books for the games they are involved in whilst playing them, which doesn't sit quite right with me as far as my game goes. Thats just my personal ...[text shortened]... s perhaps rather a strong way to put it accross & I appologise to anyone that has took offence.
    I used to think like you do... but now I occasionally pop a book to learn up on a position (if it exists at all). Remember, if you don't want someone else using a book get out of book quickly. if you're not using a book, you're probably out of known positions easy by move 7 if not sooner.

    It's not as huge a help as some users think, you need to be in a book position to benefit from using a book.

    keep in mind when I say book, I also mean databases you can serch.

    Don't confuse book and data with tablebase that solve positions using an engine, that IS cheating and can be used from most any position in any game.

    P-
  10. Standard member wormwood
    If Theres Hell Below
    01 Oct '09 19:19
    Originally posted by JayDoherty
    I just got the impression that people look into database programes & books for the games they are involved in whilst playing them, which doesn't sit quite right with me as far as my game goes.
    well then you got the right impression.
  11. Subscriber Paul Leggett
    Chess Librarian
    04 Oct '09 01:34
    Originally posted by wormwood
    well then you got the right impression.
    This may sound funny, but I WISH my opponents would use more databases and books, in that I am using the site to increase my understanding of certain openings, and I would like to test certain opening ideas and investigate various thematic middlegames.

    I play plenty of OTB clock chess at my club, and I can always go to the blitz site for clock games (I like the 10 minutes/5 second default setting). Correspondence chess is a different animal, and I treat it like my chess laboratory. To each his own, I suppose!

    Paul
  12. 04 Oct '09 02:34
    You can set up positions from openings that you are interested in.
    Somebody somewhere will pick it up (unless you give them a Black
    Caro Kann).
  13. 04 Oct '09 03:44
    I pick up black caro-kann, unless it is losing or really bad.
  14. 04 Oct '09 04:36
    Originally posted by JayDoherty
    What would you class as cheating & how would you know if someone was cheating you? I've read a few of the other threads & judging by some of the comments it seems that some people use books & anlaysis programs whilst playing!! Is this not classed as cheating because its what I would class it as really! I'm not pointing the finger at anyone in particular b ...[text shortened]... he spirit of the game & I wouldn't class it as win for me if it ended up so!

    Cheers Jay
    I never considered books as cheating, but engines... I still don't get the fun in that (i.e., being the person that uses them to cheat--must be boring, IMHO).
  15. Standard member orion25
    Art is hard
    04 Oct '09 08:23
    I'll pick up the Caro-Kann either. Yay for the Caro-Kann!